08smokes
Expert Class
God is love.
Posts: 113
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posted December 31, 2012 09:50 PM
Don't just talk about it, post some pics of your results to show you've done the work.
  
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eklipse636
Needs a life
ZX-14
Posts: 6046
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posted December 31, 2012 11:07 PM
quote:
My comments here in this forum are for the benefit of other readers and are mostly on topic. I weigh things carefully so as to not mislead anyone and to save other people the trouble of having to do it. I make sure my posts are accurate and have both good spelling and good grammar (but maybe not perfect).
Here is a link to the definition of troll. I don't seem to fit this definition based on my posts here in this forum.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_(Internet)
The only person your helping is yourself. You must really like to hear yourself talk (or type)
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Best: 60ft 1.351 1/8 5.68 mph 123.98 1/4
8.89 mph 151.32
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Wheelie
Needs a life
Old Man
Posts: 6902
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posted January 01, 2013 03:33 AM
quote:
quote:
My comments here in this forum are for the benefit of other readers and are mostly on topic. I weigh things carefully so as to not mislead anyone and to save other people the trouble of having to do it. I make sure my posts are accurate and have both good spelling and good grammar (but maybe not perfect).
Here is a link to the definition of troll. I don't seem to fit this definition based on my posts here in this forum.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_(Internet)
The only person your helping is yourself. You must really like to hear yourself talk (or type)
He's a Troll.
wee
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mick46
Expert Class
Posts: 112
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posted January 01, 2013 06:07 AM
It would appear he is a dick who doesn't know anything about motorcycles !
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2012 ZZR-1400
Alien Frogskin Green
Brocks CT Meg, PCV & QuickShifter, Brembo M4 Monoblocs, Grimeca 320mm discs, Nitron Race shock, Gilles rearsets , adjusters and TCA axle nut, Supersprox 42T, DID nickel plate X-ring, HEL brake lines, bar risers, shorty levers, tail tidy, Zero Gravity screen, RandG spools and bar ends, GPR V4 damper.... Done !
1999 Hayabusa , stretched lowered and a 60 shot !
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weighmaster
Expert Class
Posts: 301
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posted January 01, 2013 09:06 AM
I know enough about motorcycles that sometimes I even correct the guys at the local MC shop. I caught them several times saying wrong things and I corrected them right away.
Just because someone sets up a bike for less that maximum HP doesn't mean they do not know what they are doing. I could spend thousands of dollars more to maybe get 10 more HP out of my machine but it is not worth it. For example, if someone pays $5000 for a used ZX-14 that is 167 RWHP that is $30 per HP. If a top notch pipe with a PC and some fancy tuning and dyno testing cost $1000 more and yields 17 more RWHP, that is $60 per additional HP which is double price and not really worth it to me. That is being "generous" too because sometimes all that stuff only adds about 10 RWHP which would make it $100 per additional HP.
So let the accusations fly. I can easily defend myself with logic and good examples.
Funny because the guy that stated I don't know anything about motorcycle has Supersprox 42T listed in his "signature" which is the same one I ordered several months ago before I even knew about this forum. Ha ha ha.
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entropy
Moderator
Posts: 8671
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posted January 01, 2013 11:10 AM
quote:
I know enough about motorcycles that sometimes I even correct the guys at the local MC shop.
I caught them several times saying wrong things and I corrected them right away.
Excellent! 
Many really smart people are inconsiderate and don't take the time to correct others.
I sure hope they thanked you.
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This moderator uses moderation in moderation
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Lucky14
Pro
Posts: 1439
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posted January 01, 2013 11:11 AM
quote:
I know enough about motorcycles that sometimes I even correct the guys at the local MC shop .........blah, blah, blah ...................
For example, if someone pays $5000 for a used ZX-14 that is 167 RWHP that is .....blah, blah, blah.....................
So let the accusations fly. I can easily make up crap to convince myself .........blah, blah, blah
Ha ha ha.......blah, blah, blah.............
FIXED............... 
____________
You only need two tools: WD-40 and Duct Tape.
If it doesn't move and should, use the WD-40.
If it shouldn't move and does, use the duct tape.
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weighmaster
Expert Class
Posts: 301
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posted January 01, 2013 04:07 PM
Loser is correct. My bike is losing weight almost every day. Probably close to 500 pounds with a gallon of gas in it. A few more weight saving mods and I should be in the high 400s also with a gallon of gas.
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eklipse636
Needs a life
ZX-14
Posts: 6046
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posted January 01, 2013 04:38 PM
quote:
Loser is correct. My bike is losing weight almost every day. Probably close to 500 pounds with a gallon of gas in it. A few more weight saving mods and I should be in the high 400s also with a gallon of gas.
With one gallon of gas, your not going to be able to ride very far. Maybe one or two passes at the track.
____________
Best: 60ft 1.351 1/8 5.68 mph 123.98 1/4
8.89 mph 151.32
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Wheelie
Needs a life
Old Man
Posts: 6902
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posted January 01, 2013 04:42 PM
quote:
Loser is correct. My bike is losing weight almost every day. Probably close to 500 pounds with a gallon of gas in it. A few more weight saving mods and I should be in the high 400s also with a gallon of gas.
A weighmaster doesn't have scales? lol
wee
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INTIMIDA2OR
Needs a life
RED rider!
Posts: 13081
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posted January 01, 2013 06:45 PM
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'06 Passion Red ZX-14
*Lee*
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weighmaster
Expert Class
Posts: 301
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posted January 01, 2013 07:07 PM
I do have a very accurate scale that goes up to 30 pounds. I measure how much weight comes off the bike, not how much the bike weighs. I need a freight scale for that and they probably have one around here cuz there are a lot of industrial parks and someone will probably let me use it. Probably 2 digital bathroom scales would suffice too. I could check them using my bodyweight which I know and then just roll the bike up on them. It would also be interesting to see the front to back percentages. I am assuming the front is around 55 to 60% of the total bike's weight. 3 bathroom scales would be interesting too and then put the bike on the sidestand.
I rode today for about an hour and I doubt I went more than about 30 miles and when I gear my bike up, I should be getting 35+ MPG even in the city so 1 gallon is fine but 2 gallons is probably better.
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quikgix
Expert Class
Posts: 274
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posted January 02, 2013 07:05 AM
Just go out and buy light tires and wheels and ride that POS! Happy New Year
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1352cc 8.39@159mph on motor cant wait to spray this bitch
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INTIMIDA2OR
Needs a life
RED rider!
Posts: 13081
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posted January 02, 2013 08:21 AM
I'd still like to see som pics . I dont even know what color his bike is. He already knows what color mine is.
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'06 Passion Red ZX-14
*Lee*
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BobC
Pro
Posts: 1736
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posted January 02, 2013 08:56 AM
quote:
If a top notch pipe with a PC and some fancy tuning and dyno testing cost $1000 more and yields 17 more RWHP, that is $60 per additional HP which is double price and not really worth it to me.
I think you might have hit the nail on the head there Mr Weighmaster, possibly unintentionally. For many people it's that small difference at the track which defines a loser. Most of the members here ARE trying to get maximum power.
____________
Candy Thunder Blue 2006 ZZR1400
Stock wheelbase
Max: 205.4 mph in 1.25 miles
2012 ZZR1400 in Golden Blazed Green
Brock CT Full System. etc
Max: 203.1 in 1 mile (so far)
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weighmaster
Expert Class
Posts: 301
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posted January 02, 2013 09:49 AM
If you want "maximum power" then why not go with forged pistons and nitrous oxide injection but even that would not be maximum. How about strapping a small jet engine on the back too?
I don't run my bike at the track and I don't really care if it runs 10 flat or 9.9 or 9.8 down the quarter mile and repeated drag runs can hurt a bike.
On the street in 2nd gear if I am going say 60 MPH, what matters to me is how long it takes to get the bike up to 100 MPH, Weight reduction helps a lot with that as does "gearing".
So I think I will go ride my "POS" as someone else stated which I assume means Powerful, Outstanding, Smooth. Thanks for the complement.
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted January 02, 2013 09:59 AM
 Edited By: Shane661 on 2 Jan 2013 18:01
quote:
I know enough about motorcycles that sometimes I even correct the guys at the local MC shop. I caught them several times saying wrong things and I corrected them right away.
Just because someone sets up a bike for less that maximum HP doesn't mean they do not know what they are doing. I could spend thousands of dollars more to maybe get 10 more HP out of my machine but it is not worth it. For example, if someone pays $5000 for a used ZX-14 that is 167 RWHP that is $30 per HP. If a top notch pipe with a PC and some fancy tuning and dyno testing cost $1000 more and yields 17 more RWHP, that is $60 per additional HP which is double price and not really worth it to me. That is being "generous" too because sometimes all that stuff only adds about 10 RWHP which would make it $100 per additional HP.
So let the accusations fly. I can easily defend myself with logic and good examples.
Funny because the guy that stated I don't know anything about motorcycle has Supersprox 42T listed in his "signature" which is the same one I ordered several months ago before I even knew about this forum. Ha ha ha.
As best I can tell:
$5000/167= $29.94 per hp
$6000/184= $32.60 per hp
You might want to check your math. Not to mention that the shape of the curve tells even more. I don't think you will find a lot of people here that are willing to argue with you in order to keep your bike from being a turd.
Shane
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INTIMIDA2OR
Needs a life
RED rider!
Posts: 13081
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posted January 02, 2013 10:09 AM
[quote
On the street in 2nd gear if I am going say 60 MPH, what matters to me is how long it takes to get the bike up to 100 MPH, Weight reduction helps a lot with that as does "gearing".
So does flies out. Actually with gearing and flies out would be downright scary fun!
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'06 Passion Red ZX-14
*Lee*
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quikgix
Expert Class
Posts: 274
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posted January 02, 2013 10:12 AM
Ill take the POS statement back. Piece Of Shit. How's that? LMAO. Oops. I mean Laughing My Ass Off
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1352cc 8.39@159mph on motor cant wait to spray this bitch
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weighmaster
Expert Class
Posts: 301
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posted January 02, 2013 10:13 AM
What is funny to me is when I used to go to the dragstrip like 20 years ago and I saw big brawny guys trying to post good numbers. Maybe if they put the burgers and fries down and lost 50 pounds they might have a chance. I am only 170 pounds suited up and ready to ride so my 14 with me on it should be 700 pounds or less with 2 gallons of gas in it and I really didn't spend much on weight reduction stuff.
Let's take some hypothetical numbers:
rider =250 pounds, bike = 550 pounds, total = 800 pounds. Assume 160 RWHP. Power to weight ratio is 1:5 which is 1 RWHP for every 5 pounds of bike+rider.
Now keeping the HP the same, suppose that rider lost 50 pounds (very possible over several months) and also took 50 pounds off the bike (very possible too). Now let's look at the revised numbers:
rider = 200 pounds, bike = 500 pounds, total = 700 pounds. Still 160 RWHP. Power to weight ratio is now 1:4.375.
So assuming the bike and rider are back up to their original weight, the improvement in performance with the 100 pounds less is like having a 4.375 power to weight ratio on his original 800 pound setup which would be like 183 RWHP (800 / 4.375). So the 100 pound weight loss is roughly equivalent to 23 additional RWHP (effectively).
So there are 2 main points here...
1) losing weight is a good way to achieve more effective RWHP (performance) and it is healthier for you too if you do it right and down to your ideal weight.
2) When guys brag about their dyno peak HP, that is not telling the entire story. A good dyno would also be a scale and weight the bike+rider combo and then also include a power to weight ratio as part of the printout. For example, a guy with a 160 peak HP bike that is 700 pounds bike + rider would "beat" a guy with 170 or even 180 peak HP that is 100 pounds more (bike + rider).
I could drop another 20 pounds or so (rider + bike) so I may do that. I like having a bike that feels light but doesn't wheelie easily and steers well so the 14 is like a dream come true for me. Since I will be lightening up the front with a ZX-10R wheel and Power Pure 120/60/17 tire, I was even considering removing one of the brake rotors and caliper and associated plumbing. I don't need to go 150 MPH and then slam on the brakes repeatedly like at a track so I think a single front disc brake would suffice for "light" street riding. I would think removing that as well as going with the lighter wheel and tire up front should save close to 10 pounds up front which is significant. I'll just take it easy in 1st gear so I don't become an instant meteorologist watching the cloud formations.
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted January 02, 2013 10:19 AM
quote:
What is funny to me is when I used to go to the dragstrip like 20 years ago and I saw big brawny guys trying to post good numbers. Maybe if they put the burgers and fries down and lost 50 pounds they might have a chance. I am only 170 pounds suited up and ready to ride so my 14 with me on it should be 700 pounds or less with 2 gallons of gas in it and I really didn't spend much on weight reduction stuff.
Let's take some hypothetical numbers:
rider =250 pounds, bike = 550 pounds, total = 800 pounds. Assume 160 RWHP. Power to weight ratio is 1:5 which is 1 RWHP for every 5 pounds of bike+rider.
Now keeping the HP the same, suppose that rider lost 50 pounds (very possible over several months) and also took 50 pounds off the bike (very possible too). Now let's look at the revised numbers:
rider = 200 pounds, bike = 500 pounds, total = 700 pounds. Still 160 RWHP. Power to weight ratio is now 1:4.375.
So assuming the bike and rider are back up to their original weight, the improvement in performance with the 100 pounds less is like having a 4.375 power to weight ratio on his original 800 pound setup which would be like 183 RWHP (800 / 4.375). So the 100 pound weight loss is roughly equivalent to 23 additional RWHP (effectively).
So there are 2 main points here...
1) losing weight is a good way to achieve more effective RWHP (performance) and it is healthier for you too if you do it right and down to your ideal weight.
2) When guys brag about their dyno peak HP, that is not telling the entire story. A good dyno would also be a scale and weight the bike+rider combo and then also include a power to weight ratio as part of the printout. For example, a guy with a 160 peak HP bike that is 700 pounds bike + rider would "beat" a guy with 170 or even 180 peak HP that is 100 pounds more (bike + rider).
I could drop another 20 pounds or so (rider + bike) so I may do that. I like having a bike that feels light but doesn't wheelie easily and steers well so the 14 is like a dream come true for me. Since I will be lightening up the front with a ZX-10R wheel and Power Pure 120/60/17 tire, I was even considering removing one of the brake rotors and caliper and associated plumbing. I don't need to go 150 MPH and then slam on the brakes repeatedly like at a track so I think a single front disc brake would suffice for "light" street riding. I would think removing that as well as going with the lighter wheel and tire up front should save close to 10 pounds up front which is significant. I'll just take it easy in 1st gear so I don't become an instant meteorologist watching the cloud formations.
This guy is the Forrest Gump of this forum...did you read my thread, or are you so stupid as to think that you have had an epiphany that you must share with the rest of us??
Shane
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weighmaster
Expert Class
Posts: 301
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posted January 02, 2013 10:27 AM
Shane wrote:
As best I can tell:
$5000/167= $29.94 per hp
$6000/184= $32.60 per hp
You might want to check your math. Not to mention that the shape of the curve tells even more. I don't think you will find a lot of people here that are willing to argue with you in order to keep your bike from being a turd.
My reply:
My "math" is right on the money and I wouldn't exactly call a 160 to 170 RWHP bike a "turd".
I've seen HP and torque graphs of various setups of a 14 and am familiar with them. I reported yesterday that the bike pulled well even past the 3K spot which is know to be a flat spot in stock setup. Even with my flies in and in top gear, the bike seemed to have good grunt. How is that a "turd"?
Oh and Shane, I have both the '06 ZX-10R and the '06 ZX-14 rear wheels here and the weight difference between them on my scale is only 3.1 pounds. Where did you get 5 pound difference from? I can post pics of both wheels on my scale individually. Neither have the rotor or sprocket on but both have the bearings and sprocket carrier and I only see a 3.1 pound difference. I even took off the wheel weights and the air cap but the stems are there.
I suppose there can be some variance and my 10 wheel appears to have been painted over but almost 2 pounds is a pretty big discrepancy.
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weighmaster
Expert Class
Posts: 301
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posted January 02, 2013 10:31 AM
Edited By: weighmaster on 2 Jan 2013 18:34
Shane, I don't trust your weights because originally you stated almost 10 pounds going from the 14 wheels to the 10 wheels then I questioned you repeatedly then you dropped it to 7 pound difference now I am questioning you again because I only see 5.1 pounds difference for the pair. You even admitted me me you lost your "notes" because your computer crashed.
I got the wheels and weighed them myself and to no surprise, my numbers are different than yours.
Even if the extra paint and rotor made up the 1.9 pound difference (not likely), you still originally had your weight saving kit advertised as "almost 10 pounds of rotating mass saved" which seems way off to me. 7 is not almost 10 and certainly 5.1 is nowhere near 10.
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted January 02, 2013 10:32 AM
LOL, man, If you read my install of 10R wheels you will note that I used a Galfer 10R rotor, and of course the 10R hanger when I came up with my overall weight. Not to mention a Vortex aluminum rear sprocket...
What you don't realize about weight loss is that it is a phliosophy. No single componenet leads to the end result. The 10R rear wheel is lighter, and the rotor is smaller...you have to look at the big picture.
Shane
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted January 02, 2013 10:36 AM
Edited By: Shane661 on 2 Jan 2013 18:40
quote:
Shane, I don't trust your weights because originally you stated almost 10 pounds going from the 14 wheels to the 10 wheels then I questioned you repeatedly then you dropped it to 7 pound difference now I am questioning you again because I only see 5.1 pounds difference for the pair. You even admitted me me you lost your "notes" because your computer crashed.
I got the wheels and weighed them myself and to no surprise, my numbers are different than yours.
Uhh..please link where I posted this?? I swapped the 10R wheels to Racheal's bike, and I recall it being around 8 lbs. I don't recall any computer crash or whatever the hell you are talking about, lol. I believe this was documented in Racheal's build thread. OSR also documented similar weights. And typically I post pics of my parts on the scale.
Are you ok, man?? LOL
Shane
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