cliffrandall
Zone Head
Posts: 757
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posted July 12, 2013 06:50 PM
Noticed a 'grabby' decompression stroke on my clutch this week - pulled the stack today and found a couple of the thinner 2.3mm steel plates were warped. Kawi Canada kindly gave me new ones and a fresh cover gasjet, always good........Put her back together tonight and bleed the slave cylinder a bit just to snug her up - I'll testy it tomorrow and report on my findings. The clutch was working fine, just didn't like the notchy feel as I let it out.
Cliff
  
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cliffrandall
Zone Head
Posts: 757
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posted July 13, 2013 07:11 PM
 Edited By: cliffrandall on 14 Jul 2013 03:12
Put the clutch stack back into the bike today, I don't like the free play, too much. I'm dropping by Kawi on Monday and picking up a few of the thicker 2.6mm steel plates so I can 'thicken the stack' and reduce the free play to just where I like it..........I'll let you know my findings - BTW this is a good exercise for 14 owners to understand and to be able to do yourself. It's really very easy to fine tune a hydraulic clutch if you 'get it'.
Cliff
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cliffrandall
Zone Head
Posts: 757
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posted July 14, 2013 04:16 AM
BTW - your primary metal clutch plate on a 2013 ZX14 is 2.6mm thick, you tune by substituting the Kawi 2.3mm or 2.9mm plates (don't use a 2.3 with a 2.9) depending on your free play requirements.
Cliff
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cliffrandall
Zone Head
Posts: 757
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posted July 15, 2013 06:35 PM
Clutch is fixed, needed a good bleeding to get rid of the grabby feeling, no idea how air got into the system. FYI - 2 bleed valves on the 14R, one up top and one at the lower slave.
Cliff
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cliffrandall
Zone Head
Posts: 757
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posted July 22, 2013 06:56 PM
Wow........50,000 hits! I hope you enjoyed the build and the current tune talk.
Thanks very much,
Cliff
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cliffrandall
Zone Head
Posts: 757
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posted July 28, 2013 05:31 PM
Edited By: cliffrandall on 29 Jul 2013 01:53
Note from the saddle - After 2,200klms my motor is 'noticeable' smoother at a 13 to 1 A/F ratio then at 13.5. You can actually feel it in the handle bars, the 3000-4000 rpm buzz is gone.
Cliff
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King Cobra
Parking Attendant
2013 zx14R SE
Posts: 4
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posted July 30, 2013 05:12 PM
Edited By: King Cobra on 31 Jul 2013 01:19
Found the exhost post..moved
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2013 zx14R SE
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cliffrandall
Zone Head
Posts: 757
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posted July 31, 2013 08:19 AM
If anyone is interested in trying my Dynojet wideband/timing 'real-world' Guhl ECM street map, send me a note to cliff@randallsearch.com and I'll shoot it over. If you've got a 2012 or 12 ZX-14R with a pipe, you'll love it, especially in the mid-range. 13 to 1 A/F ratio across the board with fixed numbers at idle etc, where the o2 can struggle. Smooth as silk......FYI - the ignition timing produced the most power on the dyno with +2 advance.
Cheers,
Cliff
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cliffrandall
Zone Head
Posts: 757
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posted July 31, 2013 12:31 PM
Follow-up........don't worry to much about either the ignition curve change or the Guhl ECM mod, it really doesn't effect the mapping to any noticeable degree on the street. All you need is a PC5 and you're good to download.......N/C!!
Cliff
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tuusinii
Pro
Posts: 1031
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posted July 31, 2013 10:55 PM
Why 13AFR across the board? Normally you'd want 13AFR only on wider throttle openings and shoot for 14-14.5AFR when cruising. When tuning my 12R ECU I have set the TPS maps to 13.5 to 13.0 (15% to 100%TPS) and in the IAP map shoot for 14.5AFR (<15%TPS). That way I have full power when twisting the throttle and much better mileage when cruising... Only in low RPMs (<2800RPM) I shoot for 13.2AFR to keep the engine cooler but especially between 2800-4500RPm I shoot for 14.5AFR to give more range. On ZX12 the 4000RPM buzz was mostly in the ECU where there was extreme ignition advances in the map and also the fuel maps were really rich. After fixing those inside the ECU my 12 is smooth as a silk. Still building the map after I last autumn changed to Akra pipe though.
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cliffrandall
Zone Head
Posts: 757
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posted August 01, 2013 03:28 AM
Edited By: cliffrandall on 1 Aug 2013 11:34
Thanks Tuusinii.......Every motor likes different A/F to a certain degree. What i found after 2500klms of both dyno tuning & seat of the pants ram-air calculated, real-time o2 work, was that 13 to 1 was best for the 'performance centric' experience I wanted - max/smooth power (monitored via my PC5 wideband set-up and the KOSO EGT readings) .Your mileage will not be greatly effected with this map, however your enjoyment factor should be large........Try the map then tell us your thoughts.
Cliff
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Gunner
Needs a life
Posts: 5778
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posted August 08, 2013 01:19 AM
quote:
Why 13AFR across the board? Normally you'd want 13AFR only on wider throttle openings and shoot for 14-14.5AFR when cruising. When tuning my 12R ECU I have set the TPS maps to 13.5 to 13.0 (15% to 100%TPS) and in the IAP map shoot for 14.5AFR (<15%TPS). That way I have full power when twisting the throttle and much better mileage when cruising... Only in low RPMs (<2800RPM) I shoot for 13.2AFR to keep the engine cooler but especially between 2800-4500RPm I shoot for 14.5AFR to give more range. On ZX12 the 4000RPM buzz was mostly in the ECU where there was extreme ignition advances in the map and also the fuel maps were really rich. After fixing those inside the ECU my 12 is smooth as a silk. Still building the map after I last autumn changed to Akra pipe though.
Good information thanks for sharing
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There's no such thing as a motor with no more power to give only people with no more intelligence to get it
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cliffrandall
Zone Head
Posts: 757
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posted August 20, 2013 08:14 AM
Edited By: cliffrandall on 20 Aug 2013 17:29
quote:
quote:
Why 13AFR across the board? Normally you'd want 13AFR only on wider throttle openings and shoot for 14-14.5AFR when cruising. When tuning my 12R ECU I have set the TPS maps to 13.5 to 13.0 (15% to 100%TPS) and in the IAP map shoot for 14.5AFR (<15%TPS). That way I have full power when twisting the throttle and much better mileage when cruising... Only in low RPMs (<2800RPM) I shoot for 13.2AFR to keep the engine cooler but especially between 2800-4500RPm I shoot for 14.5AFR to give more range. On ZX12 the 4000RPM buzz was mostly in the ECU where there was extreme ignition advances in the map and also the fuel maps were really rich. After fixing those inside the ECU my 12 is smooth as a silk. Still building the map after I last autumn changed to Akra pipe though.
Good information thanks for sharing
For my style of riding an A/F ration of 14 to 1 is too lean, EGT's start reading 1400+ degrees, freaks me out.......13 to 1 gives a nice cool 1250-1275 degrees and lots of power......IMO the difference in gas mileage that you're talking about, is insignificant for a 14 owner. Besides, 200klms and I need a break anyway - my ass is killing me, I need to take a piss, maybe even get a burger and a beer, on an outdoor deck, so I can stare at my bike!!!!
Cliff
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tuusinii
Pro
Posts: 1031
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posted August 20, 2013 09:43 PM
The art of tuning with the ECU it self (and not Power commander) is that when the bike is in IAP mode the throttle is moving just between 1.08 - 1.25 (0-5%) volts and you have a complete map of cells between those voltages. That means that you can have the 14.5AFR when just cruising but even very tiny bit of more thorttle gives you AFR near 13. So basically when driving you have all the throttle feedback and power you need but your mileage will get better significantly. Here is on example of my LM2 data:
For example here the AFR is about 14.3 with throttle in 1.24V and the drops to about 13.0AFR with throttle in 1.28V. And that is just a change of 0.04 volts (~1%). Try to do that with PC... And my mileage when riding highway at 130kph (80MPH) my mileage dropped from 7.5l/100km to 6.2l/100km (31MPG to 38MPG). Also when stock there were many places on the map where more throttle didn't give you more fuel so when stock the map could have been that it was too rich when cruising and too lean when acclerating. With ECU tuning the driveability was set on next level.
You should have really get together with Guhl to do all the tuning with the ECU and not brother with PC at all when all this tuning is now available to us...
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cliffrandall
Zone Head
Posts: 757
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posted August 21, 2013 02:47 AM
Really, WTF?........I'll stick with the PC5 and the fabulous 'multiply' options and maps it provides for the HT project, very simple stuff and very effective. Give Don Guhl a call and tell him all about your new tuning method, I'm sure he'll be fascinated
Cliff
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cliffrandall
Zone Head
Posts: 757
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posted August 21, 2013 04:26 AM
quote:
Really, WTF?........I'll stick with the PC5 and the fabulous 'multiple' options and maps it provides for the HT project, very simple stuff and very effective. Give Don Guhl a call and tell him all about your new tuning method, I'm sure he'll be fascinated
Cliff
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cliffrandall
Zone Head
Posts: 757
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posted September 22, 2013 11:51 AM
Edited By: cliffrandall on 22 Sep 2013 20:03
Put a set of Dunlop Q3 on the HT yesterday, looking forward to enjoying this latest design on some northern twisties next week. BTW we're having a fabulous September up here for riding........FYI - I used my original Q2's for 4300klms, good tires but sadly were I live (straight pavement) they lose their V shape and hence the handling profile, long before they ever actually wear-out..........In case I haven't mentioned it, I just love this 14, it is without a doubt the best 'real world' bike I have ever owned. I can easily ride it 500+ klms in a day with no aches or pains and I'm 60. I can not say that about any other bike that I've ever owned.
Cliff
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Seno
Pro
BANNED FOR LIFE!
Posts: 1230
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posted September 22, 2013 03:37 PM
Edited By: Seno on 22 Sep 2013 23:38
Cliff, congrats on a well done project and being the best at talking to yourself. Now please take a long ride off a short pier.
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2012 Black 14R -> Completely done!
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cliffrandall
Zone Head
Posts: 757
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posted September 22, 2013 06:02 PM
Tough crowd!
Cheers,
Cliff
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cliffrandall
Zone Head
Posts: 757
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posted September 26, 2013 04:54 PM
450klms today on the new Dunlop Q3's - fabulous tires, I strongly recommend them!
Cliff
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hagrid
Expert Class
Posts: 373
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posted September 26, 2013 07:37 PM
Like General Motors this thread is too big to fail.
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blue 14R
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cliffrandall
Zone Head
Posts: 757
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posted September 27, 2013 04:22 AM
Edited By: cliffrandall on 27 Sep 2013 12:27
I guess you can't please everybody....That said, look for the full story in Performance Bikes Magazine this Nov, available on worldwide newsstands everywhere. A sponsor's dream come true.
Hey Cliff
Hope things are good with you and the ZX-14 is running well. I'm really keen on doing a piece in the magazine about your bike. As you know, we all think it is awesome over here at PB.
I'd like to give you a call. I suspect you're a busy man, so when would be a good time?
Many thanks
MW
Matt Wildee
Editor
Performance Bikes
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cliffrandall
Zone Head
Posts: 757
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posted September 27, 2013 04:51 AM
Here's what happens when you get it right. The next build is a piece of cake.
Nice work Cliff and thanks again for all your support and hard work. It is appreciated.
Keep in touch and if you ever need anything just let me know.
Best Regards,
Mark
HIGH PERFORMANCE POWERSPORT IGNITION COMPONENTS
Phone: (321)400-5959
Email:mark@takai-racing.com
Website:http://www.takai-racing.com
Address 161 Ridge Street #744, Sault Ste. Marie, MI, 49783
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted October 06, 2013 11:18 AM
Edited By: Shane661 on 6 Oct 2013 19:19
http://www.suzukihayabusa.org/forum/index.php?topic=158359.msg1557226;boardseen#new
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hagrid
Expert Class
Posts: 373
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posted October 06, 2013 02:14 PM
Hmmm. Interesting.
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blue 14R
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