Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted July 12, 2009 07:03 AM
 Edited By: Shane661 on 12 Jul 2009 15:05
quote:
shane you did not spin from the looks of it or lift the front in the vid.i am thinking you can bike wise come out a bit harder. i know it is hard to do i can not get it yet.isen't it funny we know what we need to do but it is hard to do it when the lights go down.
I agree with that. I am going to be adding just a little more rpm next time out. That will help on a couple of levels. I have replayed video countless times, and can see that I am just barely getting the front light off of the line, and it can definitely take more. I only had one wheelie all day.
My "style" is to make some small changes, see what works for me, and then get consistent with it. Then I can analyze it some more and move forward. It's important for me to ride the bike in a controlled manner, and not out on the edge of my capabilities all of the time. I'm not in a rush to achieve my goals, and I know they will come in time.
You are right...I pretty much know what I need to do. But making it automatic can take some time.
Shane
  
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entropy
Moderator
Posts: 8671
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posted July 12, 2009 08:39 AM
Shane, look at yr tps log, see how long it is taking you to get to WOT...
IMO you should concentrate on decreasing that time.
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted July 12, 2009 09:03 AM
quote:
Shane, look at yr tps log, see how long it is taking you to get to WOT...
IMO you should concentrate on decreasing that time.
When you watched the videos, you saw my logger. 
I am working on getting WOT sooner. There are a few minor changes in my technique that will help. My 1/8th mph is good, but I'd say I am about 30-40 feet late in getting the clutch out and throttle pinned. Generally, I am told to try to have it pinned by the tree.
The bike has pretty good torque and is light up front. I can't just pin it on the break like a 1000, unfortunately. I've done that and it ends up being a clutch destroyer as you drag the clutch too much in order to keep the bike under control.
Shane
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KZScott
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posted July 12, 2009 09:07 AM
maybe try another inch or so of WB?
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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Shane661
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Posts: 11494
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posted July 12, 2009 09:12 AM
Edited By: Shane661 on 12 Jul 2009 17:13
quote:
maybe try another inch or so of WB?
No way. It is at 64.25" now. I don't see any need to go longer. It isn't wheelying.
I'm just going to keep practicing. Considering I've barely ridden it this season, I'm pretty happy with the the way it is running down the track. 
Shane
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kaw-rick
Pro
Posts: 1167
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posted July 12, 2009 09:45 AM
quote:
quote:
Why wont that bike 60ft?
I just need more practice. I need to shave .05-.10, consistently, off of my 60's. I have only had 38 passes this whole season, unfortunately. Got any tips?
What did it take for you to get into the 8's? When you got in on motor, what were your 60 foots like?
Shane
i had to spray min e to go 8s. usually im 1.4 sixtys though, with or without spray. im 220lbs. 16\43 gear. your bikes running for sure. i was just wondering why 60ft was down. btw im running stock shock. i leave at 4000 throw the clutch.
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Shane661
Needs a life
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posted July 12, 2009 09:49 AM
Edited By: Shane661 on 12 Jul 2009 18:01
One thing's for sure, there is more than one way to skin a cat! Everyone has to find a style that suits them. But the bottom line seems to be, get off the clutch and wide open as quickly as possible.
I think the stock shock works fine. The Penske is a lot easier to adjust, and works very well with the bike lowered a lot (not too much squat like I had with the stocker). But I've seen some very fast bikes with a stock shock.
Shane
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KZScott
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posted July 12, 2009 10:27 AM
quote:
I can't just pin it on the break like a 1000, unfortunately. I've done that and it ends up being a clutch destroyer as you drag the clutch too much in order to keep the bike under control.
Shane
quote:
No way. It is at 64.25" now. I don't see any need to go longer. It isn't wheelying.
Shane
Im assuming under control means not wheelying?
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted July 12, 2009 10:40 AM
Edited By: Shane661 on 12 Jul 2009 18:47
quote:
quote:
I can't just pin it on the break like a 1000, unfortunately. I've done that and it ends up being a clutch destroyer as you drag the clutch too much in order to keep the bike under control.
Shane
quote:
No way. It is at 64.25" now. I don't see any need to go longer. It isn't wheelying.
Shane
Im assuming under control means not wheelying?
It doesn't wheelie if you don't try to ride it like a 1000. And with the 14 you don't need to ride it like a 1000. It is entirely possible to get this bike to low 1.4's without pinning the throttle on the break. I have run 1.49 leaving at 5k rpm, real easy.
Look at my videos. Those are at 5k-5200 rpm, leaving easy. 1.51-1.52. Look at the front wheel..pretty much planted. Plenty more to go without adding wheelbase.
If I didn't want to use much throttle or clutch control...then I would go longer. I like the bike where it is...I just need to practice and learn to ride it. At some point I will probably even run a shorter bike...that is where you get the most clutch and throttle skill.
Shane
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KZScott
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posted July 12, 2009 10:49 AM
Ok, im not going to tell you how to run your bike. Do what works for you.
My opinion is, it will go quicker if its WOT, and the clutch is not slipping excessively to prevent a wheelie. instead of slipping the clutch, i would go longer or use ballast, but thats just my .02
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted July 12, 2009 10:54 AM
quote:
Ok, im not going to tell you how to run your bike. Do what works for you.
My opinion is, it will go quicker if its WOT, and the clutch is not slipping excessively to prevent a wheelie. instead of slipping the clutch, i would go longer or use ballast, but thats just my .02
I'm pretty happy with the way things are going so far. I guess we'll see how it goes. 
Shane
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CrotchRocket
Moderator
Bracket Racing with Betsy
Posts: 8038
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posted July 12, 2009 04:54 PM
Scott...Dont take offense but here at Jason Millers StreetBike Seminars, Jason teaches all about clutch control and doing the best you can with the way one decides to set his/her bike up!!!
Think about it Scott...How is Shane going to learn to get a real good clutch hand if his 14 is as long as an NHRA ProStockBike...
Also, bracket racing is big here on the north east coast...It's the challenge...
Dont take offense ok...
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*****DragRacers do it better, because they dont cut Corners*****
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KZScott
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posted July 12, 2009 06:42 PM
no offense taken, i just look at a situation, and try to find the most logical/easy way to reach the goal.
"problem" : above 8 seconds
cause : not agressive enough launch
problem: when trying to be more agressive, it wheelies, or you burn up clutch plates
solution: extend bike further or add ballast to prevent wheelies allowing a harder launch
but Shane is doing well, so he will definately improve with more seat time. I just think he could improve at an accelerated rate (pun intended  ) with another in of wb
whats wrong with having a prostock bike? last i checked, Shanes bike was loosing headlights ect ect and looking like quite a race bike
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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NOX
Needs a job
PMRA / TMRC Super Street 4022
Posts: 3745
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posted July 12, 2009 09:20 PM
there is a lot left in the short time for sure, as you can tell it is soft, seems a touch stiff, or you just are not laying the coal to it in the first couple feet..........
i move the tire on the rim every pass......., unless there is some special thing with the carbon wheels......, its a pretty normal thing........., but, it is odd at that pressure......, and as easy as you are moving it out of the hole........, my first few feet, i hit the tire hard........
Good luck, let us know when you hit the 8s. bike looks good.
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2010 PMRA Super Street #3 Points
2009 PMRA Super Street Points Runner-Up
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NOX
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posted July 12, 2009 09:23 PM
get it WOT at the hit....., control the hp with the clutch, not the throttle.........
____________
42 Wins
21 Runner-ups
2010 TMRC Super Street Points Champion
2010 PMRA Super Street #3 Points
2009 PMRA Super Street Points Runner-Up
6 Time Centerville Dragway Points Champion
Sponsored by:
Scorpion Helmets
Galfer Braking
AMSOIL
Steve's Speed Shop
Kawasaki Sports Center
Mickey Thompson Tires
Catalyst Racing Composites
Conway Cycle
Syed Leathers
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Shane661
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Posts: 11494
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posted July 13, 2009 02:44 AM
Edited By: Shane661 on 13 Jul 2009 12:49
quote:
there is a lot left in the short time for sure, as you can tell it is soft, seems a touch stiff, or you just are not laying the coal to it in the first couple feet..........
i move the tire on the rim every pass......., unless there is some special thing with the carbon wheels......, its a pretty normal thing........., but, it is odd at that pressure......, and as easy as you are moving it out of the hole........, my first few feet, i hit the tire hard........
Good luck, let us know when you hit the 8s. bike looks good.
I'm not snapping the clutch out like I need to. The front wheel pretty much rolls on the launch, as you can see. The BST's have a rep for being slick, Brock told me of some stuff to use when mounting the tire. I'll give it a try soon. Otherwise, they can put a treatment on the rim. The wider rims actually come treated already.
It may be a little stiff, but I'm not changing it unless it gives me trouble. I can't really say until I start hitting it harder. I don't think there is a lot of mystery here, I just need some more seat time.
Shane
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shiphteey
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posted July 13, 2009 06:05 PM
Shane, finally saw the run with audio, looking good. You are right there, keep at it, hell you don't need to do anything really but run in October......you'll be in the 8s!
A.
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Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
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dubious
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Needs more time to ride!
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posted July 16, 2009 07:31 PM
Edited By: dubious on 17 Jul 2009 03:34
quote:
get it WOT at the hit....., control the hp with the clutch, not the throttle.........
I am not going to tell anyone how to ride, but what I have learned.
When I raced motocross, the difference between an intermediate class and pro class racer was a clutch pack per race.
Pro's like Ricky, James, and Jeremy run the track at WFO, and use the clutch to control wheelies and traction.
If you listen to a motocross race, many of the best are WFO the whole time, and use the clutch to control the bike.
The 4 stroke torque, and engine heat in the clutch bath has changed that somwhat, but the 2 strokes are pinned all day.
Holeshots are the same, redline to the first corner, clutching for traction and wheelies.
With the 14 I have found it much more effective to throw the clutch away at what ever RPM the traction will allow, and pin it. The motor will pull 1st gear faster than most can modulate the clutch, and then slip it a bit if the front gets to high, while staying in the throttle.
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whitehendrix
Zone Head
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posted July 16, 2009 08:14 PM
awesome aweseom aweseom!!
the BSTs are hot sex.
sounded wicked.
very nice.
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weapon. The black is for formal
occasions. - ZRXDean
ill never own a busa unless
someone gives me one.... and then
ill sell it -KZScott
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Shane661
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Posts: 11494
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posted July 17, 2009 02:51 PM
Edited By: Shane661 on 18 Jul 2009 00:11
Another trip to the track today. Today's air was pretty bad. It was hot and very humid. Everyone was down on ET and MPH, but I wanted to get some more practice. After watching my video's over and over again, I was pretty sure of what I did not want to do.
So, as the day wears on, my times are averaging .10-.15 slower than last week. Not only was I riding it about the same as last week, but the air was dragging the bike down even further. I decided to focus on a change to riding technique..something had to change!
Well, even though I couldn't beat my best ET's from last week, I managed to improve my 60 foots substantially. Bike #55:
1.44...that is a big improvement over the 1.51's I ran last week. Much better than my prior personal best of 1.49. I can repeat it, and there is plenty left to go with more practice.
A couple of more pics from the track:
So, while I didn't get my 8 second slip, I am getting closer.
Shane
PS. As usual, thanks to Rick, Racheal, and Jason for a great Streetbike Seminar/track day!
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shiphteey
Needs a job
Posts: 2529
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posted July 17, 2009 03:05 PM
Gotta be El Nino....hell is freezing over....Shane's front wheel is off the ground!
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Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted July 17, 2009 03:33 PM
Edited By: Shane661 on 17 Jul 2009 23:35
quote:
Gotta be El Nino....hell is freezing over....Shane's front wheel is off the ground!
The times they are a-changin'.... 
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entropy
Moderator
Posts: 8671
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posted July 17, 2009 04:28 PM
Shane,
GREAT progress.
One thing, you are way off the tank.
the best 60's i ever got were with my chest ON the tank all the way thru 1st.
IMO if you are not looking thru the screen you are too high.
just a thought
see you at Loring!!!
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted July 17, 2009 04:41 PM
Edited By: Shane661 on 18 Jul 2009 00:42
quote:
Shane,
GREAT progress.
One thing, you are way off the tank.
the best 60's i ever got were with my chest ON the tank all the way thru 1st.
IMO if you are not looking thru the screen you are too high.
just a thought
see you at Loring!!!
I'm working on body positioning. You know how it goes; what you tell your body to do vs. what it does can sometimes be very different. Every time I come home from the track Advil stocks go up.
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