psycho1122
Pro
Posts: 1608
|
posted March 14, 2006 06:29 AM
 Edited By: psycho1122 on 14 Mar 2006 06:30
entropy;
With the size of your engine and it's V.E. in conjunction with the testing I did on the dyno....The Hans is less restrictive. I saw 3-4 h.p. SITTING STILL. With a stock, piped and PC'd engine.
The Hans also NEVER achieved Ambient in ANY road testing. The stocker recovers as soon as 40 m.p.h. This leads me to ask you how well is your Ram Air system and OE snorkel sealed? I took a suggestion from Mr. Meyer and made a plug for my OE snorkel to pressurize the system to find all the extensive leaks. This made a dramatic improvement in how well the OE snorkel performed!
I still would like to see some "control" in you numbers. The sensor should give you a reading when ignition is on with engine off. I used that as a control for EVERY run.
Keep it comming...Good stuff!  Just wait untill you see how much the pressure drops at high speeds with the Hans! 
____________
You say PSYCHO like it's a BAD thing!!
  
|
TRNorBRN6001
Needs a job
Posts: 2021
|
posted March 14, 2006 09:59 AM
Cool info, that Monster Motor sure likes to suck in that air. That might be one reason for a longer negative pressure. Would be real cool to see what the difference is at 200mph. I still believe that from the data shown that at higher speeds the Hans should still out perform the OE snorkel. That would then bring a better return on a Hans investment.
Either way that Ram Air affect sure is nice at speed. I can not complain with an additional
5-10HP at 200mph.
Entropy if ya like we can lower that front fender and throw on a low profile tire so ya don't end
up like George.
____________
TFA 200MPH CLUB MEMBER!
|
tuusinii
Pro
Posts: 1031
|
posted March 14, 2006 11:31 AM
quote:
here is some data on OEM vs Hans (this AIN'T gonna format right)
10.7rpm 10.5rpm mph
OEM RAM 75mph 152mph delta "hg delta 1/8, 1/4
5-Mar-06 29.80 30.20 0.40 26.900
5-Mar-06 29.40 30.00 0.60 27.500
10-Mar-06 29.00 29.60 0.60 cutting out ??
10-Mar-06 29.20 29.70 0.50 27.400
10-Mar-06 29.20 29.80 0.60 ran low on fuel
ave 0.54 27.27
I have couple of questions about Your wonderful data that You have gathered. What are the numbers? The way I read it is like this:
1st Date
2nd pressure at 75MPH
3rd Pressure at 152MPH
4th Pressure difference between 2nd and 3rd
But whats the last number?
|
entropy
Moderator
Posts: 8671
|
posted March 14, 2006 04:04 PM
quote:
quote:
here is some data on OEM vs Hans (this AIN'T gonna format right)
10.7rpm 10.5rpm mph
OEM RAM 75mph 152mph delta "hg delta 1/8, 1/4
5-Mar-06 29.80 30.20 0.40 26.900
5-Mar-06 29.40 30.00 0.60 27.500
10-Mar-06 29.00 29.60 0.60 cutting out ??
10-Mar-06 29.20 29.70 0.50 27.400
10-Mar-06 29.20 29.80 0.60 ran low on fuel
ave 0.54 27.27
I have couple of questions about Your wonderful data that You have gathered. What are the numbers? The way I read it is like this:
1st Date
2nd pressure at 75MPH
3rd Pressure at 152MPH
4th Pressure difference between 2nd and 3rd
But whats the last number?
last number is the incremental mph between 1/8 & 1/4
(sorry about the format, cut paste from excel...)
____________
This moderator uses moderation in moderation
|
entropy
Moderator
Posts: 8671
|
posted March 14, 2006 04:06 PM
quote:
Entropy if ya like we can lower that front fender and throw on a low profile tire so ya don't end
up like George.
G.
what caused George's get off???G.
____________
This moderator uses moderation in moderation
|
TRNorBRN6001
Needs a job
Posts: 2021
|
posted March 14, 2006 04:20 PM
According George he hit the brakes to hard at the end and locked it up, but that battery up
front under the head light that he had installed was real close to that fender. Ya didn't hear
that from me though as it might be a sensitve issue.
Just Curious is your Hans the old rectangular one or the V-tangular one?
____________
TFA 200MPH CLUB MEMBER!
|
Marcos Peguero
Zone Head
Posts: 568
|
posted March 14, 2006 05:05 PM
for me 450 USD for only that % of power is a little hard.
|
tuusinii
Pro
Posts: 1031
|
posted March 14, 2006 11:13 PM
quote:
last number is the incremental mph between 1/8 & 1/4
(sorry about the format, cut paste from excel...)
You mean that it is MPH:s? A difference in speed between speed at 1/8 and speed at 1/4?
|
entropy
Moderator
Posts: 8671
|
posted March 14, 2006 11:21 PM
yep!
____________
This moderator uses moderation in moderation
|
psycho1122
Pro
Posts: 1608
|
posted March 15, 2006 04:36 AM
Edited By: psycho1122 on 15 Mar 2006 04:38
entropy;
I feel your test at this time is inconclusive. No offence, however you have not provided the control (ambient) # before each test.
Also, is your OE snorkel/air box sealed? This makes a considerable difference!
This could be a strech....maybe someone could chime in here (Doug?). Could the V.E. of your engine affect Air Box efficiency?
I do agree that the Hans is less restrictive and could help a larger engine at low speeds, however it still did not reach ambient at any time in your testing. You would also need static #'s from a dyno session to see how much you are recovering from vaccum.
____________
You say PSYCHO like it's a BAD thing!!
|
TRNorBRN6001
Needs a job
Posts: 2021
|
posted March 15, 2006 07:08 AM
Most certainly his big monster of a motor has a different affect on air box volume.
I do agree further testing is needed and there are too many variables that can not be kept constant, but this is an excellent base.
As far as the price is concerned when your motor is as maxed out as can be those last few 1-2HP do come at a heavy price, but do add up in the end to make a difference. I would say that in the drag race world with Entropy's current data the hans would be somewhat equivilent HP/$ wise to bored TB's, lighter rims, ceramic bearings, or even them velocity stacks that should not give you any HP gain.
Hope we can do some 200mph testing at the Texas Mile in October.
____________
TFA 200MPH CLUB MEMBER!
|
entropy
Moderator
Posts: 8671
|
posted March 15, 2006 10:44 AM
Edited By: entropy on 15 Mar 2006 10:52
Good thread!
I certainly appreciate the dialog and i do agree that the data is not absolutely conclusive.
However, I am completely convinced that:
1. at worst, the Hans is just as good as the OEM up to 155mph (as fast as I have info)
2. at best, the Hans increases my 1/8 to 1/4 incremental mph by .4-.7 mph
The airbox was carefully (with silcone) sealed.
The fluid dynamics of the intake is WAY, WAY more complex than I can handle.
How will it work at 200mph?? who knows. Maybe TRNBRN will see in Oct 
____________
This moderator uses moderation in moderation
|
psycho1122
Pro
Posts: 1608
|
posted March 15, 2006 01:00 PM
I agree, very good dialog!
The .4 - .7 m.p.h. you saw could be gained just from improved Ambient conditions (running on a different day).
O.K. - Air Box was sealed. How were you able to address all the air that bleeds out at the filter slots?
How about your O.E. snorkel assm.? Mine leaked all over the place! I had to go through extensive measures to get it tight.
The top speed testing will be very "interesting".
Thanks Guys!
____________
You say PSYCHO like it's a BAD thing!!
|
FearsomeK
Novice Class
Posts: 96
|
posted March 15, 2006 01:01 PM
On the dyno my 12 picked up 4 hp with the Hans. More importantly, it held peak hp ALL the way to redline with zero fall off in each gear.
In the 1/4 that MUST make a difference.
I hear what many say about ultimate top end performance and this info adds fuel to the fire. My guts told me it made a difference and the top speed tickets also which were much better, but that is not scientific.
|
psycho1122
Pro
Posts: 1608
|
posted March 15, 2006 01:09 PM
Fearsome; Very True!
I had the SAME results on the Dyno. However, STATIC is a different world.
The Hans is less restrictive overall. The difference is how it breaks the rules of ram pressure. It grabbs too much air and it has to speed up to get through the frame tubes.
The OE snorkel is smaller and air slows down as it passes through the tubes.
____________
You say PSYCHO like it's a BAD thing!!
|
entropy
Moderator
Posts: 8671
|
posted March 15, 2006 02:19 PM
Edited By: entropy on 15 Mar 2006 14:24
quote:
I agree, very good dialog!
The .4 - .7 m.p.h. you saw could be gained just from improved Ambient conditions (running on a different day).
O.K. - Air Box was sealed. How were you able to address all the air that bleeds out at the filter slots?
How about your O.E. snorkel assm.? Mine leaked all over the place! I had to go through extensive measures to get it tight.
psycho,
To get the .4 -.7 incremental:
1. I selected the passes with 1/8 mph = 125.0 to 125.9
2. threw out the outliers, e.g. 159mph (strong tailwind + v gd air), (148mph bearings going S.).
3. got 7 with Hans, 10 or so with OEM.
4. I averaged the 7, and the 10 and compared them
air leaking out filter slots
After reading your posts on leaky intake some time ago, I taped off the filter slots with that aluminum AC tape (really cool stuff)
OEM leakage
tried my best to silicone it up; PITA that was. Maybe didn't get it perfectly???
4 years ago a Busa pal and I (both 6' 3", 230# nekkid (but NOT when together! ) ) were having a contest and we were tied at 201mph on GPS. his 1397 vs my 1361.
I bought the Hans to get that last mph, but the last time we ran it was still 201 vs 201. Go figure.
____________
This moderator uses moderation in moderation
|
TRNorBRN6001
Needs a job
Posts: 2021
|
posted March 15, 2006 02:20 PM
I do not think entropy runs filters and has just sealed up the slots.
I am still on the other side of the fence, I do believe the hans will work better at higher speeds. I do believe the air box serves as the area that will stack the air to build pressure or slow it down if you will.
____________
TFA 200MPH CLUB MEMBER!
|
|
|
HOME
NEW TOPIC