dutchjarod
Parking Attendant
Posts: 16
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posted September 29, 2009 08:52 AM
trying to tweak up the 05 zx12
ive been doing good off the line with the stock 12. muzzy full exaust, stock gears, lowerd, extended swingarm. quite a few good lights to. what can i do to start getting it quicker and keeping it an everyday riding bike? should i go get a power commander 1st? i still have the stock gears as well.
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Real riders know the consequences, others..... just hear about them" -Dutchjarod
  
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Texas12R
Zone Head
Posts: 545
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posted September 29, 2009 10:16 AM
I would post this question on the dragbike zone forum.
I know some of the guys will answer questions here,
but it's probably going to get more replies over there....
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tshultz
Zone Head
Posts: 556
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posted September 29, 2009 01:31 PM
pc 16-44 gearing
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KZScott
Needs a life
high on speed
Posts: 7235
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posted September 29, 2009 01:47 PM
since its extended, you probly arent worried about the length of the chain. try 17 50 or 17 49. yes get a pc with a full system
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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dutchjarod
Parking Attendant
Posts: 16
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posted September 29, 2009 03:13 PM
well power comander it is then. i just ordered a 16 and i will order a 17. i already had a 45, 46 and 48 for the rear that i had on the zx9.
____________
Real riders know the consequences, others..... just hear about them" -Dutchjarod
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CrotchRocket
Moderator
Bracket Racing with Betsy
Posts: 8038
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posted September 29, 2009 03:15 PM
Dont need a PC...
16-44 is for stock wheelbase
how long is your 12 now and how much you weigh?
17-50 is basically the same as 16-47.....17-49 & 16-46 are similar...
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Jason Miller StreetBike Seminars
*****DragRacers do it better, because they dont cut Corners*****
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KZScott
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Posts: 7235
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posted September 29, 2009 03:40 PM
 Edited By: KZScott on 29 Sep 2009 23:50
quote:
Dont need a PC...
...
you allways say this, but when i ask for proof i get none? data logs or dyno sheets showing correct AFR without a pc and a with a full system plz
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted September 29, 2009 03:54 PM
Edited By: Shane661 on 29 Sep 2009 23:56
quote:
quote:
Dont need a PC...
...
you allways say this, but when i ask for proof i get none? data logs or dyno sheets showing correct AFR without a pc and a with a full system plz
How about he shows you his time slips? 
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dutchjarod
Parking Attendant
Posts: 16
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posted September 29, 2009 04:10 PM
i am back 10.5" and i weight 194
____________
Real riders know the consequences, others..... just hear about them" -Dutchjarod
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KZScott
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Posts: 7235
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posted September 29, 2009 05:26 PM
Edited By: KZScott on 30 Sep 2009 01:26
quote:
quote:
quote:
Dont need a PC...
...
you allways say this, but when i ask for proof i get none? data logs or dyno sheets showing correct AFR without a pc and a with a full system plz
How about he shows you his time slips?
with a pc with a good tune, then without a pc. same day same conditions. sure 
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted September 30, 2009 07:29 AM
Edited By: Shane661 on 30 Sep 2009 15:47
I think you can judge by the mph #'s what kind of power the bike is making. We already know what stock motor 12R's turn in mph and ET, when equipped with a power commander.
You know that Rick's bike has run as quick as 9.1, and 150+ mph at 60-61", hand clutch. Rick is not a small jockey. From a drag racing standpoint, that should tell you something about how the bike is making power...that is your proof. In fact, it is the same story on the 14...a few hp to be gained, but the bike is fat enough from the factory that it responds well to just an exhaust.
Could it run more smoothly? Perhaps...but is a PC needed to turn very quick ET's on a stock motor 12R....(or 14, for that matter)? No. 
Shane
PS. I had a good map in my 12R with Muzzy exhaust. I had both a Power Commander and an Ignition Module. It never lost the flat spot down low, and this is a pretty common concern with that exhaust. If you were looking for smoothness and low rpm response, you would be better served with a different exhaust. My 12R ran very strong (193+ mph in the mile on pump fuel)...but it didn't turn any more mph at the dragstrip than Rick's 12R does without a Power Commander.
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted September 30, 2009 07:51 AM
quote:
ive been doing good off the line with the stock 12. muzzy full exaust, stock gears, lowerd, extended swingarm. quite a few good lights to. what can i do to start getting it quicker and keeping it an everyday riding bike? should i go get a power commander 1st? i still have the stock gears as well.
What are your #'s at the track?
The first thing that jumps out at me, is the gearing. That is a much, much bigger issue than the Power Commander at this point.
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dutchjarod
Parking Attendant
Posts: 16
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posted September 30, 2009 08:43 AM
quote:
quote:
ive been doing good off the line with the stock 12. muzzy full exaust, stock gears, lowerd, extended swingarm. quite a few good lights to. what can i do to start getting it quicker and keeping it an everyday riding bike? should i go get a power commander 1st? i still have the stock gears as well.
What are your #'s at the track?
The first thing that jumps out at me, is the gearing. That is a much, much bigger issue than the Power Commander at this point.
back in the hotter weather my first run with it was 10.20 @ 138
in july my best was 10.18 @ 139
then slacked off second pass that night with 10.26 @ 134
cut my best light in august, 006 then went to second and broke trac. that was 10.39 at ... well i cant remember the mph. lol
im running friday night so ill get you those numbers to so u can see wasup. dont think ill have my gears by then so ill be running a dunlop sportmax gp tire, same stock gears, lowered, pump gas, stock filters
____________
Real riders know the consequences, others..... just hear about them" -Dutchjarod
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Shane661
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Posts: 11494
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posted September 30, 2009 10:25 AM
Edited By: Shane661 on 30 Sep 2009 18:29
Keep an eye on your 60' and especially 330'. Are you are heavier rider? What is your track weather and elevation? Your mph seems low.
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dutchjarod
Parking Attendant
Posts: 16
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posted September 30, 2009 02:00 PM
quote:
Keep an eye on your 60' and especially 330'. Are you are heavier rider? What is your track weather and elevation? Your mph seems low.
tomorrow it will be like 77 degrees. it was rather warm those nights around 83. at fayetteville motorsports park its like 240 ft above sea level.
____________
Real riders know the consequences, others..... just hear about them" -Dutchjarod
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KZScott
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Posts: 7235
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posted September 30, 2009 02:46 PM
mph does indeed show how well the bike is running up top(and CR is flying for stock motor), but the initial launch may be impacted a lot without the correct AFR as you are not WOT (usually) and not in the rpm range right before red line(usually)
i do agree that gearing will make a huge gain over a PC. and your clutch will thank you(but you better be quick to shift)
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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Shane661
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Posts: 11494
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posted September 30, 2009 03:40 PM
No question that a bike could be made to run smoother with a good map and power commander. Unfortunately there seems to be more people providing garbage tuning than the real thing.
Shane
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KZScott
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Posts: 7235
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posted September 30, 2009 05:37 PM
would you run your bike with the brock pipe and no flies without a pc?
i bet CR could have better short times with a better tuned bike (again, it will have a very small impact compared to proper gearing)
im currently running 17 49 on my 12 with the billet low first. had good luck with 17 50 last yr, and 17 51 with the stock motor stock trans in 07 (till i destroyed 2nd) with that low of mph, i would say get it geared really low to try and launch it better as you probly wont run out of gear
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted October 01, 2009 05:04 AM
Edited By: Shane661 on 1 Oct 2009 15:35
quote:
would you run your bike with the brock pipe and no flies without a pc?
i bet CR could have better short times with a better tuned bike (again, it will have a very small impact compared to proper gearing)
im currently running 17 49 on my 12 with the billet low first. had good luck with 17 50 last yr, and 17 51 with the stock motor stock trans in 07 (till i destroyed 2nd) with that low of mph, i would say get it geared really low to try and launch it better as you probly wont run out of gear
The removal of secondary throttle plates changes the equation drastically, as I'm sure you are aware. But for just a stock bike, I wouldn't have any problem bolting on an exhaust.
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KZScott
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Posts: 7235
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posted October 01, 2009 07:23 AM
His 05 has the secondary plates too. Or maybe they are taken out?
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted October 01, 2009 07:29 AM
Edited By: Shane661 on 1 Oct 2009 15:31
quote:
His 05 has the secondary plates too. Or maybe they are taken out?
I am aware the 05 has secondary plates...but he didn't say they were removed, did he?
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dutchjarod
Parking Attendant
Posts: 16
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posted October 01, 2009 08:18 AM
quote:
His 05 has the secondary plates too. Or maybe they are taken out?
as far as i know they arent taken out. should they be removed? and whats the purpose?
____________
Real riders know the consequences, others..... just hear about them" -Dutchjarod
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted October 01, 2009 08:25 AM
Edited By: Shane661 on 1 Oct 2009 16:26
quote:
quote:
His 05 has the secondary plates too. Or maybe they are taken out?
as far as i know they arent taken out. should they be removed? and whats the purpose?
The purpose would be to remove the low rpm restriction in the intake. If you remove them, you would need a power commander and a custom map. It is a very common mod on the 14. Since only 04-05 12R's had them (in the USA, at least), it is not a commonly discussed modification.
I doubt they have been removed, but it is possible. You can check by removing the inspection plates located underneath the fuel tank.
Shane
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted October 01, 2009 08:30 AM
Edited By: Shane661 on 1 Oct 2009 16:31
Secondary thottle plates intact, and removed, from my 14:
Intact:
Removed (and with new velocity stacks):
[
You can see that removing the second set of plates removes restriction. They do not fully open until higher rpm, so it can compromise power at low rpm.
Shane
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Rock4173
Novice Class
Posts: 43
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posted October 01, 2009 11:42 AM
Shane is this your monster going back together
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