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KZScott

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Posts: 7235

posted August 09, 2008 08:26 PM

wet nitrous ideas

ok looking to hear any and all ideas you guys may have about a wet nitrous setup. I bought a partial NOS kit (yes its actually the NOS brand i didnt just watch the fast and the furious) from a buddy that was just too good of a deal to pass up. i only need to get a couple fogger nozzels and make some hard lines as i dont want to use the plastic lines.
the kit comes with a fuel pump, so my plan is to run a seperate fuel tank with c16 and run pump gas(91 octane) in the normal gas tank. (i know a guy who has his camaro set up like that). im guessing a 1 litre tank will be LOTS for the c16 tank.
i have an EFIR on the way from Woppi, and im buying the rpm window switch from Schnitz, so it should be really safe.
the kit has 20 and 24 jets. according to the table on the tech corner on Schnitz Racing, thats a 60 shot

i dont have (or want) a progressive controller, so im going to have it activated when i click into second gear via the window switch (from 7000 to 11000 rpm?) when i first try it. hopefully i wont have any wheelspin or major wheelie issues.....
I have stock velocity stacks, so ill probly make a small bracket to hold the nozzels above the stacks, i think thats the easiest option, drilling and tapping the head at this point is waaayyyy too much work, and even putting them in the intake boots is a lot of work, and hard to run lines to.
one thing im not sure of, is where to buy a switch that will shut off the nitrous if my pump dies...
how much should i increase my kill time on my Schnits PPI? i was running 65ms with no delay.
oh, how do i know which way the siphon tube is going in the bottle?
JC, i have been meaning to call you, but untill i get the problem with the phone worked out i will stick to the forum
thx!
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos

shane661

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Posts: 11494

posted August 10, 2008 07:10 AM

Edited By: shane661 on 10 Aug 2008 08:10

I have been doing a little research on nitrous. I would highly recommend at least a two dial controller. It will help alleviate traction problems, you can bring some power in sooner, and it is easier on the engine.

As far as fuel delivery, why not buy a spare used tank and add a bung to it? That way you won't need an auxillary tank (I haven't seen a setup like that on a street bike). You could also cut it down while you are at it, then you can get lower on the bike at launch.

Just some ideas...

Shane

KZScott

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posted August 10, 2008 07:21 AM

Edited By: KZScott on 10 Aug 2008 08:22

the reason i dont want a controller is because they pulse the solenoids. that wears them out a lot faster. and its one more thing i dont have to buy. i might try a smaller dry shot(25-30hp) later on in the season to start adding power in 1st gear(keeping the wet shot as is of course

).
im going to have room for a small tank in my extended tail section, and i dont want to be swapping the regular tanks when i go to the track, plus i only want to burn race fuel when im running nitrous. draining or swapping tanks between rounds is not something i want to do. i know a cut down tank would help, but i hate the look, and it wouldnt benefit me as much as a larger guy. (im 175 lbs unsuited).
keep the ideas coming. im not trying to shoot them down, rather have a friendly debate/discussion

I want 8s bad:P
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos

shane661

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Posts: 11494

posted August 10, 2008 07:40 AM

Did you put in the Walbro fuel pump? I'm wondering if you can't get in the 8's with a dry shot? I suspect you will run 9.20 or better on the motor when you get thing set up...

Spraying a 40 dry shot earlier should improve your et significantly more than spraying more later.

Shane

KZScott

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Posts: 7235

posted August 10, 2008 07:52 AM

Edited By: KZScott on 10 Aug 2008 08:55

no, i still have the stock pump for now. the walbro is on the list. im not spraying a dry shot untill i get it just incase....
i just couldnt pass up a near complete wet kit for $200

my plan is to run hard lines similar to the muzzy stealth kit. im not risking running the plastic lines after reading about Buddys meltdown (RIP Buddy) when his lines broke and put most of his nitrous to 1 cylinder

____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos

brickman

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Posts: 294

posted August 10, 2008 01:50 PM

quote:
Did you put in the Walbro fuel pump? I'm wondering if you can't get in the 8's with a dry shot? I suspect you will run 9.20 or better on the motor when you get thing set up...

Spraying a 40 dry shot earlier should improve your et significantly more than spraying more later.

Shane

were is the best place to get that pump and how much are they? thanks

KZScott

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posted August 10, 2008 02:16 PM

http://www.bikeland.org/board/viewthread.php?FID=1&TID=20929&pagenumber=3
quote Jim (Y2K) from his 1375 build thread:

I decided on the Walbro GSS242. Its the190 lph version of the GSS307.
It pumps 40gph/151lph/248#hr@40psi.

It will support more than 2 times the HP the bike will be making and draws 5.8 amps at 13.5v at 40 psi. The 255lph GSS307 draws 3 more amps and can support over 600 hp and is dimensionally the same.

The gss-242 pump with electrical connector and screen can be had for $80.

Some modifications are needed to mount the Walbro gss242/gss307 pumps in the fuel pump chassis. Nothing major. Order the pump and kit for a buick grand national turbo.
The upper hoop bracket needs to be fliped over and mirror bent. It has an offset to one side and has to be offset to the oppisite side.
The rubber seat under the pump inlet needs to be cut with a new sharp razor to about 1/4" thick.
Slice a 4" piece of 3/8" fuel line down length wise and bend it backwards around the pump under a band clamp. trim off the excess band clamp to about 1-1/4" long and after everything is seccured in place bend the extra strap back over the adjusting screw and secure it with safety wire so the band clamp screw cant loosten up from the pump vibration.
Trim the new supplied "s bend" hose to length and use the spring clamps (2 each end) to seccure.
Make sure to solder the ring connectors onto the wires and put the wire shielding back over the wires.

The walbro gss242 (190lph) is the same pump as the gss307(255lph) from the outside. They will interchange. the gss307($90) is about $10 more than the gss242($80).
From what ive been told Muzzy uses the gss307 in thier kit.

____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos

kawasaki_rick

Zone Head
Posts: 512

posted August 10, 2008 05:42 PM

I have a 60 shot on my 14 right now, 2 dial progressive. My silenoids are the same ive been using for 2 yrs. I have it set on the start button. No window switch. Also i use a cheap automotive fuel pump from o-reilleys. No need to make it complicated. Bike has been 163 mph 8.80 And im 220 lbs.

KZScott

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Posts: 7235

posted August 10, 2008 05:57 PM

hmmm good to know. maybe a short ramp up time wouldnt be too hard on them then. ill try it without a controller first, and if i have problems, ill look for a cheap 2 dial.

i was at my uncles tonight looking at the fogger system on his vette. i believe hes using 3/16 lines or bigger. he only had 1 line that wouldwork as a hard line for the fittings i have if i replace the plastic lines coming out of my distribution blocks, and it was for his purge. imnot sure if i can get anything local to make this work, maybe break line? i can get that size line in copper, but ive been told nitrous and copper dont mix. im going to check out the hardware store and see if i can find anything useful

anyone know what the muzzy stealth kit uses for hard lines?
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos

nczx14

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Posts: 108

posted August 10, 2008 06:47 PM

Order your supplies straight from Nitrous Oxide Systems or Doug Herberts. Herberts carries alot of N2o supplies in stock.
____________
2K7 everything possible without going in the engine.

dougmeyer

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Posts: 2713

posted August 10, 2008 08:11 PM

Check out the Kinsler Fuel Injection catalog. They have lots of goodies.
____________
It's not that I think you're dumb, it's just that so much of what you know isn't true....

NOX

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posted August 10, 2008 09:23 PM

He will go better than 9.20s on motor, the clutch parts he needed just came in........

I suspect 9.0s or 8.90s
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kawasaki_rick

Zone Head
Posts: 512

posted August 11, 2008 03:49 AM

OH and im also using copper lines, was worried about the plastic 1s, burning up if there was a backfire. I used the oil gauge line kits to do mine. Works awesome i couldnt be happier.

TRNorBRN6001

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Posts: 2021

posted August 11, 2008 09:00 AM

JC will be out for a little while, so he may not be able to return your call.
____________
TFA 200MPH CLUB MEMBER!

burnout

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Posts: 216

posted August 11, 2008 11:41 AM

What's your wheel base? If your leaving hard on motor already, an instant 60 HP to the rear wheel can cause the bike to lift, which is fun, but not necessarily quick.
____________
1/8 5.66@129.77
1/4 8.74@159.60

KZScott

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posted August 11, 2008 03:36 PM

Edited By: KZScott on 11 Aug 2008 16:37

ill check it out Doug, thx
9.0-8.90 on motor... damn, i hope so Nox!

(the goal is to eventually get a good enough clutch and nitrous setup to run 8.40 on DOT tires and no bars. it might not happen this yr tho. i want to beat the current quickest et at the track in "street" form as the 8.40 was done by a slick and bar bike. i want to be able to say "my street bike is quicker than your drag bike":P )
rick, you need to check your copper lines!
read this: http://www.bikeland.org/board/viewthread.php?FID=13&TID=37687&set_time=1205860077
thx Gary, ill try JC on the wknd
Burnout, im roughly 8.5 inches over... 65-66 inches maybe??
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos

rgeorge

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Posts: 220

posted August 11, 2008 05:19 PM

Edited By: rgeorge on 11 Aug 2008 18:21

quote:
one thing im not sure of, is where to buy a switch that will shut off the nitrous if my pump dies...

I haven't used one, but there are a lot of them out there: http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=NOS%2D15685NOS&N=700+400047+301167+4294845251+4294903084+4294782601+115&autoview=sku

quote:
oh, how do i know which way the siphon tube is going in the bottle?

Hold the (empty) bottle with a strap wrench, take off the valve and bend the tube to where you want it.

quote:
make some hard lines as i dont want to use the plastic lines.

The best way to go is with 3/16 stainless lines. What kind of nozzle and jets do you have? If you use flare jets, you need a 37 degree flare on the end of the stainless tubing. Don't try to flare stainless yourself unless you have a very good ($300+) flaring tool. You can buy flared tubing like this:
http://www.dynotunenitrous.com/store/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=114

You will need a -3 Aluminum nut and sleeve:
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/hapages/an818.php
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/hapages/an819.php

Bend the tubing and cut it to length with a good tubing cutter and connect to your distribution block with compression fittings.
http://www.jegs.com/i/NOS/741/16433-8/10002/-1/762414|11169

KZScott

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posted August 11, 2008 05:42 PM

Hey Rob, I had emailed Ryan Schnitz about the switch, and thats the one we came up with

original NOS fogger nozzle brass with a black finish
funnel jets
did not know i could move the siphon tube

i cant get 3/16 to work with the fittings coming out of my distribution blocks, they are small. its using the 1/8 black plastic tubing and compression fittings. i believe i can just replace the plastic with 1/8 steel lines and reuse the compression fitting, ill try to get some pics up...

____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos

KZScott

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Posts: 7235

posted August 11, 2008 06:08 PM

trikchop

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posted August 11, 2008 07:22 PM

im enjoying this thread. i get alot of useful information from you guys. i promise im using it for good not evil

Gixx1300R

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posted August 12, 2008 04:50 PM

It would be much easier to use Stainless Steel Braided line as rgeorge stated

ninja12

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posted August 12, 2008 07:44 PM

Nothing wrong with hard lines or braided lines, but the plastic lines have been used for many years, just don't make hard turns on the nitrous side.

KZScott

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Posts: 7235

posted August 12, 2008 08:15 PM

would there be any reason i couldnt use the compression fittings on 1/8 steel hard lines? that is looking like the easiest and cheapest way to do this. plus i just ordered more funnel jets...
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos

woppi