wrongway
Pro
Posts: 1078
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posted November 22, 2010 06:16 AM
swingarm extensions can ruin your day
went to the dragstrip with 17/44 gearing and +8" wheelbase to see what the bike would run... but I had to quit early ...
I did upgrade the adjustment bolt going to a 3/8" stud made out of some fancy alloy. That was as large as I could go due to the lack of clearance for the jam nut .
  
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1badzx12r
Needs a life
Posts: 8321
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posted November 22, 2010 06:23 AM
it won't matter how large of a bolt you put in it ..trust me .. just TQ the shit out of the axle nut and make sure theres no grease behind the adjustment brackets. nothing to make them slide better ..
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted November 22, 2010 06:32 AM
 Edited By: Shane661 on 22 Nov 2010 14:33
What was that axle nut torqued to? There are a lot of arms that use the rod coming from the backside for adjustment. The only thing that holds them is the little nut at the back of the arm:
Obviously, even with the larger rod, you would not be able to support even a 185 hp bike trying to move a 700 lb. package under power by just the nuts. I asked Terry McIntosh about it, and he said that you can get away with it because of the torque on the axle nut.
I know a lot of guys don't like to tighten those axle nuts"tight"...not saying this was the case here, but something to be aware of, for sure.
Shane
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SteddyTeddy
Pro
Posts: 1664
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posted November 22, 2010 06:47 AM
Tighten that axle more. I never did like the setups with the rod coming out the back. Just something to bust your shins on. I've personly seen several of them brake at the track.
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted November 22, 2010 06:48 AM
Edited By: Shane661 on 22 Nov 2010 14:53
quote:
Tighten that axle more. I never did like the setups with the rod coming out the back. Just something to bust your shins on. I've personly seen several of them brake at the track.
On mine I just have short, strong bolts...not the long threaded rod. 
I could go even shorter with the bolts, but those gave me plenty of adjustability when I was doing drag and LSR with the bike.
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kaw-rick
Pro
Posts: 1167
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posted November 22, 2010 07:08 AM
I sometimes install bigger bolts, especially for heavier riders. Ive seen mid 8 sec at 169 mph no problems at all. The bolts are no smaller than factory, but they do extend further out. i think i would get an arm if you were having problems. Good luck.
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wrongway
Pro
Posts: 1078
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posted November 22, 2010 07:23 AM
quote:
On mine I just have short, strong bolts...not the long threaded rod.
that looks like a Grade 3 bolt .... strong would be Grade 8 or 9
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted November 22, 2010 07:34 AM
Edited By: Shane661 on 22 Nov 2010 15:47
quote:
that looks like a Grade 3 bolt .... strong would be Grade 8 or 9
I believe they are grade 5, if I recall, Roy. Nonetheless, they aren't broken after hundreds of passes, right? 
Grade 5 is plenty strong enough, especially considering that the adjuster blocks themselves are aluminum.
The overall point is that axle adjusters are for adjusting the axle, not supporting the full power and load to the drive wheel.
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oilfieldtrash
Zone Head
Kawasaki enthusiast
Posts: 506
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posted November 22, 2010 08:49 AM
Edited By: oilfieldtrash on 22 Nov 2010 16:50
There is no way in hell I would ever use swingarm extensions. If I wanted to stretch a bike I would play it safe and buy a well made extended swingarm. I saw a picture of Smokin on this board and his extensions looked like the wanted to break in half when he was taking off. I think he said he's like 130 pounds so you can imagine what it's doing if you're 200 pounds. Swingarm is one of the last places I'm looking to save a buck.
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'09 zx6r lime green bone stock
'07 white S.E. ZX-14 sold
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00Busa
Expert Class
Trying to go FASTER !
Posts: 270
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posted November 22, 2010 08:51 AM
The overall point is that axle adjusters are for adjusting the axle, not supporting the full power and load to the drive wheel.
I agree ! I've run them for 4 yrs. with 15k miles and numerous ' track days' running 5.70s.
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'00 Busa / '06 14 /
IT AINT BRAGGING, IF YOU CAN BACK IT UP !
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CraigChrist
Pro
BAWLS
Posts: 1043
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posted November 22, 2010 08:56 AM
funny... dusty's are holding up just fine putting down the same 60fts as smokin' with about 60 lbs more weight, WAY lower gearing, and about 4 more inches of wheelbase. Swing arm extensions are perfectly safe as long as you set them up properly. Especially the spencer cycles extensions. Those things beefy.
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60ft-------1.42
1/8th------5.97
mph-------119
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eklipse636
Needs a life
ZX-14
Posts: 6046
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posted November 22, 2010 09:48 AM
quote:
funny... dusty's are holding up just fine putting down the same 60fts as smokin' with about 60 lbs more weight, WAY lower gearing, and about 4 more inches of wheelbase. Swing arm extensions are perfectly safe as long as you set them up properly. Especially the spencer cycles extensions. Those things beefy.
I've had two sets from allthingschrome and I've had zero problems. I've never seen mine flex much and I'm T 66" wb with them
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Best: 60ft 1.351 1/8 5.68 mph 123.98 1/4
8.89 mph 151.32
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dakota9498
Pro
Posts: 1181
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posted November 22, 2010 09:54 AM
In my avatar Those are all things chrome extensions at about 65", no flex at all. Besides most aftermarket swingarms use the same type adjusters so it wouldn't be any different than the extensions. I agree with those that say to just tighten the axle nut.
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2008 ZX14
Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference. ~Mark Twain
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DogoZX
Expert Class
Posts: 348
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posted November 22, 2010 10:02 AM
Edited By: DogoZX on 22 Nov 2010 18:09
quote:
What was that axle nut torqued to?
Are you able to have your axle torqued to factory specs runnin' BST's, Shane?
Carrozzeria wheels require that your axles be torqued to 50% of factory specs... just an FYI for anyone who may be concerned with bending/breaking adjusters.
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted November 22, 2010 10:10 AM
quote:
quote:
What was that axle nut torqued to?
Are you able to have your axle torqued to factory specs runnin' BST's, Shane?
Carrozzeria wheels require that your axles be torqued to 50% of factory specs.
I torque the nut to about 80-85 ft lbs. I have not had any issues. Factory spec is 94 ft lbs.
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DogoZX
Expert Class
Posts: 348
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posted November 22, 2010 10:13 AM
quote:
I torque the nut to about 80-85 ft lbs. I have not had any issues. Factory spec is 94 ft lbs.
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CraigChrist
Pro
BAWLS
Posts: 1043
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posted November 22, 2010 10:45 AM
you guys actually torque your axle nuts? lol... I use my retard strength and guesstimate it lol.
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60ft-------1.42
1/8th------5.97
mph-------119
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1badzx12r
Needs a life
Posts: 8321
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posted November 22, 2010 10:51 AM
quote:
you guys actually torque your axle nuts? lol... I use my retard strength and guesstimate it lol.
cheeta pipe
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madnessracing
Pro
Vmax and Busa Beater
Posts: 1140
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posted November 22, 2010 11:11 AM
That happened to me too I put grade 8 bolts and problem solved!
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Shorty's Performance
Team Madness Racing
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gilberjj
Needs a job
Friend of Fast
Posts: 3196
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posted November 22, 2010 11:56 AM
Yikes!!!!!!! I haven't had any problems with my allthingchrome (currently for sale), but I'm getting an sb customs 12" over arm this winter. I don't want to worry about swingarm issues when I'm doing 160+ mph.
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted November 22, 2010 12:03 PM
Edited By: Shane661 on 22 Nov 2010 20:09
quote:
Yikes!!!!!!! I haven't had any problems with my allthingchrome (currently for sale), but I'm getting an sb customs 12" over arm this winter. I don't want to worry about swingarm issues when I'm doing 160+ mph.
We've had no issues with extensions over 190 mph. Not to mention hundreds of drag passes over 3 different bikes. Honestly, I would be more scared at top speed with an unbraced chromoly arm...
It seems very likely that the axle nut was not tight enough, which allowed the shifting under load. I mean, that thing had to move pretty freely in order to bend the bolt like that.
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wrongway
Pro
Posts: 1078
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posted November 22, 2010 12:34 PM
quote:
quote:
Yikes!!!!!!! I haven't had any problems with my allthingchrome (currently for sale), but I'm getting an sb customs 12" over arm this winter. I don't want to worry about swingarm issues when I'm doing 160+ mph.
We've had no issues with extensions over 190 mph. Not to mention hundreds of drag passes over 3 different bikes. Honestly, I would be more scared at top speed with an unbraced chromoly arm...
It seems very likely that the axle nut was not tight enough, which allowed the shifting under load. I mean, that thing had to move pretty freely in order to bend the bolt like that.
It was torqued to 80- ft/lbs ..... a harder grade of steel would not have bent like that without a torch . I blame this on cheap hardware.
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Hellmutt
Needs a job
Posts: 2013
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posted November 22, 2010 12:37 PM
quote:
There is no way in hell I would ever use swingarm extensions. If I wanted to stretch a bike I would play it safe and buy a well made extended swingarm. I saw a picture of Smokin on this board and his extensions looked like the wanted to break in half when he was taking off. I think he said he's like 130 pounds so you can imagine what it's doing if you're 200 pounds. Swingarm is one of the last places I'm looking to save a buck.
I saw those same photo's..........definitely looked like they were flexing HARD on launch with all that torque just trying to push that thing apart!! Unreal that they hold up they way do
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British flying couch with endtables and an orange thumper
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Hellmutt
Needs a job
Posts: 2013
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posted November 22, 2010 12:43 PM
quote:
quote:
quote:
What was that axle nut torqued to?
Are you able to have your axle torqued to factory specs runnin' BST's, Shane?
Carrozzeria wheels require that your axles be torqued to 50% of factory specs.
I torque the nut to about 80-85 ft lbs. I have not had any issues. Factory spec is 94 ft lbs.
What's weird is that these monsters are spec'd at 94 ftlb. but my old Yammie 1000 was spec'd to 105 ftlb?? Just don't get it sometimes..........still not much of a difference in 10 ftlb. so I'd almost assume that as long as you're torqing them to anything between 80-100 ftlb. should be fine -- especially with the castled axle nut and cotter keeping it from turning back much
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British flying couch with endtables and an orange thumper
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ThunderCK
Junior Member
Posts: 201
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posted November 22, 2010 01:29 PM
Even a low grade bolt is much higher grade then theaded rod.
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