zrxdean
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posted July 20, 2007 10:46 AM
Interesting vel. stack comparison-charts
I guess those KHI guys know what they are doing, eh? The '06 ZX10 has 2 short stacks on #1 and 4, and longer, 90 deg bend stacks in the middle 2. Conventional wisdom states that shorter stacks will result in greater top end flow. Not so with this bike, this airbox, etc.
Thanks to Kevin & Ryan at SM2W. FYI; 5 deg timing advance had NO effect. U4 oxy fuel good for 4-5hp, leaned out A/F a full point.
Dean
  
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zrxdean
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posted July 20, 2007 10:49 AM
I forgot to mention that there was no appreciable difference in A/F beyond 11K with short or long middle stacks. So the diff is not an artifact of mixture.
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salsa1
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posted July 20, 2007 12:51 PM
Is the 06 airbox the same as the 04?
adding two shorter stacks was supposed to help the 04? not true.. anyone know...
never ending subject seems like...
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psycho1122
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posted July 23, 2007 06:32 AM
What do you think the OE power curve would look like on the road in top gear after the 8,500 rpm peak!?! I bet the speed at that rpm (@ 130 mph on a stocker) is where Ram pressure starts to build an fills in the dip between 8,500-10K and beyond.
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zrxdean
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posted July 23, 2007 05:42 PM
Hard to guess what would happen, but in any case it looks like the longer middle stacks flow more at high rpm.
The Factory (aftermarket) stacks also use longer middles. But the Busa guys use all short. Has anyone seen a before/after chart for a Busa?
Far as I know the 04-07 airboxes are the same salsa.
Dean
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salsa1
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posted July 24, 2007 05:12 AM
 Edited By: salsa1 on 24 Jul 2007 07:37
"hear say on the net is out of control..." but it takes documented results (before and after) to be sure...
not a crisis... but I went ahead and installed two short ones months ago and am in doubt now...my dyno guy said it is an easy hp gain to be had with the ZX-10R....
I will be dragracing so it matters some...have wideband installed.. just am not very patient to wait a bunch of runs down the 1/4 to see for myself what works best..
hate wasting time...seeing other 04-04 ZX-10R dragracers have been getting 150 mph all motor (using u4) with stock airbox directs me to reinstall two long stacks back... no big deal I guess...
Thanks Dean.
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entropy
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posted July 24, 2007 01:50 PM
Edited By: entropy on 24 Jul 2007 14:56
Dean,
here is some info from tests I did at JC's 3 years ago, which seem to agree with yr results, i.e. shorts on 1,4, and longs on 2,3 give better dyno hp.
rpm___long stks__short stks__2,3-short__1,4-short
4000_____68_______68_______68_______68
5000_____92_______92_______92_______94
6000_____118______119______118______120
7000_____151______152______159______153
8000_____189______191______189______191
9000_____207______207______205______206
10000____214______216______216______217
10500____217______218______217______219
11000____215______215______214______217
11600____215______216______216______218
However, I SEEMED to get better 1/4 mph with all shorts so that's what i have now.
My guess is that trimming AF separately for 1/4, 2/3 (like JC is doing these days) may change the equation, but that's phase 2 of the "grand experiment", and will need to wait till sept-ish.
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zrxdean
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posted July 24, 2007 09:19 PM
Great info, thanks. I will try to get some real-world data at Maxton in September, not sure how the ramair might change the equation here. Wish I had an airstrip behind my house. -Dean
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entropy
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posted July 25, 2007 06:15 AM
Dean
I posted the Q in the 12 section, but i'll ask you here also.
Have you ever taken AF readings off all 4 cyl individually? maybe with kevin at SM2W?
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zrxdean
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posted July 25, 2007 09:27 AM
No, we'd like to, but we don't have the means to get the readings yet. Some folks use 4 EGT sensors, I wonder what they typically find.
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entropy
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posted July 25, 2007 11:07 AM
the means to get the data??
Like JC did maybe pull the can and simply stick the AF probe into each header???
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zrxdean
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posted July 25, 2007 02:04 PM
I meant a welded bung in each primary, but you're right, that's possible. I'll talk to Kevin about it, it's worth a try.
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GUNNER
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posted July 25, 2007 03:01 PM
Dean... Didn't you hurt your motor a while back? What do you have done to your motor on those pulls? Surely that thing isn't all stock.. Nice power for the 10
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There's no such thing as a motor with no more power to give only people with no more intelligence to get it
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zrxdean
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posted July 25, 2007 06:18 PM
This is stock bore Wiseco pistons, .5mm head gasket, race intake cam, mild port head, no flies, Area P half-system. It made 176 with the OEM tire, these pulls are with a Supercorsa, in 95 degree heat, pump gas. -Dean
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GUNNER
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posted July 25, 2007 07:19 PM
Edited By: GUNNER on 25 Jul 2007 20:20
Damn nice numbers!! what do you have the cams set at if you don't mind me asking? If you do mind I understand..
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There's no such thing as a motor with no more power to give only people with no more intelligence to get it
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zrxdean
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posted July 25, 2007 09:20 PM
Thanks, I'm very happy with it. Ryan Kallina has my spare head and will be working his magic on it.
We tried 108 and 104 on the intake, about the same peak but much better curve with 104/104. At 101 intake the valves and pistons were getting a little too friendly. Where are yours?
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GUNNER
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posted July 26, 2007 06:06 AM
Dean if my memory serves me right. Mine are 105/ 103.5. Those numbers gave .040 PTV on the intake and .060 on the EX.. I have all that written down in a book somewhere but the book seems to be hiding from me right now.
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There's no such thing as a motor with no more power to give only people with no more intelligence to get it
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GUNNER
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posted July 26, 2007 06:18 AM
My bike made 174 with stock pistons a Coby Adams cleaned up head with NO valve work. Kinda pissed me off that he didn't touch the valves but the bike only had 400 miles on the head and he said it looked good. BUT as we all know the bike could have been helped from a better valve job.. It's not like Kawasaki puts on a great valve job at the factory.. Anyway it has the Kit intake cam and thin head gasket. I also had my cams at 107/104 and the bike was real leggy.. It was a bitch up top but fairly gutted down low according to my Ass Hole dyno. So I changed them. My torque was never as good as yours for some reason. BUT in all fairness to the bike it had low miles at the time and it was 101 degree that day with water dropplet floating in the air.. OH yea I also pulled it with the flies out and in with a TRE devise it made the same power both ways except with them in it got rid of a stumble down low at 4K. This is with pump fuel and a AK full system.. I suppose with U4 it will do better. This winter it's getting some bigger slugs.. I want to see mid 190s from the little motor.. This bike is my all time favorite.. OH yea mine is an 05
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