heb80
Parking Attendant
Posts: 8
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posted June 17, 2008 03:21 AM
I'm new here. I Just bought my 07 two weeks ago (with full knowledge of the recall). Last night I did my own torque check and frame inspection. I've only got 250 miles on it so I didn't expect any problems with the welds, but I checked them anyway by simply removing the lower/rear fairing and using a dental mirror. Then I proceded to check the torque. My collar removal torque's were 10 ft-lbs top and 15 ft-lbs bottom. Took about 45 min total.
I'll take the bike to the dealer this fall/winter to have them "officially" check it and punch the frame.
  
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monty0357
Parking Attendant
Posts: 1
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posted June 17, 2008 10:09 AM
my 06 had 2 engine bolts torqued to tight....well framed needed now..........a bit scary
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countersteer
Needs a job
Didn't read the owners manual
Posts: 2207
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posted June 17, 2008 04:08 PM
mine checked out fine today.
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Scott
Long Island, New York
2006 ZX-14, 2003 ZX-12R
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Suzukiguy
Parking Attendant
Posts: 16
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posted June 17, 2008 05:58 PM
quote:
quote:
[
Suzukiguy,
Was the torque on the 14 with the "correct" torque specifications right at the correct level or under? I'm wondering if it's a situation like Sticks & Stones was describing where it was over torqued or correctly torqued and the crack released some of that ft/lbs of pressure.
It was under, but not way under. I am not at work today so I can't look in the notes, but I think one was about 26-27 ft-lb and the other was about 22-23 ft-lb. I will report back tomorrow if that is way off.
It was actually 21.5 ft-lb and 16.5 ft-lb.
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Suzukiguy
Parking Attendant
Posts: 16
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posted June 17, 2008 06:03 PM
quote:
Better yet suzukiguy, how about a photo with a arrow showing the EXACT area you found your cracks? The kawi photos dont help, they are of a dissassembled bike.
When it comes to this kind of thing, there must not be ANY question about where the inspection takes place. Or in aviation inspection speak: "Unable to locate area of interest, please include applicable drawings and/or photos, along with proper 3 dimensional location."
I do have photos now and will try to post them, if I can't figure it out, I will email them to sticks and stones.
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fish_antlers
Administrator
The Truth is Out There
Posts: 21894
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posted June 17, 2008 06:19 PM
read the sticky.
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What business is it of yours where I'm from, Friendo?
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Suzukiguy
Parking Attendant
Posts: 16
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posted June 17, 2008 06:22 PM
quote:
Fish its just that I think this is a big problem than just over tightning of a few bolts. The shop manager told me no way they can assemble the bike in 9hrs there getting paid for by kawi. They get 4 hours for pulling the motor, now i just don't want them rushing parts everywhere and you think they are going to go through the manual and check every torque and spec???
I can't speak for other dealers out there, but I would rather lose my ass on doing the warranty jobs right than risk putting a bike together improperly. So yes we do torque every bolt to spec as it states in the manual and yes that does take significantly longer than 9 hours, but your safety and our reputation ar eon the line here.
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Suzukiguy
Parking Attendant
Posts: 16
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posted June 17, 2008 06:46 PM
quote:
I've read some others bring up their concerns regarding bike mods but has anyone else gotten a clear sense and assurance modifications whether performance or cosmetic will have no bearing on the eligibility of the bike to remain covered for the stated issue outlined in the recall notice for the long-term.
In a regular warranty situation if the mods directly contribute to the failure of a component it would not be covered under warranty. (If the dealer tells the manufacturer that there are mods. We normally don't volunteer this unless asked by the manufacturer if the bike is modded. Why would we want to piss the customer off, if we can prevent it?)
In the case of a recall however, it won't make any difference what mods you have done. If your frame has cracks that match the cracks in the recall bulletin then it would be covered.
Again I can't speak for other dealers, but the only person that will ride your bike while it's here is the Technician that worked on it and then it's only to verify his work and make sure it will be fine when you get it back. Your bike would have no more than 5-10 miles more on it than when it came in. I don't think any dealers out there are out "joy riding" customers machines. If they are, they need to be reported.
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stew1400
Parking Attendant
Posts: 1
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posted June 17, 2008 06:50 PM
Does anyone have the total count of bikes with cracked frames? Thanks so much for all the info on the subject. Great pics. I have an 06, with about 4500 miles on it. Bottom bolt came loose at about 22 ft.lbs top at about 16. Checked the welds and they look fine. I have been working on bikes and cars for over 35 years. My dealer here in North Alabama is Ray Metzler. He is a great guy with pretty good mechanics. But there is no way I could trust them to totally rebuild my bike. To make the most money most shops will quit working on the big job to do a quick job. The big jobs keep getting put aside so they can finish up with more bikes. Then when they get back to your bike you hope they have not lost thier train of thought. Just my two cents. Love the bike. Been a Kaw guy for a long time.
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Suzukiguy
Parking Attendant
Posts: 16
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posted June 17, 2008 07:38 PM
I am going to have to send them to Sticks-n-stones, I don't have the time right now to figure it out. I will try to send them tonight sometime sticks.
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shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted June 18, 2008 05:12 AM
Does anyone have access to a 2008 service manual? I am interested in the torque spec on the bolts and collars.
Shane
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northmedic
Expert Class
Posts: 384
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posted June 18, 2008 09:15 AM
 Edited By: northmedic on 18 Jun 2008 10:27
well my bike failed i am sitting at the dealer now and waiting for Kawi to call back
Shane661 i am looking at the torq specs collars is 11 lbs and 44 lbs this right out of the 2008 manual
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I,ll be right back
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Port_Angeles_Ninja
Expert Class
Posts: 388
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posted June 18, 2008 09:43 AM
The dealer just called me, my '07 with 10,000 miles checked out fine. it is ready to be picked up.
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Red/Black 85' GPZ900
Blue 07' ZX14
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ninjaboy311
Zone Head
Posts: 940
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posted June 18, 2008 10:13 AM
Just got back from checking mine. Mine is a 2006 ZX-14 drag race bike only, so I brought it in my trailer. The shop grabbed their tools and did the inspection in my trailer with me overlooking them. All torque values were correct, and no cracks were seen. I have over 600 drag strip passes on this bike, so I know I put alot of stress on my frame, but everything checked out ok for mine. Good luck to everyone who hasn't checked theirs yet!!
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Naarden Speedlinks Sponsored Rider
Schnitz Racing Sponsored Rider
8.74 @ 152 on stock motor and MR9 (Muzzy Powered), 205 lbs suited
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northmedic
Expert Class
Posts: 384
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posted June 18, 2008 11:36 AM
So the mechanic made a slight error due to the muzzy airshifter upper nut , he did not remove it so he was unable to get the bolt to break loose ,, so to my relief all has checked out ,
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I,ll be right back
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shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted June 18, 2008 12:11 PM
quote:
Shane661 i am looking at the torq specs collars is 11 lbs and 44 lbs this right out of the 2008 manual
Thanks man!
Shane
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zone 5
Parking Attendant
Posts: 3
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posted June 18, 2008 01:32 PM
Dealer just called. My 07 is in spec and ready to be picked up.
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butta4hc
Expert Class
Posts: 313
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posted June 18, 2008 02:28 PM
My bike went into the dealership on Wednesday, April 23rd. They said they started it on Tuesday, June 16. Eight weeks later. Told me the absolute worst day it will be done is Saturday, June 21st. We will see. I'm guessing I might be the first bike that will have the rebuild on a new frame completed. I will keep y'all posted on how good/bad of a job they did.
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Butta
Hot Commodities MC
Paterson, NJ
2006 Black ZX-14 - Recall Frame Swap, Full Muzzy GP Exhaust, PCIII, BMC Race Filter, Flies Out, Braided Front Brake & Cutch Lines, Muzzy's Radiator Fan, Engine Ice Coolant, Frame Sliders, SubFrame Sliders, Puig Dark Smoke Windscreen, Powerbronze Hugger, Cox Radiator Guard, Unswitched Powerlet Outlet under seat, Switched Powerlet Outlet On Right Duct Panel, Intergrated Tail Light, HID lights high and low beam, Blue corner marker lights, Eclipse License Plate Blackout Kit, Black Pazzo Levers, Scorpio Alarm, Lojack Theft Recovery System, Rapid Transit Triple Tree Bag, Cortech Tank, Tail & Saddle Bags and the bragging rights for being "The Fastest 14 In The Country" for a few weeks when the 14 made it's debut here in the states.
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warbird
Needs a job
Posts: 2739
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posted June 18, 2008 04:16 PM
Just inspected mine and all is well. Marked the bolts and frame and made sure the bolts did not move when I loosened the nuts. (Takes 2 people to do this right ) Remember the bolts loosen to the right and tighten to the left! It took 17 ft lbs to loosen the top bolt and 25 ft lbs to loosen the bottom. Retorqued the bolts to 11 ft lbs after loosening them up and 44 lbs on the nuts without the bolts moving ( again ) and inspected the welds very carfully with an led flashlight and mirror. The welds look fantastic. Now off to the dealership to let them repeat the process and inspect, and stamp the frame. Whew! 
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I'd Rather Be Roadracing.
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warbird
Needs a job
Posts: 2739
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posted June 18, 2008 05:25 PM
Sticks............you got those pictures yet from Suzukiguy?  Glad you like your CT's............look at my profile.............:wink
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I'd Rather Be Roadracing.
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shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted June 19, 2008 05:29 AM
Edited By: shane661 on 19 Jun 2008 06:30
quote:
other then an error that indicated my bike failed , as the mechanic didnt remove the muzzy airshifter upper nut and couldent break the bolt free , once done all checked out . My swing arm nut was checked and re torqed lol i was in the show room when that happened
The mechanic should not have attempted to loosen the bolt without removing the shifter. The nut side is where the bolt is to be loosened. If you try to loosen it from the bolt side it can crack the frame.
It sounds like you dodged a bullet there! Whew!
For anyone who attempts to do this themselves...DO NOT ATTEMPT TO LOOSEN THE BOLT FROM THE SIDE THAT REQUIRES AN ALLEN TO TURN! TURNING THE BOLT HEAD COUNTERCLOCKWISE WLL BACK OUT THE MOUNTING COLLAR AND MIGHT CRACK THE FRAME!
Ok, sorry to yell that, but it may save a frame.
Shane
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BobC
Pro
Posts: 1736
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posted June 19, 2008 05:55 AM
Ok, so Kawasaki finally stuck their hand up and admitted the problem in late May this year. I sent mail to Kawasaki UK asking about it and received a carefully worded "no comment".
This week the UK MCN finally ran the story and Kawasaki is set to recall customers bikes. They said Kawasaki has customer safety as a priority. They could have made it a slightly higher priority in my view. Just lucky there have been no serious accidents otherwise they might wish they had.
It's still a brilliant bike though and I hope this doesn't wreck it's reputation.
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Candy Thunder Blue 2006 ZZR1400
Stock wheelbase
Max: 205.4 mph in 1.25 miles
2012 ZZR1400 in Golden Blazed Green
Brock CT Full System. etc
Max: 203.1 in 1 mile (so far)
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fish_antlers
Administrator
The Truth is Out There
Posts: 21894
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posted June 19, 2008 07:48 AM
for once we actually beat MCN UK to a story!
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What business is it of yours where I'm from, Friendo?
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Sticks_n_Stones
Needs a job
Posts: 3930
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posted June 19, 2008 08:13 AM
Photos of 2 different cracked frames (both on R/H side)
An "anonymous" member sent me these photos to help with my ultrasonic inspection I'm working on to find the cracks before they break surface. He thought it would be useful if I posted them for him.
He also stated that he has found 2 bad frames so far, both on right hand side only. He is scheduled to inspect a couple more this week so the numbers for this one mechanic might go up still.
I'm really REALLY wondering how many more mechanics are finding this many cracks? Which means IMO that it could be as high as 20+% of the 14's out there are cracked.
I'm going to visit and call all the Kawi dealers I can to find me a frame to use as a test standard to verify if my inspection works. Not as easy as it sounds, because I have to find a way to inspect it with the basic equipment that most NDT shops all have. I'll keep you all informed.
   
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'06 zx14
Muzzy M10/M14
PCIII w/ Muzzy map
Flies out K&N in!
bits n pieces...
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Sticks_n_Stones
Needs a job
Posts: 3930
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posted June 19, 2008 08:24 AM
Couple things an experienced eye will notice: first of all,the cracks are happening at the weld, not the comparitively flimsy lug which actually attaches to the engine. A sign that the weld itself was of poor quality.
Second, the area that would crack first is the forward side of the weld, which if you look is also cracked in the very center of the weld. That is a sign of poor weld penetration.
Third, the way the crack stays confined almost entirely to the weld area itself tells me that the wrong welding rod was used. I've seen that alot, on purpose and not, were the welder or the weld shop gets it in there head that they only need to use one type of welding rod for all aluminums. Wrong, as you see here when that is done the lower strength aluminum in the rod just becomes the week point.
If it is indeed the wrong welding rod being used, that also means that it is basically impossible to reweld it without COMPLETELY grinding out the entire weld area and refilling it. And if you want high strength, filling an area that sized is a pipe dream unless you have the proper facilities.
But, on the not so bright side, it just simplified my inspection technique I'm writing.
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'06 zx14
Muzzy M10/M14
PCIII w/ Muzzy map
Flies out K&N in!
bits n pieces...
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