07zx14blk
Expert Class
ZX6R, ZX9R,ZX12R,ZX14
Posts: 252
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posted August 17, 2009 06:15 AM
Were does the marble go again?
First let me apologise for posting what may be an often repeated question on how to stop / minimize backfiring after junking the stock exhaust for a full system… I did spend two hours searching for and reading posts before posting this question.
My problem… My bike is backfiring frequently and I would like to minimize it.
Situation… I have an 07 ZX14 (not a California Model) with a full CF Exhaust.
The marble mode… From what I understand I should:
1. Pull the panels of the right side of the bike exposing the air box;
2. Pull the black hose from the Air box and then tape a marble into the hole left in the airbox?
I am sure the above is not right from reading posts in the past I was under the impression that the marble was to go into either one or several hose's…
Question: How many hoses are to be blocked, where are the hose’s any other info you think would be pertinent.
Can I also take this opportunity to thank so many of you for posting in the past about removing the secondary flies… I was very hesitant to do so and just this past weekend got up the nerve to pull them out, what a difference my one regret is that I did not pull them 2 years ago.
____________
ZX14 - Flies out,Full Yosh CF,PCIII,Dark Smoke, Thottlemister, Fender Eliminator, CF Hugger, BMC Race Fillter
  
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bigdtd
Needs a job
Interceptors
Posts: 4209
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posted August 17, 2009 06:54 AM
never heard of the marble thing, but you should minimize leaks to the air box. brock's pipes come with a block off plug. there is a tre out there that minimizes the popping if it bothers you.
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2006 Black ZX-14,6 inches over,16/42, flies out,BMC Street Filter,Brock's Street Meg,Brock's Radial Mount Strap,PClll with Race map,Dynojet LCD w/Techmount, ZX-14 fender eliminator,Pilot Power2CTs,Speedohealer,Pazzo Levers,Cox Radiator Guard, Garmin Nuvi 265WT
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Wheelie
Needs a life
Old Man
Posts: 6902
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posted August 17, 2009 08:13 AM
mine still backfires
wee
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Sergent
Expert Class
Posts: 106
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posted August 17, 2009 09:43 AM
I have had mine since 06 put brock smeg on shortly after and have never had a backfire of any kind in the 3 plus years i have owned the bike
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07zx14blk
Expert Class
ZX6R, ZX9R,ZX12R,ZX14
Posts: 252
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posted August 17, 2009 09:44 AM
I am hoping to remove the PAIR system and Block off the AIS (i.e. The Marble Mod), if this does not eliminate my backfires I will probably play with the PC and see if making little changes (-20% at the 1500 will eliminate it)… I know a lot of people say the best / only way to get ride of it is to install a TRE but I don’t want to lose my gear indicator.
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ZX14 - Flies out,Full Yosh CF,PCIII,Dark Smoke, Thottlemister, Fender Eliminator, CF Hugger, BMC Race Fillter
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07zx14blk
Expert Class
ZX6R, ZX9R,ZX12R,ZX14
Posts: 252
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posted August 17, 2009 09:53 AM
quote:
I have had mine since 06 put brock smeg on shortly after and have never had a backfire of any kind in the 3 plus years i have owned the bike
Thanks for the info after looking at the Brock installation instructions on line it comes with instructions on how to Block off the AIS and a little red cap to do it (so your bike is almost definitely already done).... not to mention a good PC Map...
I think after blocking the tube running from the air box I will load a new map, the map I had loaded was a generic map (the only one I could find for Yosh FS with the flies in now that mine are out remapping may help.
____________
ZX14 - Flies out,Full Yosh CF,PCIII,Dark Smoke, Thottlemister, Fender Eliminator, CF Hugger, BMC Race Fillter
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LAB3
Needs a job
Posts: 2977
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posted August 17, 2009 10:32 AM
TRE from Ivans Performance will STOP the poping when you let of the throttle at 3500.
It is a lot easier to install and I would not mess with the hose and reed plates (Block off)
on a street bike. Ivan has a map for the Yosh pipe as he sells them and makes a good
street map that is smooth. I am running it now on my Muzzy M14. If you Drag race only
forget about the TRE and plug the hose and there are several shops that sell the block off plates. Also get a 2008/2009 air cleaner cover they are metal. My 2007 was plastic and warped a little and leaked dirt in the ram air box.
Sergent you are LUCKY if your map cured the popping. I have tried 5 different maps and
yes a Brocks too and my 2007 popped like a fire cracker. Until I installed the TRE, the down side is my gear indicator is always showing N but I can count to 6 :-)
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BobC
Pro
Posts: 1736
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posted August 17, 2009 10:35 AM
I'm running a SMEG with a Brock map, no airbox mods and it hardly ever backfires. It did pop occasionally on a TiForce system. I expect the map makes a difference.
____________
Candy Thunder Blue 2006 ZZR1400
Stock wheelbase
Max: 205.4 mph in 1.25 miles
2012 ZZR1400 in Golden Blazed Green
Brock CT Full System. etc
Max: 203.1 in 1 mile (so far)
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LAB3
Needs a job
Posts: 2977
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posted August 17, 2009 10:46 AM
quote:
I'm running a SMEG with a Brock map, no airbox mods and it hardly ever backfires. It did pop occasionally on a TiForce system. I expect the map makes a difference.
That's good to know Bob. I am going have a Dyno tune done when I install the
Bazzaz system I got from Dubious. So far none of the maps I have tried has not cured it
with out the TRE. It will be good to see what the A/F ratio is as the Bazzaz has a O2 sensor.
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masszx14
Pro
A mind beside itself!
Posts: 1806
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posted August 17, 2009 11:18 AM
I have the Muzzy Reed blocks kit (that also includes a billet plug for the airbox)- not
sure if it helps the popping on decel but saves a little bit of weight after the removal
of the unnecessary hoses and sensor.
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universal@mind
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LAB3
Needs a job
Posts: 2977
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posted August 17, 2009 11:45 AM
Stan
When I purchased Shanes M14 he advised me to just leave all that alone for a street
bike. I have the Muzzy block off plates (they are nice billet parts) but I have not bothered
to pull of the exhaust to install them yet. I am still ridding in the mountains so I have
not lowered and and installed the extensions yet. So far the damn TRE is the only thing
that has stopped the decel pop on my 2007.
Louis
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FastestBusaAround
Needs a life
I eat Fish...
Posts: 7889
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posted August 17, 2009 03:53 PM
 Edited By: FastestBusaAround on 17 Aug 2009 23:55
Forget about the popping, as you'll never get rid of it unless you install a TRE, which will:
1) Affect performance
2) Keep your GPS indicator in neutral forever.
Block off's won't help and the "PAIR" system you speak of is on Suzuki, not Kawasaki, I believe 
Same shit, different name, but you're not going to get rid of the popping, unless you go TRE...and that's not going to benefit you, because what others have failed to mention, is that it uses the NEUTRAL map all the time in all the gears once you do that. The bike wasn't designed to be run that way and you will LOSE some performance.
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FYYFF!!!
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masszx14
Pro
A mind beside itself!
Posts: 1806
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posted August 17, 2009 04:16 PM
Edited By: masszx14 on 18 Aug 2009 00:18
quote:
Stan
When I purchased Shanes M14 he advised me to just leave all that alone for a street
bike. I have the Muzzy block off plates (they are nice billet parts) but I have not bothered
to pull of the exhaust to install them yet. I am still ridding in the mountains so I have
not lowered and and installed the extensions yet. So far the damn TRE is the only thing
that has stopped the decel pop on my 2007.
Louis
Yank it all out and put the Muzzy plates in- just my $0.02.
The bike will not throw any codes on the dash- that seems to be
a concern for some when unplugging the sensor.
It doesn't take long to put them in either.
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universal@mind
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johnsonzx14
Expert Class
Posts: 487
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posted August 17, 2009 04:31 PM
Mine pops at 3500 everytime.. I have the brocks smeg....
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makenna
Expert Class
Posts: 355
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posted August 17, 2009 11:22 PM
Big K,
Seems everyone thinks you should buy a new Brocks system and that will take care of the popping. I think you should too and that way you won't have the same system I do, well almost the same.
You should almost be due for a new bike anyhow, you are getting close to 10,000 Kilometres on the one you have.
____________
English is the only language that matters.
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AcadianaZX
Advertiser
Posts: 530
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posted August 18, 2009 12:11 AM
I have the 07 14 with the Muzzy M14 with the PCV and auto tune and the PAIR valve hose is plugged with the Brock red cap that you can probably get at a hardware store.
The PAIR valve dumps extra air into the exhaust via the head through the reed valves on the valve cover to help burn any extra fuel that make it to the exhaust for the cats. in the stock exhaust. Since the Muzzy pipe doesn't have the cats. the extra air getting into the exhaust may lead to a lean condition in the pipe at low and mid RPM's. In my case with the auto tune getting confused by the extra air it was making an overly rich condition. In all I plugged the hose under the air box on the right side and have not had any popping since. Anyone need a map for the 14 with a M14 with the PCV just give me a yell and when I get home in three weeks, I'll email it to ya.
James
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted August 18, 2009 03:48 AM
Edited By: Shane661 on 18 Aug 2009 11:50
I have the block off's on mine. But it will still pop from time to time....just like it did before. And it doesn't bother me one bit. 
About the only difference I have noticed is that the bike seems to lope a bit when cold. Perhaps due to the affect on exhaust scavenging.
Shane
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07zx14blk
Expert Class
ZX6R, ZX9R,ZX12R,ZX14
Posts: 252
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posted August 18, 2009 08:54 AM
For those of you that are interested…
I blocked off the tube running out of the air box, and it definitely made a difference. While I was still able to get it to pop on quick deceleration around 4k it is no were near as bad as it was.
I have also loaded a new Map from PC (Yosh Full System, flies out stock air filter), while this is not exactly like my setup (I have a race filter)… hopefully it will improve the situation even more, I have not as of yet had a chance to drive it with the new map.
____________
ZX14 - Flies out,Full Yosh CF,PCIII,Dark Smoke, Thottlemister, Fender Eliminator, CF Hugger, BMC Race Fillter
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LAB3
Needs a job
Posts: 2977
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posted August 18, 2009 11:27 AM
Edited By: LAB3 on 18 Aug 2009 20:03
quote:
Forget about the popping, as you'll never get rid of it unless you install a TRE, which will:
1) Affect performance
2) Keep your GPS indicator in neutral forever.
Block off's won't help and the "PAIR" system you speak of is on Suzuki, not Kawasaki, I believe
Same shit, different name, but you're not going to get rid of the popping, unless you go TRE...and that's not going to benefit you, because what others have failed to mention, is that it uses the NEUTRAL map all the time in all the gears once you do that. The bike wasn't designed to be run that way and you will LOSE some performance.
Steve
Smokin did a dyno pull with and with out the TRE and same HP #.
So you are saying Smokin is Wrong???
I have done roll on's with two other 14 and no difference. I am wrong Too??
I can count to 6 and In 35 years did not need a bike to show me what gear I am in.
And I did mention the gear indicator was in N
N map...uh PCIII has my map.
Not flaming you but this info was useless.
I do not Drag Race every week end. Some of us ride them every day.
And I hate the popping. And my TRE works just fine...for me.. PAIR not on 14?? I will look that up in Service Manual.. ummmm :-)
Best Regards
Louis
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Bluebyyou
Expert Class
Gettin My Curve On
Posts: 276
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posted August 18, 2009 11:32 AM
Don't bother, it does nothing to reduce the pop.
____________
2007 Bad to the Bone ZX-14 flies out, full Muzzy exhaust system, PC III, BMC race
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smokinZX14
Needs a life
Posts: 10197
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posted August 18, 2009 11:50 AM
quote:
quote:
Forget about the popping, as you'll never get rid of it unless you install a TRE, which will:
1) Affect performance
2) Keep your GPS indicator in neutral forever.
Block off's won't help and the "PAIR" system you speak of is on Suzuki, not Kawasaki, I believe
Same shit, different name, but you're not going to get rid of the popping, unless you go TRE...and that's not going to benefit you, because what others have failed to mention, is that it uses the NEUTRAL map all the time in all the gears once you do that. The bike wasn't designed to be run that way and you will LOSE some performance.
Steve
Smokin did a dyno pull with and with out the TRE and same HP #.
So you are saying Smokin is Wrong???
I have done roll on's with two other 14 and no difference. I am wrong Too??
I can count to 6 and In 35 years did not need a bike to show me what gear I am in.
And I did mention the gear indicator was in N
N map...uh PCIII has my map.
Not flaming you but this info was useless.
I do not Drag Race every week end. Some of us ride them every day.
And I hate the popping. And my TRE works just fine...for me.. PAIR not on 14?? ummmm :-)
Best Regards
Louis
Yes i tested the TRE ( This is the TRE that opens the flys faster ) and keeps you in 6th gear map ... The other TRE is for the popping only and puts you in the N map.. I did NOT test that TRE ..
Popping at 3500 on decell is Normal .... 3500 is where the fuel turns back on when decelling .... Easy fix is to pull the clutch in at 4000 RPMs ..
I myself love the decall pop , it shoots flames also !!! No better way to tell someone that they just got their ass kicked by a zx14 ...
____________
Smokin Performance Cycles..
Tampa Bay , FL .. Brocks Performance Dealer ..
Gen 2 ZX14R Best ET 8.43 , Best MPH 164.95
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07zx14blk
Expert Class
ZX6R, ZX9R,ZX12R,ZX14
Posts: 252
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posted August 19, 2009 09:01 AM
Well it would appear that I am the only one in the world that is not a big fan of the decal pop… It also looks like I am going to need to live with it because the marble mod and the new map did squat.
I am going to try one more thing (mess with the PC and drop the map to -20 from 4k down to 2k at less than 50% throttle) however I am not holding out preconceived ideas that this will be successful I also hope it doesn’t overtly affect performance.
____________
ZX14 - Flies out,Full Yosh CF,PCIII,Dark Smoke, Thottlemister, Fender Eliminator, CF Hugger, BMC Race Fillter
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LAB3
Needs a job
Posts: 2977
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posted August 19, 2009 10:27 AM
I hated it enough to keep my TRE installed. All is quiet. Not sure about you leaning out
that much and riding in 6th gear at that RPM for long hiway rides.
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masszx14
Pro
A mind beside itself!
Posts: 1806
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posted August 19, 2009 11:02 AM
You could:
A- Avoid 3,500 rpm on decel- it's not that difficult
or
B- get a TRE 006 that will keep the bike thinking it's in N
____________
universal@mind
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted August 19, 2009 11:52 AM
Edited By: Shane661 on 19 Aug 2009 19:53
The "no decel pop TRE" will, to my knowledge, make the bike think it is in neutral all of the time. It will lose hp. When you pull in the clutch, or are in neutral, the ecu uses a different map. Part of that map includes pulling timing, which decreases power.
The "no decel pop" TRE is a different part than the standard TRE.
Shane
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