gilberjj
Needs a job
Friend of Fast
Posts: 3196
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posted April 08, 2009 07:55 AM
Brocks vs Muzzys: The end-all competition
Here it is folks. This thread is designed to test interest in a very possible competition. Currently I am in the process of trading my m14 sidewinder for a Brocks Alien Head. This my favorite exhaust, and it will be my 4th aftermarket exhaust.
Proposal......
Since there isn't really much evidence that I've found, I wanted to do an end-all competition to discover which exhaust REALLY makes the most power on the dyno. THE ONLY way to truly know (imho) is to set up a competition like this....
Dyno the exhausts
on the same bike
on the same day
monitering a/f ratios
I have already contacted Sticks he is on board (to provide the Muzzy's m14). Maybe I'm just cheap, but I propose a public fund to help us pull this off. It will take a while to get the bike on the dyno, get a couple baseline runs (maybe change maps), pull the bike off the dyno, change exhaust, and then do the same for the other exhaust. It could very well cost a couple hundred bucks $$$$$$. Since I don't have extra money right now, and I would throw money of my own towards a similar competition, I propose setting up a paypal account for donations to pull this off. I'll start with $50 of my own, and I believe Sticks said he would put some skin in the game as well. Let me know what you guys think.
I plan on documenting this fully (pictures, written, and video)!!!!!!
Let the discussion BEGIN!
  
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KawaBonzai
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posted April 08, 2009 08:27 AM
 Edited By: KawaBonzai on 8 Apr 2009 16:28
Useless.
"Why do I need to stick a Brocks on my bike to prove my Muzzy makes more HP?"
As you can tell from my previous statement there will also be a lot of bias in the endeavor.
The same exact pipe on the same bike on the same dyno will yield a variety of dyno numbers. Do you think swapping out pipes will make any difference?
There has NEVER been and End-All test of any nature in sportbikes. You can spend a million dollars testing which bike is better, the Hayabusa or the Zx-14 and come out with a clear winner. Then a rider hops on the losing bike and beats the winner. that's the way it goes. no difference with with pipes either.
Even Brock's himself says that a dyno Queen is not gonna win on the track, so dyno numbers are NOT indicative of a winning setup.
And just to sum it up nicely ... my penis is bigger than everyone else. I win. 
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PC-III w/USB, Muzzys M14 + Carbon Oval + M10, BMC Race Filter, Flies Out, Buell Pegs, Heli Risers
www.TucsonSportRiders.com - Tucson's Premier SportRider Community
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Wheelie
Needs a life
Old Man
Posts: 6902
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posted April 08, 2009 08:28 AM
whos dyno?
wee
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Swiftkart
Expert Class
Posts: 349
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posted April 08, 2009 08:37 AM
Brock state's he doesn't build a dyno king for a pipe, but he does build a exhaust that performs on the track so your dyno numbers really will not tell the whole story
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2006 ZX14, Brock CT-Meg, PC, ignition module, E85, 214 lbs suited, 8.96@152.32 1.46 60'
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KawaBonzai
Zone Head
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Posts: 537
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posted April 08, 2009 08:38 AM
Send me $100.00 dollars and I'll photoshop up some dyno charts for you.
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PC-III w/USB, Muzzys M14 + Carbon Oval + M10, BMC Race Filter, Flies Out, Buell Pegs, Heli Risers
www.TucsonSportRiders.com - Tucson's Premier SportRider Community
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gilberjj
Needs a job
Friend of Fast
Posts: 3196
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posted April 08, 2009 08:39 AM
quote:
Useless.
"Why do I need to stick a Brocks on my bike to prove my Muzzy makes more HP?"
As you can tell from my previous statement there will also be a lot of bias in the endeavor.
The same exact pipe on the same bike on the same dyno will yield a variety of dyno numbers. Do you think swapping out pipes will make any difference?
There has NEVER been and End-All test of any nature in sportbikes. You can spend a million dollars testing which bike is better, the Hayabusa or the Zx-14 and come out with a clear winner. Then a rider hops on the losing bike and beats the winner. that's the way it goes. no difference with with pipes either.
Even Brock's himself says that a dyno Queen is not gonna win on the track, so dyno numbers are NOT indicative of a winning setup.
And just to sum it up nicely ... my penis is bigger than everyone else. I win.
So see the test and decide for YOURSELF which is the better exhaust. You're right that dyno queens don't always win, and it usually comes down the rider regardless of exhaust, but I want to know which exhaust will make MY bike faster. We can overlay the dyno runs and it will show/compare low, mid, and top.
quote:
whos dyno?
wee
There are three climate controlled dynos that I know of in this area (2 are dynojets, and I'm not sure of the other). There are also several other dynos. What would you recommend? I dynoed at Ducati Seattle in their climate controlled dyno but I didn't like it because their fan wouldn't to hit the intake. I dynoed real low (something like 154), and I think a lot of it was because my bike couldn't get air.
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Swiftkart
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Posts: 349
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posted April 08, 2009 08:44 AM
I must admit, it will be worth seeing just for a reference
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2006 ZX14, Brock CT-Meg, PC, ignition module, E85, 214 lbs suited, 8.96@152.32 1.46 60'
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gilberjj
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posted April 08, 2009 08:47 AM
^^^^ WORD
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Wheelie
Needs a life
Old Man
Posts: 6902
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posted April 08, 2009 09:09 AM
if the Muzzle made 1-2 hp more than the Brock/Hindle, I would still buy the Brock.
wee
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Big Ced
Expert Class
Soldier
Posts: 117
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posted April 08, 2009 10:10 AM
Both are nice to me. It is just a preference in name. It would be good to see but it wouldn't be the deciding factor on which one to purchase. .
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I don't keep it 100, I keep it 1000
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gilberjj
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Friend of Fast
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posted April 08, 2009 10:19 AM
quote:
It would be good to see but it wouldn't be the deciding factor on which one to purchase. .
I agree. That is a good way of putting it.
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Sticks_n_Stones
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Posts: 3930
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posted April 08, 2009 10:25 AM
Think you guys are missing the real point: all the huge numbers of viewers who come on here thru google searches and links we post up in other forums. There's probably a thousand hits to every post made, just from guys browsing for info.
Owning a Muzzy, I tend to get the underdog role quite abit, for no reason. As far as I can tell the pipe build quality is on par, the HP is on par, and the customer service -while favoring Brocks- of both Brocks and Muzzy are both solidly positive. With Brocks you get more maps and support, while Muzzy is significantly cheaper for identical build and HP quality. Six of one, half dozen of another.
So this will be something we all can refer to when the BS starts to get heavy and people go looking for real world comparisons.
____________
'06 zx14
Muzzy M10/M14
PCIII w/ Muzzy map
Flies out K&N in!
bits n pieces...
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Silver08
Expert Class
Posts: 461
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posted April 08, 2009 11:15 AM
i would like to see a sidewinder shootout between the Brock, M14, and Tsukigi
power, track MPH, and clearance.
the brock street pipes make more power than the old muzzys do, with the M14 configurations it should be close.
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08 ZX14
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Bawls
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re-learning to ride
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posted April 08, 2009 11:27 AM
i say we have ninjaboy do a track comparo since he's the most consistant (within a hundredth of a second). hey gilber... shoot me an e-mail chadley.yates@gmail.com.
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Best 60ft: 1.42
Best 1/8th: 5.97
Best 1/8th MPH: 119
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Sticks_n_Stones
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posted April 08, 2009 12:02 PM
Duuuuude Bawls man, you're like all the way down in S.D., man. Thats like San Diego California! Must be like 2200 miles away from us fellas! Far out man, tooo far out...
lol
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'06 zx14
Muzzy M10/M14
PCIII w/ Muzzy map
Flies out K&N in!
bits n pieces...
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Bawls
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re-learning to ride
Posts: 2701
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posted April 08, 2009 12:10 PM
Lol... that was random. I'm a little confused as to why you mentioned that... but great spatial orientation. I'm glad that you are somewhat aware as to where people are in relation to you lol. You fly that computer chair well 
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Best 60ft: 1.42
Best 1/8th: 5.97
Best 1/8th MPH: 119
Brockland Police Badge # 001
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Sticks_n_Stones
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posted April 08, 2009 12:27 PM
Gilberjj is in my neck of the woods, and you want Ninjaboy to do a track comparo of our exhaust systems, and you wanted him to shoot you a PM which infers that you personally know Ninjaboy which obviously means he's a San Diego resident. I mean come on man, do I have to spell it out for you? ----- hmm, guess I just did.
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'06 zx14
Muzzy M10/M14
PCIII w/ Muzzy map
Flies out K&N in!
bits n pieces...
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06redzx14
Pro
Posts: 1022
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posted April 08, 2009 12:29 PM
actually ninjaboy (Pat) is from Louisiana
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06 alien head, no flies, PC+hub, 16/45 44 43, air shifter, dry shot
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masszx14
Pro
A mind beside itself!
Posts: 1806
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posted April 08, 2009 12:31 PM
I think we should keep in mind that the Alien Head
is roughly 5 lbs. lighter than the M14 
Even if the numbers are dead even that is still HUGE
advantage for Brock's IMHO
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universal@mind
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Sticks_n_Stones
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Posts: 3930
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posted April 08, 2009 12:36 PM
You absolutely SURE about that 5 pounds? I would be surprised if my Muzzy was more than 7 or 8 pounds to begin with. Guess we can weigh them when we do the shootout.
Does the Alien head require a custom oil pan? If so, does that oil pan weigh more than stock? Just wondering
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'06 zx14
Muzzy M10/M14
PCIII w/ Muzzy map
Flies out K&N in!
bits n pieces...
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masszx14
Pro
A mind beside itself!
Posts: 1806
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posted April 08, 2009 12:41 PM
quote:
You absolutely SURE about that 5 pounds? I would be surprised if my Muzzy was more than 7 or 8 pounds to begin with. Guess we can weigh them when we do the shootout.
Does the Alien head require a custom oil pan? If so, does that oil pan weigh more than stock? Just wondering
Check Shane's build thread - 100% sure!
Not sure why people don't bother checking it more often though 
No... to your second question
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universal@mind
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smokinZX14
Needs a life
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posted April 08, 2009 12:41 PM
What you don't read .. I have been testing pipes on the zx14 for 3 years AT the track where they should be tested .. Know if you don't like my tests just go to any ama prostar and see who is going fast and what pipe is on the bike ..Or for that matter go to any track and see who is fast and what pipe is on the bike .. The answer is very clear whos pipe is the fastest ..
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Smokin Performance Cycles..
Tampa Bay , FL .. Brocks Performance Dealer ..
Gen 2 ZX14R Best ET 8.43 , Best MPH 164.95
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slates
Expert Class
Posts: 377
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posted April 08, 2009 12:47 PM
quote:
What you don't read .. I have been testing pipes on the zx14 for 3 years AT the track where they should be tested .. Know if you don't like my tests just go to any ama prostar and see who is going fast and what pipe is on the bike ..Or for that matter go to any track and see who is fast and what pipe is on the bike .. The answer is very clear whos pipe is the fastest ..
+1
At the AMA Dragbike event at Indy in 2008, there were VERY few of the competition and Brocks pipes everywhere I looked, except those with the turbo dump pipes.
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black zx14 - Brock's Gen3 Carbon, PCIII, no secondaries, Carrozzeria wheels, Sato rearsets, Pazzo levers, GPR V4 steering damper, Puig windscreen, Tiger Racing chain guard
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Bawls
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posted April 08, 2009 12:48 PM
Edited By: Bawls on 8 Apr 2009 20:56
I was actually going to say that I might know someone who is interested in his m10 system and was going to get some info from him. As for pat. He is nowhere near me. The closest person to me is bronzestar who has 2 brocks sidewinder bikes.
It's kind of hard to spell something out when you've got absolutely no idea as to what's going on around you. Next time you aim to make someone look like an ass confirm that it's not you in the sights.
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Best 60ft: 1.42
Best 1/8th: 5.97
Best 1/8th MPH: 119
Brockland Police Badge # 001
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Shane661
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posted April 08, 2009 12:53 PM
quote:
Check Shane's build thread - 100% sure!
Not sure why people don't bother checking it more often though
Probably because it is 29 pages without a table of contents. Bawls started one for me (stored in my pm's...ugh) and Freek agreed to add one in. I just haven't been motivated to start a new one since the other one is lost along with the pm's...
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