yankeerob
Parking Attendant
Posts: 1
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posted April 06, 2008 03:29 PM
flies in flies out
someone please explain the benefit or difference when removing the secondaries on my 14.
  
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FasterThanStink
Pro
Posts: 1218
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posted April 06, 2008 04:44 PM
About 25-30 ft lbs more torque at 3500 RPM. It goes from a pussy cat to a tiger at all RPM's. You need to add a Power Commander to avoid a very lean condition down low.
http://www.bikeland.org/board/viewthread.php?FID=27&TID=24193&set_time=
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Speed has never killed anyone,
suddenly becoming stationary...
That's what gets you.
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Wheelie
Needs a life
Old Man
Posts: 6902
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posted April 06, 2008 05:10 PM
does that very lean condition only occur at wot or at cruising speed?
wee
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FASTESTbusaAROUND
Needs a life
I eat Fish...
Posts: 7889
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posted April 06, 2008 06:07 PM
WOT only, but you get WOT without twisting too more than a few degrees --
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FYYFF!!!
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icetee
Expert Class
Posts: 132
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posted April 07, 2008 05:44 AM
Flies open!
I love the way the bike comes alive after the flies were removed......
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THE VIEW FROM THE REAR NEVER CHANGES,UNLESS YOUR IN THE FRONT!
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Raptor14
Expert Class
Posts: 264
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posted April 07, 2008 03:03 PM
Stock (Flies In+Stock Exhaust+No PC) = No low end at all, feels like a Yamaha R6
Mod 1 (Flies In+Aftermarket Exhaust+PC) = Sounds better, but still has no low end
Mod 2 (Flies In+Aftermarket Exhaut+PC+TRE008) = Starting to get interesting, but still lacks something
Mod 3 (Flies Out+Aftermarket Exhaust+PC) = Now that's what I'm talking about!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Hate that decel backfire.
Mod 4 (Flies Out+Aftermarket Exhaust+PC+TRE006A) = Same as above but without the backfire.
I've tried em all. Mod 3 is the best if you wanna go fastest down the 1/4-mile. Mod 4 is the best if you are a street rider like me (slight loss in 1/4-mile time relative to Mod 3).
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KawaBonzai
Zone Head
Leader of the Back.
Posts: 537
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posted April 07, 2008 03:35 PM
Hi there,
Does the Timing Retard Elim. function of the GIPro ATRE do the same thing as the TRE008?
From what I gather from the GIPro ATRE is that you can hit a button and the unit goes passive. thats a great way to handle both scenarios for mods 3 & 4 ? I think?
... Bonzai
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PC-III w/USB, Muzzys M14 + Carbon Oval + M10, BMC Race Filter, Flies Out, Buell Pegs, Heli Risers
www.TucsonSportRiders.com - Tucson's Premier SportRider Community
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Raptor14
Expert Class
Posts: 264
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posted April 07, 2008 03:42 PM
I've heard of the GIPro ATRE but I'm not really familar with its capabilities. Not sure if it will lock to the neutral fuel map or not for Mod 4 functionality. I hear it will do the functionality of Mods 2 and 3. However, Mod 2 and Mod 3 have different fuel maps so unless the GIPro can change the fuel map at the same time it switches the functionality, it isn't doing the same things as Mods 2 and 3.
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Raptor14
Expert Class
Posts: 264
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posted April 07, 2008 03:48 PM
Oh yeah, the designation TRE (Timing Retard Eliminator) for the ZX14 is somewhat mis-leading. The ECU contains different ignition timing schedules and fuel maps for each gear, including neutral. The TRE008 locks the ECU to the 6th gear ignition and fuel maps. The TRE006A locks the ECU to the neutral ignition and fuel maps. Really, both TRE's are rather expensive resistors that you can buy for a few bucks at Radio Shack. The resistance value range for each ignition/fuel gear map is in the 2006 ZX14 Shop Manual. Not being electronically inclined I took the easy route and bought a TRE and installed in 5 minutes.
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KawaBonzai
Zone Head
Leader of the Back.
Posts: 537
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posted April 07, 2008 03:57 PM
 Edited By: KawaBonzai on 7 Apr 2008 17:04
Hmmm ...
From what the product description of the TRE says ...
quote:
How does it work? Your bikes ECU (computer) changes the ignition advance depending on what gear you are in. The best advance for all around drivability is the one in 5th gear. The TRE tricks the ECU into thinking it is in 5th gear all the time. Same for the speed restrictor. The computer kicks in a rev limiter in 6th gear to restrict top speed. Again, with the TRE, the computer never knows it is in 6th gear.
From the sounds of it, the TRE has nothing to do with mappings, just fooling the ECU in regards to what gear it's in. A side effect of the 'foolery' is of course a different mapping being applied stemming from what gear the ECU thinks it's in.
I'm wondering if Brocks includes the GIPro ATRE just to get past the 186 mph limiter.
Boy, the learning curve on this bike is a bit steep, hehehe.
... Bonzai
Edit : The quote above was for the 600A. I only found one source ont he net that semi-explained the 800A. The difference being the Neutral versus 6th gear "foolery".
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PC-III w/USB, Muzzys M14 + Carbon Oval + M10, BMC Race Filter, Flies Out, Buell Pegs, Heli Risers
www.TucsonSportRiders.com - Tucson's Premier SportRider Community
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bigdtd
Needs a job
Interceptors
Posts: 4209
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posted April 07, 2008 07:06 PM
pull the flies get a brocks pipe and mapping ,don't look back. you don't need the tre.
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2006 Black ZX-14,6 inches over,16/42, flies out,BMC Street Filter,Brock's Street Meg,Brock's Radial Mount Strap,PClll with Race map,Dynojet LCD w/Techmount, ZX-14 fender eliminator,Pilot Power2CTs,Speedohealer,Pazzo Levers,Cox Radiator Guard, Garmin Nuvi 265WT
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stevewfl
Moderator
Posts: 27920
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posted April 07, 2008 08:09 PM
quote:
pull the flies get a brocks pipe and mapping ,don't look back. you don't need the tre.
+1
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2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
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Raptor14
Expert Class
Posts: 264
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posted April 08, 2008 01:11 PM
Neutral fuel map doesn't cut the fuel for decel so the TRE006A eliminates the decel backfire. The TRE008 locks to the 6th gear map which opens the flies at 3,000 rpm rather than 6,000. Compared to the benefit of jus pulling the flies the TRE008 is worthless. Pull the flies and forget the TRE008. But you will need a PC and a map for your setup. If you don't like the backfire with a full exhaust system add a TRE006A or make your own. Then use the right fuel map in the PC for the TRE006A, flies out, and your exhaust system.
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nightmare
Pro
ACP Racing
Posts: 1797
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posted April 08, 2008 03:02 PM
POWER POWER AND more low end TORQUE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! pull them alread!
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2006 ZX14 Ninja "SWINE FLU"
60ft 1.23
8th Mile 5.16
ACP Racing
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butta4hc
Expert Class
Posts: 313
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posted April 09, 2008 12:14 AM
quote:
About 25-30 ft lbs more torque at 3500 RPM. It goes from a pussy cat to a tiger at all RPM's. You need to add a Power Commander to avoid a very lean condition down low.
http://www.bikeland.org/board/viewthread.php?FID=27&TID=24193&set_time=
Flies where already out on mine when I bought it so I never got to feel the "before and after" that everyone else has. No PC at the moment and bike runs hot in the city which leads me to believe that I am running lean because everything else checks out ok. PC will DEFINITELY be installed shortly to counteract this. Man I love this board!
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Butta
Hot Commodities MC
Paterson, NJ
2006 Black ZX-14 - Recall Frame Swap, Full Muzzy GP Exhaust, PCIII, BMC Race Filter, Flies Out, Braided Front Brake & Cutch Lines, Muzzy's Radiator Fan, Engine Ice Coolant, Frame Sliders, SubFrame Sliders, Puig Dark Smoke Windscreen, Powerbronze Hugger, Cox Radiator Guard, Unswitched Powerlet Outlet under seat, Switched Powerlet Outlet On Right Duct Panel, Intergrated Tail Light, HID lights high and low beam, Blue corner marker lights, Eclipse License Plate Blackout Kit, Black Pazzo Levers, Scorpio Alarm, Lojack Theft Recovery System, Rapid Transit Triple Tree Bag, Cortech Tank, Tail & Saddle Bags and the bragging rights for being "The Fastest 14 In The Country" for a few weeks when the 14 made it's debut here in the states.
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stevewfl
Moderator
Posts: 27920
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posted April 09, 2008 07:02 AM
we needed a wake for the whole the flies-in flies-out topic once again :P
____________
2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
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KawaBonzai
Zone Head
Leader of the Back.
Posts: 537
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posted April 09, 2008 08:38 AM
quote:
we needed a wake for the whole the flies-in flies-out topic once again :P
You are a moderator aren't you? That would indicate to me that you have the ability to "Sticky" some of the most common posts.
Use your powers for good, not for posting 4th grade images. 
... Bonzai
Ps. This is a message board, NOT a Knowledge Base or Wiki system. It's perfectly understandable for users to come here and post questions WITHOUT digging through pages of threads looking for their answer, or using the disfunctional Google Search feature.
If you don't think the search feature is busted, find "a" post from over a week ago with the keyword "Zyxlithylplyx" in it.
There are a lot of things that can be done to make "common" topics more obtainable, more so than raising the repost flag.
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PC-III w/USB, Muzzys M14 + Carbon Oval + M10, BMC Race Filter, Flies Out, Buell Pegs, Heli Risers
www.TucsonSportRiders.com - Tucson's Premier SportRider Community
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FasterThanStink
Pro
Posts: 1218
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posted April 09, 2008 12:28 PM
Agreed. There should be a sticky on removing secondaries. I have all but given up on the "search" feature. It returns so much irrelevant stuff it's useless. Or better yet a sticky with all the common 14 mods. Speedo healer, changing sprockets, Powercommander, exhaust.
Remember that there are always going to be newbies to the 14 visiting the forum. Why not make it easier for everyone?
____________
Speed has never killed anyone,
suddenly becoming stationary...
That's what gets you.
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KawaBonzai
Zone Head
Leader of the Back.
Posts: 537
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posted April 09, 2008 01:45 PM
quote:
I have all but given up on the "search" feature. It returns so much irrelevant stuff it's useless.
+1 for accuracy. Dead on, my findings too.
quote:
Or better yet a sticky with all the common 14 mods.
Kind of have to watch out for stickies. If the default threads per page is like 25, and we have 20 stickies then that means only 5 regular threads will be availabel on the first page.
A seperate forum where only Admin/Mod's can start topics is the best solution. however, I see the focus of these forums is to build a community first with organizing knowledge someplace near dead last.
quote:
Remember that there are always going to be newbies to the 14 visiting the forum. Why not make it easier for everyone?
+1 more for seeing the light.
100% agreement here.
... Bonzai
____________
PC-III w/USB, Muzzys M14 + Carbon Oval + M10, BMC Race Filter, Flies Out, Buell Pegs, Heli Risers
www.TucsonSportRiders.com - Tucson's Premier SportRider Community
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stevewfl
Moderator
Posts: 27920
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posted April 09, 2008 01:47 PM
quote:
quote:
we needed a wake for the whole the flies-in flies-out topic once again :P
You are a moderator aren't you? That would indicate to me that you have the ability to "Sticky" some of the most common posts.
Use your powers for good, not for posting 4th grade images.
... Bonzai
Ps. This is a message board, NOT a Knowledge Base or Wiki system. It's perfectly understandable for users to come here and post questions WITHOUT digging through pages of threads looking for their answer, or using the disfunctional Google Search feature.
If you don't think the search feature is busted, find "a" post from over a week ago with the keyword "Zyxlithylplyx" in it.
There are a lot of things that can be done to make "common" topics more obtainable, more so than raising the repost flag.
I'm not a mod for the ZX14 forum and you are right. once the mods see your suggestion I suspect some posts may be stickied. and on a lighter note, please never take my posts/pics serious
____________
2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
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KawaBonzai
Zone Head
Leader of the Back.
Posts: 537
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posted April 09, 2008 01:50 PM
Edited By: KawaBonzai on 9 Apr 2008 14:51
quote:
... and on a lighter note, please never take my posts/pics serious
How can I ever take anyone serious who sold a ZX-14 for a Yamaha-ha-ha-ha ... (j/k)
... Bonzai
____________
PC-III w/USB, Muzzys M14 + Carbon Oval + M10, BMC Race Filter, Flies Out, Buell Pegs, Heli Risers
www.TucsonSportRiders.com - Tucson's Premier SportRider Community
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stevewfl
Moderator
Posts: 27920
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posted April 09, 2008 02:00 PM
Edited By: stevewfl on 9 Apr 2008 15:01
quote:
quote:
... and on a lighter note, please never take my posts/pics serious
How can I ever take anyone serious who sold a ZX-14 for a Yamaha-ha-ha-ha ... (j/k)
... Bonzai
edited off my post: off-topic-
____________
2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
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jeff martin
Pro (closed)
jamming
Posts: 1168
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posted April 09, 2008 03:59 PM
Edited By: jeff martin on 9 Apr 2008 17:01
So does anyone have a Map for my set-up..
Yosh slip-ons "Pre-fer the two pipe look"
PC-3 USB
Still have flie's but want to remove them
Using a PC download of muzzy slip-ons aftermarket filter..But would like to take out the flie's..OHH.. also have a BMC race filter..
And it work's well now, will it change if i remove the flie's..Thanks !!
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i play with boats my wife plays with my dingy.
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qwick
Expert Class
Posts: 413
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posted April 09, 2008 06:52 PM
Use the Muzzy slip-on, flies out map that's on the Dyno-jet site. It even worked well with my Qwick Pipes that I was running. Only had a chance to make two runs at the track, with one of them being a 6.18 @119mph (no strap). Another pass or two, along with it being strapped and Zero Zero would have been in the 6.0's for sure. Point is, the map worked very well!!! And don't forget to pick up one of those Klein 11" hardened tip screwdrivers before you start the flies out project. Made life soooo much easier. Lowes has them, about $8. They're kept in the Klein tool section, away from all of the other standard brands.
You'll love the flies out mod... just remember to recalibrate your right wrist! Brings new meaning to the phrase "Power on Demand".
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jeff martin
Pro (closed)
jamming
Posts: 1168
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posted April 09, 2008 07:03 PM
Thanks Qwick, I have a nice set of jap standard drivers i will use one of those..Stupid question i have seen a few comments on using a soldering iron to warm the screws before removal ?
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i play with boats my wife plays with my dingy.
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