KZScott
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high on speed
Posts: 7235
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posted December 17, 2009 10:37 AM
fuel pumps
I know that its been generally accepted that anything over 200 hp and the oem "A" pump has a hard time keeping up. I was wondering what kind of numbers in a PC map suggest 200 hp. the biggest numbers in my 1287 map are 10s in the upper rpm range(above 9000 80 and 100 % tps). now I have seen far higher numbers for use with dry shots of nitrous, and my bike has ran rich enough for a 30 hp dry shot. I dont think i had anything higher than a 30 in my map at that time. I somehow doubt that adding a 4 mm crank and set of cams this winter will net a 30 hp gain, so is it safe to assume no change is required? I dont use dry nitrous any more, all wet.
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01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
  
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Shane661
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posted December 17, 2009 10:40 AM
 Edited By: Shane661 on 17 Dec 2009 18:48
Scott, you are seeing like +10 at the most in your NA map? What a/f did you shoot for?
That's is what, like +7 over the standard displacement map?
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KZScott
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Posts: 7235
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posted December 17, 2009 10:49 AM
Edited By: KZScott on 17 Dec 2009 18:57
yes
12.7 on 91 octane with 5 degrees of timing
maybe i got a set of "ringer" injectors?
i believe the pump is stock, i took it out recently to work on the 3/4 tank design
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01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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Pretty Fast
Expert Class
Posts: 116
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posted January 08, 2010 11:51 PM
quote:
I know that its been generally accepted that anything over 200 hp and the oem "A" pump has a hard time keeping up. I was wondering what kind of numbers in a PC map suggest 200 hp. the biggest numbers in my 1287 map are 10s in the upper rpm range(above 9000 80 and 100 % tps). now I have seen far higher numbers for use with dry shots of nitrous, and my bike has ran rich enough for a 30 hp dry shot. I dont think i had anything higher than a 30 in my map at that time. I somehow doubt that adding a 4 mm crank and set of cams this winter will net a 30 hp gain, so is it safe to assume no change is required? I dont use dry nitrous any more, all wet.
KZ any reason why u went from a dry shot to wet? I'm new to this Nitrous thing and I'm thinking bout doing anywhere from a dry 30 to 50 shot sometime between now and early March. Thanks!
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entropy
Moderator
Posts: 8671
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posted January 09, 2010 01:55 AM
quote:
I know that its been generally accepted that anything over 200 hp and the oem "A" pump has a hard time keeping up. I was wondering what kind of numbers in a PC map suggest 200 hp. the biggest numbers in my 1287 map are 10s in the upper rpm range(above 9000 80 and 100 % tps). now I have seen far higher numbers for use with dry shots of nitrous, and my bike has ran rich enough for a 30 hp dry shot. I dont think i had anything higher than a 30 in my map at that time. I somehow doubt that adding a 4 mm crank and set of cams this winter will net a 30 hp gain, so is it safe to assume no change is required? I dont use dry nitrous any more, all wet.
look at duty cycle under full load. if it's not over 90%, you should be GTG
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shiphteey
Needs a job
Posts: 2529
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posted January 09, 2010 04:58 AM
+1. Although I've skated too close to 100% duty cycle in previous years ... I'm done with THAT shit! Scott, you can replace just the pump itself with a Walbro, it will be money well spent. Years ago Doug Meyer wrote a very informative article regarding the stock fuel pump and its overall limited capabilities, especially once you start modding. Even if you aren't spraying you are still anywhere from the high 180s to possibly 200ish HP depending...on motor. I would be willing to be you are ALREADY at a much higher duty cycle than you think. You might be able to get away with it at the strip because its a quick burst but Walbro pumps are cheap insurance. Remember...no fuel = BOOM. Log our Duty Cycle and prepare for en eye opener. In the previous years I had been spraying dry, I was on the edge...closer than most....that was on stock injectors and a Muzzys Pump. You running a piston kit is near a 30 shot, which is near a 40 shot that I used to spray. Play it safe.
A.
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Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
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KZScott
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Posts: 7235
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posted January 09, 2010 09:55 AM
is there a way to log duty cycle with an LM-1 and LMA-3?
i had a wet and dry kit on my bike for awhile. took off the dry kit to put on dads bike and put bigger jets in the foggers to compensate(with a 2 dial controller).
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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shiphteey
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posted January 09, 2010 08:10 PM
I log my duty cycle with the LM1 and LMA3.
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Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
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KZScott
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Posts: 7235
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posted January 09, 2010 08:27 PM
what wire do i connect to? injector? how is it calibrated?
thx!
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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shiphteey
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Posts: 2529
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posted January 11, 2010 06:30 PM
Details are a little fuzzy as its been about a year since I stumbled my way through the configuration process. Make no mistake, I didn't get involved with the wiring ... because quite frankly I don't trust my wiring on a 200+ mph vehicle. Hook it up to injector #1 but you'll need to load the Innovate software and go through the tutorial. I was afraid of it at first but if an electrical idiot like me can rough it you can too. I believe we take the positive and negative off of injector #1 from the ECU, you'll need the manual so you know which wires they are.
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Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
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KZScott
Needs a life
high on speed
Posts: 7235
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posted January 11, 2010 06:41 PM
thanks! ill see if i can figure it out when i get the new motor combo up and running. i may run out of channels 
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
|
dougmeyer
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posted January 11, 2010 07:44 PM
Edited By: dougmeyer on 12 Jan 2010 03:45
Entropy and shiphteey have it right- it's all in the duty cycle. If the injectors are open more than 80% you're looking for trouble.
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It's not that I think you're dumb, it's just that so much of what you know isn't true....
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KZScott
Needs a life
high on speed
Posts: 7235
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posted January 17, 2010 01:43 PM
Doug, would you happen to remember roughy the number in the power commander (in the drag race rpm range) that would put me close to 80% DC? this is how you (R&D team?) came up with the upgraded fuel pump correct?
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01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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