smokinstorm
Zone Head
Old Drag Racer
Posts: 504
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posted June 22, 2012 12:04 PM
The reason I wanted to go with the modified zx12 one is that Jim @ Comp CNC said that the only cam chain failures he's seen in the zx14 cam from people overtightening the manual tensioners. He said it was really easy to over tighten it. That was enough for me.
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2009 Monster Edition ZX14
It's all stock I swear. Well...almost.
2005 Turbo Busa
2001 GSXR 1000
Looking for a 1985 GS1150E
  
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zixxer14
Pro
Damn that was Quick
Posts: 1233
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posted June 22, 2012 12:20 PM
 Edited By: zixxer14 on 22 Jun 2012 21:32
If you let a stock one rattle long enough you'll be replacing guides & chain from beating each other up. It's really pretty easy to get a manual tensioner right & it will never back off when you chop the throttle. Did you install the zx12 tensioner yourself? Could you tell if it was hydraulic or just spring tensioned?
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Bueller
Novice Class
Posts: 97
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posted June 22, 2012 01:12 PM
I installed it, is a spring tensioner. pop it in and forget it.
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zixxer14
Pro
Damn that was Quick
Posts: 1233
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posted June 22, 2012 01:37 PM
Until the spring fatigues anyway. Just kidding, I would of gone the same route but nobody had one in stock when I needed it & saved enough for a front tire or set of brake pads besides.
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Bueller
Novice Class
Posts: 97
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posted June 22, 2012 02:43 PM
we got 7 bikes between us, on top of the ones I "have" to work on. I almost got the manual one due to time factors also, but I just need a nap sometimes lmao
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indynic
Expert Class
Lil Show, Lil Go
Posts: 258
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posted June 22, 2012 02:48 PM
Ape Manual is the way I went..and I am glad I did. Set it and forget it. If you are cautious when installing it, then its no big deal and you won't overtighten. I have had my APE manual on for about three years, lots of runs on the dragstrip, tons of street miles no problems and I never had to adjust since initial installation.
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shotgun15
Novice Class
Posts: 39
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posted June 22, 2012 09:35 PM
quote:
quote:
Its the same design.
Something must be different, my 14r does not rattle like my prior gen1's did.
Quote below is from 14R marketing package:
"New hydraulic cam chain tensioner features a mechanical ratchet
system that ensures pressure on the cam chain is maintained when the
engine is cold (and hydraulic pressure is low), reducing mechanical
noise."
Looks different in the service manual too...
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12 ZX-14R, 08 C-14, 00 ZX-12R,
90 ZX-11, 78 Z1-R
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Y2KZX12R
Needs a job
CompetitionCNC.com
Posts: 3762
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posted June 23, 2012 04:31 AM
The gen 1 and gen 2 zx14 tensioners are a mechanical/hydraulic unit. They wont fail and there's nothing wrong with them. But if you dont like the chain noise that you here at times then our modified zx-12r tensioner will stop that.
What happens is the distance between the center line of the cams and the crankshaft reduces when the engine cools down. So the chain is looser until the engine expands.
The cause is due to the stock zx14 units not taking up the slack that develops when the engine changes temperatures. The engineers designed it this way to reduce friction on the guides.
With the zx12r unit, any slack is taken up if the spring has enough tension to move the ratchet bar to the next tooth. Once it clicks into a tooth it can never back up even if you took the spring out.
So when the engine heats up, and the engine gets "taller" the chain gets tighter and has more drag on the guides vs when the engine is cold. Thew same applies to a manual tensioner. It too can not adjust to the varying conditions.
The main problem with manual tensioners is that they are almost always overtightened by everyone who uses them. And they have snapped many, many, cam chains. I'd say that almost all (90%) of cam chain failures are due to manual tensioners being over tightened. And 9.9% are due to a valve/piston interference issue and then .01% are due to an actual chain problem.
There are exceptions like the 99 and 2000 busa tensioners that were a known issue.
I do recommend the zx-12r units for anyone running higher tension valve springs. We put them in all the zx14 engines we build with our stage 2 or 3 cnc ported head and cam packages where we use the APE 65# springs. But you really dont kneed one on a stock engine unless the noise really bothers you.
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Y2KZX12R
CompetitionCNC.com
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Bently
Needs a life
2012 14r In Blue and no Mods!
Posts: 5428
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posted June 23, 2012 04:46 AM
quote:
quote:
quote:
Its the same design.
Something must be different, my 14r does not rattle like my prior gen1's did.
Quote below is from 14R marketing package:
"New hydraulic cam chain tensioner features a mechanical ratchet
system that ensures pressure on the cam chain is maintained when the
engine is cold (and hydraulic pressure is low), reducing mechanical
noise."
Looks different in the service manual too...
knew something was different as this is the first 14 out of 4 that don't make any noise.
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zixxer14
Pro
Damn that was Quick
Posts: 1233
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posted June 23, 2012 06:41 AM
The reason I changed out my tensioner was because when I fired up the bike the tensioner would not quiet down the rattle. I would have to shut off the bike & restart it before the tensioner woulld function. It was replaced because of the fear of total failure not because I didn't like the rattle at start up which was always there from new.
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shotgun15
Novice Class
Posts: 39
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posted June 23, 2012 04:48 PM
quote:
quote:
quote:
quote:
Its the same design.
Something must be different, my 14r does not rattle like my prior gen1's did.
Quote below is from 14R marketing package:
"New hydraulic cam chain tensioner features a mechanical ratchet
system that ensures pressure on the cam chain is maintained when the
engine is cold (and hydraulic pressure is low), reducing mechanical
noise."
Looks different in the service manual too...
knew something was different as this is the first 14 out of 4 that don't make any noise.
Yup, looks like they got it, both my 14r an C14 don't seem do it...
____________
12 ZX-14R, 08 C-14, 00 ZX-12R,
90 ZX-11, 78 Z1-R
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