12RPilot
Pro
Posts: 1094
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posted December 31, 2004 01:44 AM
Wouldn't you think that some computer nerds could really rake in the cash if they hacked sportbike ECUs? I'd love to know what is burned into the chips and what is adjustable. Do our dealers have this capability?
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sp500
Expert Class
Posts: 195
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posted December 31, 2004 03:18 AM
dont think they'd tell, would be nice to know.
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kz2zx
Pro
Nobody in Particular
Posts: 1166
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posted December 31, 2004 07:52 AM
 Edited By: kz2zx on 31 Dec 2004 07:57
quote:
Wouldn't you think that some computer nerds could really rake in the cash if they hacked sportbike ECUs? I'd love to know what is burned into the chips and what is adjustable. Do our dealers have this capability?
If I had three weeks and a decent logic analyzer, plus the ICE/BDM/JTAG for the ECU, I would definitely be able to tell you what the memory map looks like (architecture), what major functionality was where in HW and SW, and probably be able to reverse-compile well enough to round-trip it back into binary and on another ECU.
To bring it into a UML model and be able to REALLY make changes would take another month or so.
To just be able to change the fuel map might only take a week of experimentation after the initial scan.
But a) this is not ethical; b) just who will pay me for the time and the equipment (or whose equipment will I use), and c) if you could pay me and rent the equipment, you'd be better off entering into an NDA with the ECU supplier and simply getting the architecture and design materials.
The TEKA unit, as I understand it, does just what you want - reprogram spark and fuel maps in the FLASH. There are issues - the connector pin pattern, the communications protocol, the memory map, and does the ECU you want to reprogram hold the maps in FLASH, EEPROM, or simply ROM?
The Powercommander guys intercept the signals coming in and leaving the ECU and modify those. This is a harder proposition to get right the first time. It's a far simpler proposition if you have to correct maps for thousands of variations.
Oh, and just for the record - Automotive consortia (ICANN, etc) charge HUGE dollars for the entry fee into programming automotive processors. An HC-12 (MC68X60HC-12) RTOS/ICE (RTOS = Real Time Operating System/ICE = In Circuit Emulator - a compiler and debugger) I got quoted at over $80k a year ago. Peanuts for a serious business, impossible for the small guy with dreams.
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frEEk
Administrator
ummm... yeah
Posts: 9660
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posted December 31, 2004 10:45 AM
would you really need to enter icann to build ECUs for aftermarket tho? i mean, how could they really stop you? i'd suspect that fee was required to get a manufacturer to consider using you as their supplier. of course this is all guessing.
as to building your own ECU, i'd suggest it would be much easier to build one from scratch instead of reverse engineer the existing one. reverse engineering a black box is BLOODY difficult, but programming those units aint too hard at all. built an alarm system from an HC11 board years back, couldn't be much simpler (relatively speaking of course).
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woodywood
Parking Attendant
Posts: 2
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posted December 31, 2004 04:19 PM
Edited By: woodywood on 31 Dec 2004 16:20
quote:
Wouldn't you think that some computer nerds could really rake in the cash if they hacked sportbike ECUs? I'd love to know what is burned into the chips and what is adjustable. Do our dealers have this capability?
http://www.tuneboy.com.au
this is a program i used for my triumph ,the author of the program did crack the triumph ecm and this will let you tune better than a pc for a triumph...............if only she would buy a zx10r then crack this ecm
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kz2zx
Pro
Nobody in Particular
Posts: 1166
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posted December 31, 2004 07:56 PM
quote:
would you really need to enter icann to build ECUs for aftermarket tho?
No, probably not ICANN specifically. There was an HC12 consortium I've got the name of at work... basically, I wanted an HC12 demo board for a power-amplifier controller simulation once (the controller for the HPA was an HC12), and was told I'd have to pay $80k for a membership, before the $32k for a single-seat license for the RTOS/ICE, and I can't remember the damn name right now - but I was kind of POed as I work for one of the founding member companies.
I seriously doubt the ECU is an HC12 though, I was using it as an example.
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