Phantom13
Zone Head
Posts: 736
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posted January 17, 2011 04:16 AM
 Edited By: Phantom13 on 17 Jan 2011 12:18
Omg I seriously needed a haircut in that pic. I probably would a dropped 5lbs with just a fade. 
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"The only place Success comes
before Work is inside the Dictionary."
   
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Bigbore4
Zone Head
Posts: 806
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posted January 17, 2011 04:38 AM
Looks to me that Shane has a pretty good tuck. Aren't the aeros on the 14 significantly better than the A model.
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shiphteey
Needs a job
Posts: 2529
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posted January 17, 2011 07:35 AM
I haven't seen anything comparing the aeros of the 12 vs 14 head to head.
I know they put the Busa vs12 in the wind tunnel, obviously busa won.
I know they put the Busa vs 14 in the wind tunnel....same outcome.
But don't know which one has the better aero.
I do know which one has the superior ram air, so does Shane.
I know which one has the better cylinder head, so does Shane.
A.
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Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted January 17, 2011 07:50 AM
quote:
I haven't seen anything comparing the aeros of the 12 vs 14 head to head.
I know they put the Busa vs12 in the wind tunnel, obviously busa won.
I know they put the Busa vs 14 in the wind tunnel....same outcome.
But don't know which one has the better aero.
I do know which one has the superior ram air, so does Shane.
I know which one has the better cylinder head, so does Shane.
A.
Not to turn this into a 12 vs.14 debate, but the fact of the matter is that when you can build the motor 176cc bigger, on stock blocks, the cylinder head issue is kind of moot. Big 14's are capable of more power than big 12R's. Also, Jim's 14 heads are flowing pretty darn well. And we also saw great power from that street 2x2 that Sal did the porting on.
Regarding the ram air, all of these factory systems are compromises. It can definitely be improved...but I'll take that trade for 1570cc's on a stock block, as opposed to the 1394cc limit of the 12R.
Am I now supposed bring up the relatively spindly clutch, transmission, and crank of the 12R? 
I know you love the 12R, but you are in some serious denial man!
Shane
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shiphteey
Needs a job
Posts: 2529
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posted January 17, 2011 08:08 AM
Its all on your shoulders BIG MAN! You've gotta prove to the rest of the world how much better the 14 is in LSR...because quite frankly, its been 5 years since the 14 hit the streets and sorry, but in LSR it hasn't really shown to be better than the 12R.
Case in point, you went 193 in better conditions than I went 192 in, both on stock motors, right? Suffice to say in the same conditions I'll pick up a few mph over you....and some of that will be due to me being smaller than you which helps in the standing mile. Yes, it can go bigger and bigger,but just like Sal and them said, BIGGER isn't BETTER....
BETTER IS BETTER!
A.
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Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted January 17, 2011 08:09 AM
Edited By: Shane661 on 17 Jan 2011 16:15
quote:
I know they put the Busa vs12 in the wind tunnel, obviously busa won.
I know they put the Busa vs 14 in the wind tunnel....same outcome.
But don't know which one has the better aero.
This data is from Sport Rider tests:
Busa vs 14:
Busa rider full tuck .467 Cd
zx14 full tuck .469 Cd
Less than .5% difference
Busa vs 12R:
"A lower figure means less drag, and the Hayabusa recorded a CDA of 3.37 ft2 (0.313 m2), about 8 percent less than the ZX-12R's figure of 3.67 ft2 (0.341 m2)."
The Busa, according to these tests, is 1/2 of one percent more slippery than the 14...and eight percent more slippery than the 12R.
Nothing is cut and dry, but based on these results, the 14 is significantly more aero than the 12R...and almost identical to the Busa. Now, once you start tweaking them, all bets are off.
Shane
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted January 17, 2011 08:17 AM
Edited By: Shane661 on 17 Jan 2011 16:18
quote:
Case in point, you went 193 in better conditions than I went 192 in, both on stock motors, right? Suffice to say in the same conditions I'll pick up a few mph over you....and some of that will be due to me being smaller than you which helps in the standing mile. .
What are you talking about? What you just said is, "I am only 1 mph slower than you, and I am 90 lbs lighter".
We both made those runs in June heat. Again, not sure where you are going with this...
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shiphteey
Needs a job
Posts: 2529
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posted January 17, 2011 08:19 AM
Thats even more confusing...with the Busa and 14 having near identical aeros, and the 14 still having the displacement advantage how come its still having trouble in the LSR world against comparable Busas Shane? Whats your take on all of it since you have 2 12s and 2 14s in your garage?
A.
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Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted January 17, 2011 08:21 AM
Edited By: Shane661 on 17 Jan 2011 16:23
quote:
Thats even more confusing...with the Busa and 14 having near identical aeros, and the 14 still having the displacement advantage how come its still having trouble in the LSR world against comparable Busas Shane? Whats your take on all of it since you have 2 12s and 2 14s in your garage?
A.
The Busa is a better LSR platform than a 12R or 14. But no question that the 14 has more potential than the 12R. 
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shiphteey
Needs a job
Posts: 2529
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posted January 17, 2011 08:26 AM
quote:
quote:
Thats even more confusing...with the Busa and 14 having near identical aeros, and the 14 still having the displacement advantage how come its still having trouble in the LSR world against comparable Busas Shane? Whats your take on all of it since you have 2 12s and 2 14s in your garage?
A.
The Busa is a better LSR platform than a 12R or 14. But no question that the 14 has more potential than the 12R.
That remains to be seen bro. April 2011....the day Shane's entire LSR gets eclipsed by a stock motor 12R in the mile!
____________
Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
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gilberjj
Needs a job
Friend of Fast
Posts: 3196
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posted January 19, 2011 10:55 PM
Edited By: gilberjj on 20 Jan 2011 06:55
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2000redrocket
Pro
Posts: 1662
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posted February 08, 2011 03:32 PM
holy shit i just caught this thread. been a while since i was on with the snow thing.
hi shane, hi ali,
ali u gain some weight?
either way you two will have fun.
ali better make your first run a good cause @ 150wet it may only be one. dam hold on when you push the button.
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted February 08, 2011 03:42 PM
Edited By: Shane661 on 8 Feb 2011 23:57
Ali surpassed my personal threshold of disrespect. I can only tolerate so much spread over multiple forums.
We are done, and so is this topic.
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Stuart Racing
Zone Head
N.H.R.A . Dragracing.
Posts: 999
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posted February 08, 2011 07:08 PM
quote:
holy shit i just caught this thread. been a while since i was on with the snow thing.
hi shane, hi ali,
ali u gain some weight?
either way you two will have fun.
ali better make your first run a good cause @ 150wet it may only be one. dam hold on when you push the button.
You might have a point there depending on WHEN he push`s the button.....
____________
Life in the Fast Lane..........
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shiphteey
Needs a job
Posts: 2529
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posted February 08, 2011 08:20 PM
quote:
holy shit i just caught this thread. been a while since i was on with the snow thing.
hi shane, hi ali,
ali u gain some weight?
either way you two will have fun.
ali better make your first run a good cause @ 150wet it may only be one. dam hold on when you push the button.
2kredrocket, you should still have my number if you have any questions you can get at me that way. I've got my energy focused on snatching up more records in 2011...multiple classes.
A.
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Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
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2000redrocket
Pro
Posts: 1662
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posted February 09, 2011 02:31 PM
150 wet on stock engine? i wish your parts the best of luck. take a lot of timing out or put a thicher head gasket or base gasket.
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TRNorBRN6001
Needs a job
Posts: 2021
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posted February 09, 2011 03:05 PM
150 shot, Holy Smokes!!!! I missed that back up in there as well. Man-O-Man, go get ya some records!
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TFA 200MPH CLUB MEMBER!
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VincentHill
Needs a life
Posts: 6520
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posted February 09, 2011 03:13 PM
150 Shot is nearing the limits on even my engine and it is set up like a Turbo or Supercharger engine with thick dome pistons and lowered rings and 10 to 1 Compression!
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Made History @ Daytona and still one fast old man!!
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2000redrocket
Pro
Posts: 1662
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posted February 09, 2011 03:57 PM
we got people with disposable engines (327cid chevy) running 400 fogger stepped. it lasted 5 weekends.
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