NinjaNick
Needs a job
'08 ZX14 (Blue)
Posts: 4558
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posted December 12, 2007 08:19 PM
quote:
maybe he already wiped out the big beast
*tisk, tisk....STEVE...shame on you buddy.*
  
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busajack5
Expert Class
Rocket lll
Posts: 173
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posted December 12, 2007 08:29 PM
http://www.dragtimes.com/video-viewer.php?v=hwXiqpQnmKg --Hey Lietoome watch this.
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Jack
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BlackMagic14
Needs a job
Posts: 2058
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posted December 12, 2007 10:00 PM
I am probably gonna get blackballed for this but I think the 14 in stock form is a pussycat... it is the easiest bike to ride I have ever come across this bike is a marvel of modern egineering and any resposible ADULT!!!! can somewhat safely ride a 14 as their first bike! I am going to try to find this article i read a few months back that a guy from MIT wrote about how the weight of a person in relationship to the weight of a motorcycle changes the handling charectersistics of a bike and can make it unsafe, the basic jist of the article was that a 300 pound guy perched atop a 400 pound motorcycle has some problems in the physics of turning and cornering that the same person would not have on a 500 pound bike all though it was a very boring read it made a lot of sense to me and changed the way I ride my zx10's, his biggest point was the difference of that much weight being so high above the natural center of gravity that it goes past the point where most tires are designed to work properly. If I can find it again I will psot a link
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lietoome
Needs a job
Posts: 2033
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posted December 12, 2007 10:14 PM
Jack, I cant see the video, Army has the video blocked. All I can tell is that its a Rocket 3 by the title. What am I missing?
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Sticks_n_Stones
Needs a job
Posts: 3930
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posted December 13, 2007 06:08 AM
 Edited By: Sticks_n_Stones on 13 Dec 2007 06:25
Lietoome: its just a pic of a factory tricked out? or aftermarket tricked out Rocket III. You know, the kind of bike that if your typical Harley pulled up next to it at a stoplight, the Harley rider would feel so insecure about his bike he ~gulp~ wouldnt even blip his throttle every 10 seconds.  maybe wouldnt I should say--- unless the bikes do that on there own? lol
As far as that study? I can comment from experience on that. Its completely false about the tires traction being "overwhelmed". There is only 2 problems with having the extra weight on the tires: They warm up faster, which on a track or extended backroad shenanigans leads to overheating of the tires, and they wear faster, but not THAT much faster. Other than that, I can tell you I've been able to maintain traction where lighter rider/bike combo's with same tires as me had traction issues, especially on dirty roads, and I never even noticed.
I do have to admit the center of balance on lighter bikes with guys my size is AFU. Makes slow speed driving a pain in the ass, and hard braking is a chore when it shouldnt be. BUT: I can absolutely throw a bike around, even the 14, with ease, transition to transition. And I've encountered numerous times this year on the 14 where I should have high sided but when the snap came I was able to catch it between my legs and keep going. Damn stock tires... but being 320 when fully suited out the 14 isnt that much heavier, just have to keep real lose on it in the corners until I get some 2CT's on it 
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'06 zx14
Muzzy M10/M14
PCIII w/ Muzzy map
Flies out K&N in!
bits n pieces...
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BlackMagic14
Needs a job
Posts: 2058
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posted December 13, 2007 08:33 AM
it is not a traction issue with the tires it is the fact that the higher center of gravity causes a top heavy bike and rider to ride the edge of the tire sooner, I cant find the article but he has a pretty cool little diagram that demonstrates what he is saying, I myself have never had any problems with either of my 10's on the road or the track but it did make me go hummmm
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Sticks_n_Stones
Needs a job
Posts: 3930
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posted December 13, 2007 09:42 AM
lol its actually backwards if the bike is ridden right. By leaning off the bike- and I mean sliding your whole body off, not sticking out your knee like the squids do- anyways, by leaning off the bike you actually enable the bike to stay MORE upright, which is inherently more stable and way way less prone to lowsiding. I can get my TLR down so low that it runs out of tread, but I dont need to. Normally, my hard riding wear pattern shows about a 1/2" chicken stripe if I'm leaning off the bike. Yet the guys I'm following, and following me, are all the way over on there R6's and 636's scraping pegs. The farther I offset my weight from centerline the less lean required. I can actually go around fairly fast turns by leaning WAY off the bike with barely any lean at all lol. Looks goofy though.
OK I'm done trying to convince you all to gain weight now. lol Just don't use weight as an excuse for not riding the 'rails' with your friends, because it all evens out in the end. On the street, of course. Have yet to see a Moto GP rider weighing 300 pounds 
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'06 zx14
Muzzy M10/M14
PCIII w/ Muzzy map
Flies out K&N in!
bits n pieces...
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ghostman
Expert Class
Posts: 456
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posted December 13, 2007 10:35 AM
Edited By: ghostman on 13 Dec 2007 10:37
"Have yet to see a Moto GP rider weighing 300 pounds"
Who wants to be my sponsor!?! 
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I'm There Whether You See Me Or Not.
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stevewfl
Moderator
Posts: 27920
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posted December 13, 2007 10:38 AM
increase in weight = decrease in corner speed. whether the weight is rider, bike or both.
thats why all the millions in research to lighten the litre bikes. weight is more important than horsepower regarding lower lap times, higher corner speeds and total braking distance.
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2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
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Tool Man
Needs a job
Posts: 4493
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posted December 13, 2007 10:51 AM
quote:
"Have yet to see a Moto GP rider weighing 300 pounds"
So much for that job 
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The banks are failing..
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busajack5
Expert Class
Rocket lll
Posts: 173
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posted December 13, 2007 11:34 AM
http://www.dragtimes.com/video-viewer.php?v=hwXiqpQnmKg Lietoome,ill try it again but iam not good at this. Shame cause its fun.. Jack
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Jack
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busajack5
Expert Class
Rocket lll
Posts: 173
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posted December 13, 2007 11:43 AM
 Oh hell just tell him to get one of these..TEHE
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Jack
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Sticks_n_Stones
Needs a job
Posts: 3930
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posted December 13, 2007 11:50 AM
Anybody from Canada/Washington State area want to put that "a lighter bike/rider combo is always gonna be faster in the twisties" theory to the test? I know some excellent roads and we can bet dinner and drinks. You will even have the advantage of being faster in the straights, too, because my extra tonnage kills acceleration, and increases braking distances for sure. I can promise you, though, that on the roads I have in mind there will be very little 'upright' riding 
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'06 zx14
Muzzy M10/M14
PCIII w/ Muzzy map
Flies out K&N in!
bits n pieces...
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BlackMagic14
Needs a job
Posts: 2058
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posted December 13, 2007 01:54 PM
Equal skill the lighter rider will always be faster!!! THe physics dont lie, but SnS I think you are saying you are faster then most people. but my point and I think steves point is that if YOU lost 150 pounds you would be quite a bit faster!!!
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lietoome
Needs a job
Posts: 2033
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posted December 13, 2007 02:37 PM
fellas, its not the links or vids, its my connection. I'm overseas and the Army doesn't want me looking at BOOBIES, so they black 99% of all videos and pics.
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Go Hogs Go
Parking Attendant
Posts: 7
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posted December 13, 2007 08:18 PM
Thanks everyone for all the input. Sorry I haven't checked in; I've been traveling for work and didn't have internet access.
I haven't made up my mind yet as to what I will get. I am going to complete the class in January and see where to go from there. The class is on Buell Blast 500's - I hope I fit.
I looked at a '99 ZX-9R that was immaculate a couple weeks ago, but it was still a little small-framed and too racy for my taste and talent level (it was hopped up quite a bit). My buddy that's an experienced rider said it was a great bike, just not the one for me.
I always liked the ZX-11/12 series and the Honda Blackbird in that they were big, sport-style bikes that were street-able and not as radical a layout as a GSXR, ZX-10, etc. I want a sport-style bike that is relatively comfortable for local riding. I don't want a race replica that you have to thrash to enjoy. I'm sure I'll have more questions and will keep everyone posted.
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stevewfl
Moderator
Posts: 27920
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posted December 13, 2007 09:56 PM
quote:
I looked at a '99 ZX-9R that was immaculate a couple weeks ago, but it was still a little small-framed and too racy for my taste
I so miss my ZX9R !!!
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2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
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Sticks_n_Stones
Needs a job
Posts: 3930
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posted December 14, 2007 06:33 AM
I recall the ZX9 as being a bigger bike, akin to my TLR just not quite as long from seat to bars. Hmm. at your height, wouldnt a Gold Wing look like a small sport bike with you riding it? hehehehe I so rarely get to make fun of people taller than me
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'06 zx14
Muzzy M10/M14
PCIII w/ Muzzy map
Flies out K&N in!
bits n pieces...
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stevewfl
Moderator
Posts: 27920
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posted December 14, 2007 06:39 AM
the ZX9 of the 90's wasn't bigger than the R1 nor CBR954 of the day
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2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
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Sticks_n_Stones
Needs a job
Posts: 3930
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posted December 14, 2007 06:49 AM
which makes it a big dynosaur compared to the itty bitty bikes nowadays, right? Even if they dont weigh that much less
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'06 zx14
Muzzy M10/M14
PCIII w/ Muzzy map
Flies out K&N in!
bits n pieces...
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ZXfreak
Parking Attendant
Posts: 21
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posted January 09, 2008 07:18 PM
I just got a 14 myself, with about 3 years experience riding. Do what everyone says, and always CONTROL YOURSELF. I personally think the 14 is a fantastic bike to ride around on, its comfortable, good looking, good handling, very mellow and docile at lower speeds, but once you take it past 6000 rpm, it turns into a vicious monster that wants to kill you. DONT take it past 6000 rpm until you have ridden for a year at least, thats my advice. That is not a dare, it is honest advice. Part of the reason I went with the 14 was the size issue as well, I am 6'2, 220 pounds, I wanted I bike I could strecth out on, and the 14 is a good fit. You may want to add a set of risers for more comfort as well. Definetly take an MSF rider course, they will teach you things that WILL (not can) save your life. Remember that cars will kill you if you let them, and dont ever force an issue with a car driver, you WILL lose. Thats about all I can think of for now, have fun, ride SAFE. ( Come to think of it, who am I to give advice? I'm still a newbie to bikes myself!)
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2007 Superduke
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Sticks_n_Stones
Needs a job
Posts: 3930
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posted January 10, 2008 06:50 AM
The unspoken reason: No one here wants to mention this so I will.
Imagine seeing a Lamborgini Marcielago cruising down the street. Just as it pulls up adjacent to you, you realize its a 17 yr old Blonde girl jabbering on a cell phone while putting make-up on. Doesnt that just piss you off? A car so full of fast potential being driven by a someone you just KNOW will not, and could not, ever utilize it. If she ever tried to haul ass in it you know she would wreck it. Such a waste, right?
Yeah, you know what I'm comparing that too, and its true. Most experienced riders see it that way when someone tells them a ZX14, Hayabusa, or Blackbird was there first bike. So much lost potential because most will never be able to learn everything needed to be able to brake, corner, and handle that bike properly if they dont start out on something easier to fling around and control.
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'06 zx14
Muzzy M10/M14
PCIII w/ Muzzy map
Flies out K&N in!
bits n pieces...
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Tool Man
Needs a job
Posts: 4493
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posted January 10, 2008 08:42 AM
Thats what I keep saying....Bikes are like women, the small ones are less likely to throw you off
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jeff martin
Pro (closed)
jamming
Posts: 1168
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posted January 10, 2008 08:51 AM
quote:
I am probably gonna get blackballed for this but I think the 14 in stock form is a pussycat... it is the easiest bike to ride I have ever come across this bike is a marvel of modern egineering and any resposible ADULT!!!! can somewhat safely ride a 14 as their first bike! I am going to try to find this article i read a few months back that a guy from MIT wrote about how the weight of a person in relationship to the weight of a motorcycle changes the handling charectersistics of a bike and can make it unsafe, the basic jist of the article was that a 300 pound guy perched atop a 400 pound motorcycle has some problems in the physics of turning and cornering that the same person would not have on a 500 pound bike all though it was a very boring read it made a lot of sense to me and changed the way I ride my zx10's, his biggest point was the difference of that much weight being so high above the natural center of gravity that it goes past the point where most tires are designed to work properly. If I can find it again I will psot a link
My two cents worth: 5'4'' 140 lbs and i find my 14 one of the smoothest and easyier bikes to ride..For what its worth the 14 is my 16th sport bike purchase and the rock solid feel of this motorcycle blows my mind everytime i ride it...The motor will kill you if you dont respect it and i wouldn't recommend it for a new rider under 30 or anyone that doesnt have the decipline to keep there wits about them in all riding situations...Even myself with many years of track time and street time..I was hard on the throttle steep into a corner at about 95 when i transitioned from a hard lean into the straight the rear tire decided to let loose..without the time on the race track i am sure it would of ended in a high side crash..Just from the shear power of this monster..It will be awhile before i see power sliding out of corners with this bike...My GSXR1000 is much more forgiving as far as the motor is concerned...Good Luck !
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i play with boats my wife plays with my dingy.
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Rifleman_duce
Parking Attendant
Yeah, that's what she said
Posts: 18
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posted January 10, 2008 09:49 AM
pretty much beat to death and all have had good answers but I will put in my $0.02 as well
First off... it is the speed at which you can get in trouble that is the difference between a ZX14, hayabusa, Gixxer1000 etc... and a 600 or 450... if it takes you 3/10ths of a second to get in trouble on a Ninja 250... it will take 1/10 on the 14R... the smaller bikes are a little more forgiving if you get ham fisted... take a little longer to get to "ludicris speed", are a little lighter and easier to horse around if you have to... but almost every bike can toss you on your head...
Second, buy a used bike, buy a crummy looking, already scratched, needs a new chain and brake pads bike... you will save yourself half or more the cost of a new one... you will find out if you actually like riding, putting on all the gear, every time... getting caught in the rain from time to time... take the money you would spend on a new bike and put that much in the bank (either payment or what have you, but treat it like you got a new bike)... if after 1 year the bike is the first thing you see when you open the garage... sell it, take the money in the bank and buy what you want... if the bike is in the back of the shop with stuff stacked on it... sell it.... and pocket the money... bikes aren't for you.
I've got over 100,000 miles and 22 years of experiance... and the big hyper performance 1000 cc plus still scare me...
WHAT EVER YOU DO< PLEASE BE CAREFUL, we would hate to have to buy your 14R from you mom after the funeral.
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]Need to know how to install your Rifleman's 1/5th throttle insert? click me
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