zx14fan
Zone Head
Posts: 547
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posted December 16, 2009 02:10 PM
Auto tune
Is anyone using the auto tune? What are your thoughts on the product?
  
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starchild
Expert Class
Posts: 366
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posted December 16, 2009 02:17 PM
been using it for a couple of months---have not learned to use everything it has to offer --but i like it because it's simple and i understand it--i like it alot
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jay
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zx14fan
Zone Head
Posts: 547
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posted December 16, 2009 02:31 PM
Is the power smooth through the full power band?
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starchild
Expert Class
Posts: 366
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posted December 16, 2009 02:35 PM
very smooth--- no break up -hesitation and smooth through five gears
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jay
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chrisdhall
Novice Class
Posts: 64
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posted December 16, 2009 02:47 PM
I have been using autotune for about 9 months and I have found it to be a very good piece of kit. It's fitted to an 09 with Yoshi end cans (std headers) which I use for street riding and a once year tour around Spain. I have the gear position/speed sensor wired up, so the autotune has created a map for each gear. (How long would it take to create a custom map for each gear on a dyno!????). And of course it takes into account the ram-air effect etc.
I'm in the UK, so I "benefit" from the bike having an O2 sensor already in the exhaust. Unfortunately the OEM sensor is M12 thread and Dynojet's is M18 (I think),so some welding was required. Also needed buy the O2 sensor eliminator.
I'm still waiting for the PCV LCD display so I can easily monitor the AFR. I have had a laptop strapped to tank just to check that its working correctly, but I wouldn't recomend it over any distance 
I runs really really well - I'm sure you can get the same from a decent map done on the dyno. I reckon there are three advantages. 1. The map is created during real-world riding. 2. The sensor is in the "best" place for measuring the AFR. On the dyno (the one I use anyway) a tube is shoved up the end can and the measurements taken. There is going to be some delay in getting the readings, so it needs a good operator. 3. On the dyno the bike can overheat if the operator doesn't have the time/patience to let it cool down.
I'm going to pull the flies out this winter, with the autotune, I can let it create a new map as I ride.
I'm sure there are disadvantages, but so far I've not come across any.
Chris
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chrisdhall
Novice Class
Posts: 64
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posted December 16, 2009 02:48 PM
quote:
very smooth--- no break up -hesitation and smooth through five gears
+1
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ZX11D
Zone Head
Internet Police
Posts: 674
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posted December 16, 2009 03:00 PM
 Edited By: ZX11D on 16 Dec 2009 23:00
quote:
very smooth--- no break up -hesitation and smooth through five gears
Five gears....hmmmm....what is going on with the last gear, and is it the first or the sixth?
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'94 ZX-11
'07 ZX-14
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starchild
Expert Class
Posts: 366
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posted December 16, 2009 03:36 PM
i dont see 6th gear --- bike is gear for five---never see the street
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jay
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starchild
Expert Class
Posts: 366
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posted December 16, 2009 03:43 PM
hey zx11d you were joking right?
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jay
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zx14fan
Zone Head
Posts: 547
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posted December 16, 2009 05:17 PM
No joke star Im looking at this thing and so far it looks pretty good I just need a little more data on it?
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starchild
Expert Class
Posts: 366
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posted December 16, 2009 06:23 PM
i would suggest the auto tune if your like me----i tried the lm-1 and i never got it to work and never had the tech background to really get it together. the auto tune is simple--it is easily readable and it works directly. which means i cant screw it up.
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jay
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smokinZX14
Needs a life
Posts: 10197
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posted December 16, 2009 06:36 PM
quote:
No joke star Im looking at this thing and so far it looks pretty good I just need a little more data on it?
Here is the only problem with the Auto tune set up .. You have to know what A/F ratio you want or what works best ...You have to tell it what you want before you start the auto tune ...You can grab a map from dyno jet that closely matches your set up and start from there ...You should see A/F from 13.2 to 13.4 in the lower ranges and 12.9 to 13.0 in the upper ranges .. Problem is you will never now what is the best A/F unless you test them at the drag strip ..The Auto tune will work if you know what to ask of it ...If you program junk in it will give you junk back .. I used Brocks map in my auto tune and after many trips down the track the auto tune made no real changes to his map .. Now if the map was set for 13.0 on the top end and i asked it to give me 12.8 the auto tune would start adding numbers to get me to 12.8 ..You see what i'm getting at ?
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Smokin Performance Cycles..
Tampa Bay , FL .. Brocks Performance Dealer ..
Gen 2 ZX14R Best ET 8.43 , Best MPH 164.95
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bruno nadeau
Expert Class
Posts: 174
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posted December 16, 2009 06:49 PM
i use auto tune but it is a motty afr tuner like it a lot :choice of gear,temp.tps,to autotune.........can save 2 maps can switch between the 2 on the fly.3.5 hours of dataloging :afr, target afr,rpm,temp.speed,gear.lap.simple to use, load a target afr and ride the bike, fuel map is built as you ride,to keep the new fuel map stop the bike by the kill switch and wait 5 secondes before turning the key off thats all. as you ride it is always mapping for weather, altitude,and ram air.i use it on my 06 and now on my 09 for the last 18 monts with 0 problem.on my first bike i have to make a custom instal(splice and cut wires)but now they have a plug and play that i use on my 09.here are someEX:of a log,and target afr and partly built fuel map.
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bruno nadeau
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zx14fan
Zone Head
Posts: 547
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posted December 16, 2009 09:51 PM
Smokin would you say its best for the street and the twistys or would you prefer a dyno over the auto tune?
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ZX11D
Zone Head
Internet Police
Posts: 674
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posted December 16, 2009 11:01 PM
quote:
hey zx11d you were joking right?
Yeah. 
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'94 ZX-11
'07 ZX-14
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chrisdhall
Novice Class
Posts: 64
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posted December 17, 2009 01:03 AM
quote:
quote:
No joke star Im looking at this thing and so far it looks pretty good I just need a little more data on it?
Here is the only problem with the Auto tune set up .. You have to know what A/F ratio you want or what works best ...You have to tell it what you want before you start the auto tune ...You can grab a map from dyno jet that closely matches your set up and start from there ...You should see A/F from 13.2 to 13.4 in the lower ranges and 12.9 to 13.0 in the upper ranges .. Problem is you will never now what is the best A/F unless you test them at the drag strip ..The Auto tune will work if you know what to ask of it ...If you program junk in it will give you junk back .. I used Brocks map in my auto tune and after many trips down the track the auto tune made no real changes to his map .. Now if the map was set for 13.0 on the top end and i asked it to give me 12.8 the auto tune would start adding numbers to get me to 12.8 ..You see what i'm getting at ?
I started off by using the AFR map supplied by Dynojet. I tweaked the AFR at low rpm/small throttle openings as I felt it was very sensitive causing the bike to lurch forward given the slightest whiff of throttle. I richened it up slightly. This seemed to cure the problem - or at least my perception of it!
I'm not a track rider so I can only go on what I feel when riding on the street - the Dynojet AFR has been fine for me (with the tweak above).
I have the map switch wired in, so its easy to compare maps. As autotune has made changes to the map I store the maps on my laptop.
After posting last night. I compared a map created in the summer (80°F) to the current late Autumn map (45°F). Autotune has made some changes - richening up mainly.
Chris
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smokinZX14
Needs a life
Posts: 10197
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posted December 17, 2009 06:37 AM
quote:
Smokin would you say its best for the street and the twistys or would you prefer a dyno over the auto tune?
I would have to say get it dyno tuned first and then play with the auto tune to refine the map for the best tune for street riding .. Like i said you could skip the dyno tune part if you can get a good base map from the dynojet web site and then let the auto tune refine the map ..Either way will work but either way you will have to spend some time getting just what you want ...That is why it's good to start off with a really good known map because it takes a lot of extra work out of the picture ..That is unless you like tinkering like i do , in that case tinker away ..
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Smokin Performance Cycles..
Tampa Bay , FL .. Brocks Performance Dealer ..
Gen 2 ZX14R Best ET 8.43 , Best MPH 164.95
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chrisdhall
Novice Class
Posts: 64
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posted December 17, 2009 07:54 AM
quote:
That is why it's good to start off with a really good known map because it takes a lot of extra work out of the picture ..That is unless you like tinkering like i do , in that case tinker away ..
.
Good point, smokinZX14 - The better the base map, the quicker autotune will refine the map.
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JDC
Zone Head
Posts: 570
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posted December 17, 2009 09:01 AM
I have a Bazzaz unit, and for the turbo it seems great. I was less pleased with it before the turbo. However, I really like the idea of having a map for each gear, and if the Bazzaz goes out, I will likely do the PC 5 auto-tune thing.
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zx14fan
Zone Head
Posts: 547
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posted December 17, 2009 10:03 AM
Smokin,Do you think it would be best to set the auto tune up for each gear?I did find a new map on the dynojet site but could not find a map that fit the mild mods I have done.No fly ca smog removed block off plates cad removed from the header and KnN.The only map I Could download that was close was a no flys full system map.After that I still have that low rpm flat spot so now I dont know what to think about it?Possible tps but the bike is not a year old.Am I overlooking something?
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smokinZX14
Needs a life
Posts: 10197
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posted December 17, 2009 02:29 PM
quote:
Smokin,Do you think it would be best to set the auto tune up for each gear?I did find a new map on the dynojet site but could not find a map that fit the mild mods I have done.No fly ca smog removed block off plates cad removed from the header and KnN.The only map I Could download that was close was a no flys full system map.After that I still have that low rpm flat spot so now I dont know what to think about it?Possible tps but the bike is not a year old.Am I overlooking something?
I have not tried the mapping in each gear yet ..I don't really think you would need to do that unless you were looking for 1/100 of a second more ET at the track ..
If i were you i would unplug the P/C and go test ride the bike ... If the problem goes away the problem has to be the Map or the Throttle setting in the P/C itself ..Don't worry about having the flys out without a P/C , a lot of guys ran there zx14s with flys out and no map and didn't hurt anything ...You will be only running it that way but for a short time just to see if it runs ok.. I would not rule out a bad P/C unit , it doesn't happen offten but it does happen ..
____________
Smokin Performance Cycles..
Tampa Bay , FL .. Brocks Performance Dealer ..
Gen 2 ZX14R Best ET 8.43 , Best MPH 164.95
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zx14fan
Zone Head
Posts: 547
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posted December 17, 2009 04:00 PM
Thanks for the advice smokin will try that tonight.
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brunocbrxx
Parking Attendant
Posts: 14
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posted March 13, 2010 06:13 AM
quote:
I have the gear position/speed sensor wired up, so the autotune has created a map for each gear. (How long would it take to create a custom map for each gear on a dyno!????). And of course it takes into account the ram-air effect etc.
Hi there,
I'm trying to wire the gear sensor to the PCV, but I've found that the default settings from Dynojet have some issues.
Connecting the PCV to the laptop has shown that the gear that the PCV "read" is not always the gear I'm in.
Sometimes (well most of the times) I'm in 2nd or 3rd gear and the PCV software is saying that I'm in 3rd or 4th gear.
That happens also in 4th and 5th gears
Ther only ones that are 100% accurate are 1st and 6th gears.
The other four have some variations when I rev up.
This DOES NOT HAPPEN on deccel and when holding the throttle steady.
My settings are :
SpeedPulsesPerDistance=8259
Upper ratio 1st gear - 148460
Lower ratio 1st gear - 134321
Upper ratio 2nd gear - 111995
Lower ratio 2nd gear - 101328
Upper ratio 3rd gear - 87645
Lower ratio 3rd gear - 79298
Upper ratio 4th gear - 75006
Lower ratio 4th gear - 67863
Upper ratio 5th gear - 65421
Lower ratio 5th gear - 59190
Upper ratio 6th gear - 58237
Lower ratio 6th gear - 52690
Updating tho the latest Power Commander software has changed this values has it align all values so there is no gap between the lower ratios and next gear upper ratios.
I've tried to calibrate the settings reading the dynojet instructions but that even screwed up more the values.
Can you please post your values or send them to my e-mail. brunocbrxx@gmail.com
Thank you very much
Best regards
Bruno
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JDC
Zone Head
Posts: 570
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posted March 13, 2010 09:03 AM
Edited By: JDC on 13 Mar 2010 17:08
quote:
quote:
No joke star Im looking at this thing and so far it looks pretty good I just need a little more data on it?
Here is the only problem with the Auto tune set up .. You have to know what A/F ratio you want or what works best ...You have to tell it what you want before you start the auto tune ...You can grab a map from dyno jet that closely matches your set up and start from there ...You should see A/F from 13.2 to 13.4 in the lower ranges and 12.9 to 13.0 in the upper ranges .. Problem is you will never now what is the best A/F unless you test them at the drag strip ..The Auto tune will work if you know what to ask of it ...If you program junk in it will give you junk back .. I used Brocks map in my auto tune and after many trips down the track the auto tune made no real changes to his map .. Now if the map was set for 13.0 on the top end and i asked it to give me 12.8 the auto tune would start adding numbers to get me to 12.8 ..You see what i'm getting at ?
I agree. I found the Bazzaz unit a little off for best TTD on a non-turbo bike. Only way to get it 'on' was a custom map, which I could see the dyno difference and feel it in the response, as well. Since adding the turbo, it is the best thing since mother's milk...
because I think it does a good job at approximating, and for the turbo I need to be in the range of, say 12.5... or ... which for turbos, as compared to OEM tuning, seems less precise a need for those tenths. A tenth here or there seems much more meaningful on an OEM bike and can really throw off your TTD. Turbo'd bikes seem to enjoy the slop of being wet.
I'd sure like to discover if there were a practical way for turbo'd bikes to tune to best TTD moving lean, without possible damage to the engine.
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bigdtd
Needs a job
Interceptors
Posts: 4209
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posted March 13, 2010 12:47 PM
quote:
been using it for a couple of months---have not learned to use everything it has to offer --but i like it because it's simple and i understand it--i like it alot
what do you use for your target A/F ratio?
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2006 Black ZX-14,6 inches over,16/42, flies out,BMC Street Filter,Brock's Street Meg,Brock's Radial Mount Strap,PClll with Race map,Dynojet LCD w/Techmount, ZX-14 fender eliminator,Pilot Power2CTs,Speedohealer,Pazzo Levers,Cox Radiator Guard, Garmin Nuvi 265WT
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