psycho1122
Pro
Posts: 1608
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posted May 18, 2006 06:18 AM
I have some engine work and did not post!
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TRNorBRN6001
Needs a job
Posts: 2021
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posted May 18, 2006 06:42 AM
All my feeble knowledge is second hand. I could think of very little on my own.
But I do own a 12 and it will be a stroker, mostly on the street. I had a custom
radiator made for it and will be using an after market fan. I have also taken
other steps to insure it's cool running here in Texas. I had the head done
by carpenter and since I have only seen a handfull of ZX-12 heads i'd have to
say it was down right perty. I do have to admit unfortunately that even though I
own a 12 I know more about Busas than 12s, but I am always learning.
I have a soft spot for big motors so I just kind of want everyone to have one.
Guess I have to realize it just ain't for everyone.
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Y2KZX12R
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posted May 18, 2006 09:02 AM
1375 here.
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supra5677
Pro
Posts: 1279
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posted May 18, 2006 09:34 AM
just a little compression
and cam timing here
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mlb
Novice Class
Posts: 48
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posted May 18, 2006 11:48 AM
To be honest I don't really care if anyone has built a monster motor of their own or not. I'm interested in opinions becasue the way I see it wheter you've built a bigger motor or not you've probably thought about it and since I'm getting ready to take that plung I wanted to get as many opinions as I could in the event someone else has thought about something I overlooked etc. Besides it's normally not to hard to tell when someone starts just spouting crap and that advise is just overlooked, ie claim well with this small change you'll make an extra 50 hp... So far I think everyone's comments have been right on track with what I'm looking for. Thanks
At this point I'm leaning heavily towards the 1290 one becasue I can do it the cheapest and two it's a little bigger than the Muzzy 1270. Anyone know of a detractor to the 1290 over the 1270? I decided against the stroke just because I do ride the bike A LOT on the street and don't want to lose that ridability or have to mess with 24 volt starter systems etc. It's not that I couldn't do it I just don't want to. I think I'll give carpenter a call and see if he's willing to do a port polish only on the head and go from there.
Is evereyone pretty much in agreement on the 105/103 settings for the cams, what's stock? I assume 105 on the intake and 103 on exhaust.
How about injectors are the factory ones going to hold up to that build as well as a 50 - 100 shot of gas (only for the track) or should I look into some 400-450's? My only issue with doing so is it will greatly effect the maps and would put me in a position where I think I should go to a standalone engine management solution and I don't want to go that route, if I did that would push me back towards turbo since the hard work would already be done (mapping the SEM). I do plan to upgrade the fuel pump, probably to the muzzy pump and am really considering going to the muzzy stealth nitrous kit whick would solve the problem at least for while on gas.
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ninja12
Needs a job
Posts: 3310
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posted May 18, 2006 12:11 PM
Sounds like a good plan,
I've never Sprayed a 1290 but I heard of a few head gasket
problems with i never experienced with 1270 or 1361.
Not pushing the 1270/1272 but they seem to be rock solid for everything.
Might want to see who has sprayed 100hp on a 1290 and how long it
stayed together. 50-60hp i don't think you will have a problem.
If you are doing you own work it probably won't matter,
just put a spare head gasket on the shelf just in case.
I think a couple of the 1317 guys have had head gasket problems without spray.
If you are going 1290 with big spray you might want to look into studs.
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supra5677
Pro
Posts: 1279
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posted May 18, 2006 12:13 PM
Cams don't come degreed from the factory.. They could be anywhere. However I believe the factory specs are 104/102.. I think Muzzy did over 600 dyno sessions to come up with 105/103.. I dig it..
As far as injectors. The 2004-2005 zx10r and zx12r run 395cc per minute injectors. These are larger than the 2000-2003 injectors.. They are big enough to handle ANYTHING.
Also what year is your bike? The fuel pump was made better in the 2002 plus models..
supra
p.s. and yes 105 is the intake and 103 is the exhaust
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TRNorBRN6001
Needs a job
Posts: 2021
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posted May 18, 2006 01:36 PM
Get a hold of Mad Mike he has some studds. Stealth system is nice
if you do not mind the expense, but other people have done systems
without. I have seen three different approaches to a wet system for
the 12.
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zxlnt
Needs a job
Kawpuke Extraordinare
Posts: 2853
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posted May 18, 2006 03:13 PM
I have a 1270 motor degreed cams, velocity stacks, little bit of headwork...
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Y2KZX12R
Needs a job
CompetitionCNC.com
Posts: 3762
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posted May 18, 2006 04:13 PM
In 2000 and for quite some time Muzzy was telling everyone 105/100.
If youhave any doubt about fuel delivery from the pump get a GSS342. Its from a buick GN turbo or a Mustang gt fron the 80's. Me being a Chevy guy i tell people its a GM buick GN fuel pump. 
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osti33
Needs a job
Posts: 2973
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posted May 18, 2006 04:27 PM
quote:
I have some engine work and did not post!
LOL! Me too. 
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supra5677
Pro
Posts: 1279
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posted May 18, 2006 06:14 PM
Dave Turner at Muzzys told me 105/103 on the phone 10 times. There's an old post from Rob Muzzy that says 105/103.
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Y2KZX12R
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posted May 19, 2006 01:54 AM
 Edited By: Y2KZX12R on 19 May 2006 10:11
Supra, i'm talking 5-6 years ago they were telling everyone 105/100.
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supra5677
Pro
Posts: 1279
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posted May 19, 2006 05:19 AM
I know I remember from zx-12r.org..
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supra5677
Pro
Posts: 1279
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posted May 19, 2006 05:19 AM
I know I remember from zx-12r.org..
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entropy
Moderator
Posts: 8671
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posted May 19, 2006 05:24 AM
quote:
Supra, i'm talking 5-6 years ago they were telling everyone 105/100.
Yep, I used the Muzzy recommended 105/100 on my 1361 in 2001-2002; running 107/110 now, but with a MUCH different setup.
IMO, i really doubt you could tell the difference between 105/100 and 105/103 without some very careful back-to-back dyno testing.
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Y2KZX12R
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Posts: 3762
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posted May 19, 2006 05:57 AM
Edited By: Y2KZX12R on 19 May 2006 07:17
quote:
IMO, i really doubt you could tell the difference between 105/100 and 105/103 without some very careful back-to-back dyno testing.
Yea, your talking a couple hp here and there when moving the exhaust cam around..
But, moving the intake cam around makes much more of a difference on the 12r. The power from 3000-9000 is very much improved as you advance the intake cam. Were talking about as much as 6-8 hp in some places and the top end cost is just a couple of hp.
A nice tradeoff on the street. But the piston to valve clearance gets even closer. With 102.5 intake cam timing and the gasket under the block removed I had to flycut the intake valve reliefs on the pistons .015" to get back to .030" piston to valve clearance.
It made alot more midrange power then and it lost 2 hp or so up top at peak. A nice trade off.
Right now i have the cams on the 1375 at 105.5/102.5 I think. Damn i'd have to look at my notes to make sure now. All these numbers start to swirl around after a while.
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entropy
Moderator
Posts: 8671
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posted May 19, 2006 06:11 AM
Jim,
off topic..,
Early this week. i was back in Mass seeing my 89YO Mom, and as usual I had to dash-drive back to Houston, no time for any diversions.
One o' these days i just gotta stop by yr place have some beers and bike-BS. All that bike expertise (you and DaveO) are soooooooo close to my Mom's place in Charlton, MA, and i never seem to make it happen. Dumb-ass, me.
next time, beer & steamers on me!
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Y2KZX12R
Needs a job
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posted May 19, 2006 06:14 AM
Hell yea, any time just let me know. I'm always up for steamers and beer! You went right by me on I-84 in waterbury CT. Next time.
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Y2KZX12R
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entropy
Moderator
Posts: 8671
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posted May 19, 2006 06:21 AM
yep, went thru Waterbury at 4am in the rain on Monday 
(it rained all the way till my daughter & I got to western Kentucky)
beah n' steama's, ayuh
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Y2KZX12R
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CompetitionCNC.com
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posted May 19, 2006 06:32 AM
Edited By: Y2KZX12R on 19 May 2006 07:33
I usually do most of my steamer eating in Maine. We have a cottage on the ocean at Popham Beach and dig them in the front yard.
If your ever in Maine let me know.
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mlb
Novice Class
Posts: 48
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posted May 19, 2006 08:20 AM
Nex time I'm in Maine I may look you up too Looks like a nice place with a great view.
The bike is a 2000 I'm the second owner. The original owner is a friend of mine so I believe what he's told me about the bike. The only thing that's been done to it up to now was he had the head shaved, I'm not sure exactly how much but knowing that I'll definately watch the valve clearance.
Does that fuel pump fit nice and neat inside the tank etc and what are the flow differences? As for studs I had already planned on those as well as valve springs, beefed up transmission, and clutch, moving the drain plug on the oil pan, (doesn't MM do a good job on that one) etc. Any other area's I should look at beefing up while it's apart.
For suspension who does everyone send theirs to. I'm more than capable of rebuilding forks but I want to have them resprung (been strapped way to long) and probably revalved as well. Same for shock, is it worth having the factory one redone or should I just bite the bullet and buy the Olhins?
Thanks
BTW the tear dwon will probably start this weekend so here we go...
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Y2KZX12R
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posted May 19, 2006 08:54 AM
This is the bay side, yea nice view. The Kennebeck river runs by that civil war fort in the background and the 600 or so foot aegis cruisers go buy quite often.
The pump fits nice yes. But it does takes some small modifications to mount it. Its the 190LPH version of the gss307 thats in the Muzzy kit.
I have used Racetech suspension stuff. i'm 210 lbs and 1.0 fork springs are right for me.
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NOS1290
Expert Class
Posts: 103
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posted May 19, 2006 09:22 AM
For What its worth...
I have been running a 1290 with a 125 shot, megacycle cams (100/105 timing) and headwork. I beat the snot out of it every weekend at the dragstrip, and once in a while at Maxton. I overtorque my headbolts by 5 ft lbs and have never had a problem with headgaskets. I even frequently reuse the headgaskets as well. No problems. In contrast I have never been able to keep a cylinder head for longer than 1 season. Spring pressure is now up to 70 lbs and I still manage to drop, float or melt off valves.??? I think the rap against 3mm overbores comes from the Busa guys. They have always had problems with gasket leaks at bigger bores.
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TRNorBRN6001
Needs a job
Posts: 2021
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posted May 19, 2006 10:35 AM
Nos 1290 what did you keep your C/R at? Do ya run any special fuel? Is that
125 shot on progressive or do ya just let it kick?
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