MotoCycho
Expert Class
Posts: 337
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posted October 07, 2013 12:17 PM
ECU Reflash... $75 or $375... did I just waste $300?
Just got my ECU re-flash back from Brock's on Friday. With the shipping and insurance I spent over $400. Just saw that Schnitz is doing ECU flashing now in another thread so I went to the Schnitz website and sure enough.. $75 gets you what appears to be the same ECU re-flash. I can't help but feel taken a little at this point. 
http://store.schnitzracing.com/schnitz-ecu-reflash-kawasaki-zx14-12-13/
Now I don't want to sound petty.. I was fully aware of what I was buying and I also appreciate the research that went into making this possible.. but $300?.. that's 5 times cheaper... and not made in China. Kinda bummed is all. 
  
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1badzx12r
Needs a life
Posts: 8321
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posted October 07, 2013 01:46 PM
 Edited By: 1badzx12r on 7 Oct 2013 21:47
sucker
brock not gonna be happy with ryan
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S06nIz4scvI
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Seno
Pro
BANNED FOR LIFE!
Posts: 1230
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posted October 07, 2013 02:57 PM
All flashes are not created equal. If schnitz is flashing his own its probably not the same flash.... I tied up my bike with ECUleashed over the 2012 winter and after all was said and done, I forked over $300+ for Ivan to send mine out and have Guhl do it. Shit happens man, you know if Brock's did it, it will be good and if there is an upgraded flash you will be able to get that. It's only money and you made an investment in your machine... Enjoy it!
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2012 Black 14R -> Completely done!
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smokinstorm
Zone Head
Old Drag Racer
Posts: 504
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posted October 07, 2013 03:21 PM
If it's any consolation I believe Guhl will reflash it for you for free if you need upgrades down the road. At least he told me I wouldn't have to pay again if I wanted my rev limiter moved up to what he recommended in the first place.
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2009 Monster Edition ZX14
It's all stock I swear. Well...almost.
2005 Turbo Busa
2001 GSXR 1000
Looking for a 1985 GS1150E
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gobrian77
Novice Class
Posts: 43
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posted October 07, 2013 04:06 PM
Anyone's flash can be read and copied with the Woolich harness and software (I've got the set-up)- someone could have easily read another tuners numbers and might now be selling the tune as their own- this info isn't copyrighted as far as I know.
I bought a flash from a tuner- he asked me not to share it and I respect that, but not everyone will look at their new map in the same way.
Once the 14R ECU was finally unlocked, this was bound to happen.
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MotoCycho
Expert Class
Posts: 337
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posted October 07, 2013 04:46 PM
quote:
Anyone's flash can be read and copied with the Woolich harness and software (I've got the set-up)- someone could have easily read another tuners numbers and might now be selling the tune as their own- this info isn't copyrighted as far as I know.
I bought a flash from a tuner- he asked me not to share it and I respect that, but not everyone will look at their new map in the same way.
Once the 14R ECU was finally unlocked, this was bound to happen.
Yeah.. good point. I am OK with paying Brock and Don Guhl since I know they did the hard work. Just seriously bummed about the amount of $ in the price diff of course. If it was a little closer... like maybe $100 difference.. meh.. it's only money, right?
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gobrian77
Novice Class
Posts: 43
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posted October 07, 2013 05:00 PM
I agree with you, but with the new 'map sharing' feature released by Woolich last weekend (which will allow anyone to upload a map they've created and share it with any other registered user for free), sooner or later all the best maps will be available for anyone with the tuning harness- granted, they won't be fine-tuned on a dyno, but they'll be close enough for bikes with similar mods.
I can download a map and upload it to my bike in a few minutes, and the tuning harness and stock maps (which you need to get started) cost ~$450 (or less), and from there you're able to change and alter your ECU as you see fit.
All due respect to Brock and Guhl, but others will build on what they've done and release their own versions at much lower prices (or free). Tuners will have to ask their clients not to share their maps, which hopefully will be honored, but if some guy builds his own awesome map and just decides to release it without compensation, that will greatly impact the market.
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trganey
Expert Class
Posts: 196
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posted October 08, 2013 03:12 AM
The suzuki guys have been doing this for years and no one that I know of is trying to sell their tune. I think Woolich has the right idea! He's making the tools to do it with and couldn't care less what tune anyone runs or who they share it with. I just hate that it's taken this long to get the tools out to the general public so we can finally tune our own like the zuk guys have been doing all along. jes my .o2
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gobrian77
Novice Class
Posts: 43
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posted October 08, 2013 04:05 AM
^
Absolutely.
I live in Thailand, and there was no way I was gonna chance sending my ECU on a return trip to the States, and there are no local tuners who have the tools to map a 14R ECU (a couple can map a PC-V, but I wouldn't trust them with my bike)- the Woolich set-up was perfect for me, and I was able to upload the flash myself.
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1badzx12r
Needs a life
Posts: 8321
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posted October 08, 2013 06:32 AM
Edited By: 1badzx12r on 8 Oct 2013 14:32
quote:
The suzuki guys have been doing this for years and no one that I know of is trying to sell their tune.
I wonder why zuki guys still use power commanders ..
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S06nIz4scvI
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trganey
Expert Class
Posts: 196
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posted October 08, 2013 10:30 AM
quote:
quote:
The suzuki guys have been doing this for years and no one that I know of is trying to sell their tune.
I wonder why zuki guys still use power commanders ..
Could be for the same reason that I still have a Bazzaz with Auto tune on mine. You can put an all 0's map in the Bazzaz and set your desired AFR then ride it and see what the Bazzaz is calling for and tune it with the Woolich. Granted the Woolich is a lot more defined in the lower rpm range but you can get in the ball park and then fill in the gaps. At least that is my plans. jes my .o2
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1badzx12r
Needs a life
Posts: 8321
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posted October 08, 2013 03:19 PM
from my little time with busa ecu editor the fuel maps took to long to adjust .lot faster with a PC3 or Bazzaz to map . plus nobody could tell me what percentage the numbers was in a ecu fuel map table. like if you had a 50 and went to a 100 did you just double the fuel output..
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S06nIz4scvI
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madnessracing
Pro
Vmax and Busa Beater
Posts: 1140
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posted October 09, 2013 07:40 PM
no one will give a better re-flash than guhl!
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Shorty's Performance
Team Madness Racing
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kingtramp
Expert Class
Posts: 121
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posted October 14, 2013 02:13 PM
Not complaining BUT GUHL made a statemnet to some of their customers that flashing software would be come availible to sell to the public back in 2009 WHEN I FIRST HAD MY 2006 ECU FLASHED. Sad to say that never happen. WHAT is UP GUHL?
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CajunBoyz
Zone Head
Posts: 702
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posted October 14, 2013 04:02 PM
quote:
Not complaining BUT GUHL made a statemnet to some of their customers that flashing software would be come availible to sell to the public back in 2009 WHEN I FIRST HAD MY 2006 ECU FLASHED. Sad to say that never happen. WHAT is UP GUHL?
Hate to Admit it, but You are CORRECT, He had promised that it would come out, & didn't..
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"Cajun Boyz with Bad Ass Toys"
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Seno
Pro
BANNED FOR LIFE!
Posts: 1230
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posted October 16, 2013 04:58 AM
quote:
quote:
Not complaining BUT GUHL made a statemnet to some of their customers that flashing software would be come availible to sell to the public back in 2009 WHEN I FIRST HAD MY 2006 ECU FLASHED. Sad to say that never happen. WHAT is UP GUHL?
Hate to Admit it, but You are CORRECT, He had promised that it would come out, & didn't..
Think about how much more money he is making now... He would have to be a fool to release it, or rich. Once a couple more options turn up for "flashing your own" his will be released, until then he will be laughing all the way to the bank...
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2012 Black 14R -> Completely done!
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kingtramp
Expert Class
Posts: 121
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posted October 16, 2013 12:55 PM
quote:
quote:
quote:
Not complaining BUT GUHL made a statemnet to some of their customers that flashing software would be come availible to sell to the public back in 2009 WHEN I FIRST HAD MY 2006 ECU FLASHED. Sad to say that never happen. WHAT is UP GUHL?
Hate to Admit it, but You are CORRECT, He had promised that it would come out, & didn't..
Think about how much more money he is making now... He would have to be a fool to release it, or rich. Once a couple more options turn up for "flashing your own" his will be released, until then he will be laughing all the way to the bank...
Well as for waiting for the release, that is readily availible from WOOLICH RACING COVERS ZX14'S 2006-2014, IT IS WHAT IT IS,
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Romans
Expert Class
Posts: 294
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posted October 22, 2013 03:25 AM
quote:
Just got my ECU re-flash back from Brock's on Friday. With the shipping and insurance I spent over $400. Just saw that Schnitz is doing ECU flashing now in another thread so I went to the Schnitz website and sure enough.. $75 gets you what appears to be the same ECU re-flash. I can't help but feel taken a little at this point.
http://store.schnitzracing.com/schnitz-ecu-reflash-kawasaki-zx14-12-13/
Now I don't want to sound petty.. I was fully aware of what I was buying and I also appreciate the research that went into making this possible.. but $300?.. that's 5 times cheaper... and not made in China. Kinda bummed is all.
Guys Please keep in mind no timing map or fueling map comes with this flash.
Brock is giving you his timing map but no fueling.
Don Ghul gives timing and fuel. Also offers a Dual set up Flash. High & Low Hybrid E-85, both come with fuel and timing. Very nice when comparing apples to apples.
Beware this bike does run lean in the bottom with flies open. 16 AFR Not uncommon. all depending when Ryan has flies set to open. Hope this helps cheers.
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2012 ZX-14 R Turbo, 2010 ZX-14 Turbo, 2007 ZX-14, 2009 ZX-6R, YZ 450F
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