wannabe
Pro
Posts: 1931
|
posted December 05, 2002 03:55 PM
Wheelie Bars from Schnitz...
Anyone here have experience with the bolt-on wheelie bars for the ZX12 that Schnitz has for sale? Are they the same as the Pingel bolt ons? Is $329 a good price for this?
Thanks!!
____________
-----------
"There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; the rest are just games." - Ernest Hemingway
  
|
MadMike
Moderator
FEAR THE BLACK FLAG!!!!!!!!
Posts: 6579
|
posted December 05, 2002 04:22 PM
Schnitz, is a great place and I believe they have very fair prices on wheelie bars.
____________
200-MPH CLUB MEMBER!
|
zrxdean
Needs a job
Posts: 2225
|
posted December 05, 2002 05:28 PM
I'm sure you realize this, but wheelie bars function best with a fixed suspension, slick-tired, 2-stepped bike. You might want to talk to someone at Schnitz or Pingel about how a street bike will perform without any other modifications.
|
wannabe
Pro
Posts: 1931
|
posted December 05, 2002 06:28 PM
Actually, I don't know much about it. I just keep getting told that wheelie bars will make me more consistent running in the bracket races. If you can be more specific about the pros & cons of running my ZX12 with wheelie bars I would definitely appreciate it.
____________
-----------
"There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; the rest are just games." - Ernest Hemingway
|
RedBull
Expert Class
Posts: 406
|
posted December 05, 2002 07:28 PM
A slick & a bar will make you more consistant,
It will also extend the life of your clutch !
You can just through it away instead of slipping it...
Red, *<(:{)-
____________
1998 Prostar West Super Gas top ten.
1999 Prostar West Super Gas Champion !
2000 NMRA / Prostar Pro E/T runner up.
2001, 2002, & 2003 NMRA Pro E/T Champion !
2004 #3, 2005, & 2006 NMRA Pro E/T runner up.
2007 Pro St. Legal #6, NMRA Pro E/T Champion !
2008 Motorcycle Drag Race Assoc. SS Champion !
www.dragbike.com - www.MDRA4U.com
www.PMRcomponents.com www.NAARDEN.biz
Photos by www.HooliganUnderground.com
|
MadMike
Moderator
FEAR THE BLACK FLAG!!!!!!!!
Posts: 6579
|
posted December 05, 2002 07:31 PM
I dont know, I won 7 events and hundreds of rounds without wheelie bars. I just think on a street bike without a slick it just takes one thing out of the way, and adds a couple of more, that you have to mess with. to get to the point what problems are you having bracket racing. oh I only bracket raced.
Mad Mike
____________
200-MPH CLUB MEMBER!
|
wannabe
Pro
Posts: 1931
|
posted December 05, 2002 09:30 PM
As far as my problems go, I'm having real consistency problems right now. I'm just starting out, and I'm having a problem keeping my 60ft times real consistent. Plus, I'm a total puss about letting the front wheel come up. If it comes up a little, I just back off instead of riding it out.
My buddy keeps telling me that the wheelie bars will give me one less thing to worry about, so I can focus to bringing my piss poor reaction times down to a respectable level. (Right now, I'm still in the high .6's and low .7's on a .400 pro tree.)
You mentioned that the wheelie bars add a couple of things to mess with. Can you be more specific. I know I won't have to worry about slipping the clutch anymore, but what other variables will I be throwing into the mix with the wheelie bars?
Please excuse me if these are totally newbie questions. Like I said, I'm totally new to the game. The first race of the season is on New Years day, and I'm hoping to have things mostly figured out by then.
|
zrxdean
Needs a job
Posts: 2225
|
posted December 05, 2002 11:11 PM
I have never owned a bar-bike, but as I understand it, if you put a bar on it as it is, you'll spin the tire, if you then get a slick, the bike will 'porpoise' or bounce off the bar as your rear suspension absorbs and rebounds down the track, then once you get a strut to prevent this (basically a steel bar instead of a shock), your launch RPM will be too inconsistent controlling it by eye or ear - therefore you'll need a 2-step, a box which limits your rpm when the clutch is in to a chosen level, allowing you to hold it WOT and let the clutch fly when you want to leave. Of course your clutch won't take this for long (Kevin would emphasize here that if you dragrace a lot you'll definitely need a billet basket from Falicon or Muzzy to prevent the likely catastrophe of grenading your clutch, destroying your bottom end, etc) and you'll need a centrifugal lockup clutch to enable some give at the laucnch, but not slip downtrack. All tolled, $350 bar, $125 slick, $25 strut, $100 2-step, and $600 lockup. Of course it will take a while to get all these things dialed in - Jan 1 is a bit soon. I could be wrong - maybe someone can set up your bike with a bar and it will work for you as is - but I kinda think not. My humble advice would be to keep practicing as it is. I'm assuming you have a front strap and lowering links already. It takes a lot of passes to be consistent - don't expect to be able to cut down the tree and run dead on your number after a few months practice. I've been bracket racing for 2 years (mostly I just want to go FASTER), and my 60 foots vary quite a bit. The faster you go, the harder it is to be consistent. Actually, if you really wanna be a good bracket racer, buy a slower bike 
But most of all, enjoy it. Where can you legally go balls out, under controlled conditions, and get precise feedback on your performance every ten seconds? (or less... always less) 
|
wannabe
Pro
Posts: 1931
|
posted December 06, 2002 12:25 AM
Interesting thoughts, Dean. I never looked it like that. I don't want to run a slick. At most, I was gonna throw on a Mickey's shootout tire on a spare rim. I have the billet basket & the Muzzy clutch kit sitting on my kitchen table. I'm hoping to get them in this weekend. Yes, I do have the front strap and lowering links (middle hole). I weigh about 230 with my gear on. I've got the full race acra on, but I've been too lazy to install the PCIIIr.
So far, my best pass has been 10.72@138.6. Yes, I still suck. I can't seem to get over the fear of the front end coming up even a few inches. So, my 60's are still in the 1.9 range. The only thing I can figure is that (at the very least) the wheelie bars will give me the confidence to launch hard enough to bring the 60 ft times down to a respectable level. (maybe around 1.6's) With luck the bars might even get me into the 9's.
Please keep the opinions coming. Y'all have been doing this a lot longer than me. I appreciate any advice you can give.
|
krexken
Zone Head
Posts: 732
|
posted December 06, 2002 01:33 AM
Nothing beats lots of practice but about six extra inches of swingarm will help keep the front end on the ground a little easier. You can still wheelie it outta the hole but once you get 60' out or so, you should be able to get wide open without fear of wheelieing. You'll need a stickier tire with the extra arm though. Mine has made me more consistent anyway. Without the extra arm, keeping the front tire on the ground in first gear was extremely challenging.
|
MadMike
Moderator
FEAR THE BLACK FLAG!!!!!!!!
Posts: 6579
|
posted December 06, 2002 05:54 AM
Man Dean and Ken said it all, dude practice is going to make you good, the more passes you have the more you learn, the only other thing I can add is to video tape your runs! and watch them over and over in slo-motion, that way you can see how your body is moving and watch what your hands are doing, you can see everything, what are the diffrences between the runs and improve yourself, that has helped me become a better racer, and Im telling you your getting GOOD advice from the guys above, they are #1 oh and your the same size as me! so keep it up and you will get there. If I had a dragstrip in my back yard I would practice every day I could... where are you located? we have some good racers all over the country maybe one could go to your track and work with you to?
____________
200-MPH CLUB MEMBER!
|
ninja12
Needs a job
Posts: 3310
|
posted December 06, 2002 07:59 AM
IF you can get a extended arm you would be amazed at the difference.
You can probably find a stock arm for $100-150 on ebay,
then send it to muzzy or frank adams for 3",4",6" or a 3-6" extention
i think aroud $400-450. Put a good tire on it and you nice stretbike that works well at the track. I have a 3 inch arm and i ride everywhere.
I ride the curves and commute, but on T&T night i'm ready.
NO I DON"T PASS R1's in the curves but they don't pass me at the track.
|
wannabe
Pro
Posts: 1931
|
posted December 06, 2002 09:36 AM
I'm in Santa Clara, CA. But, I'm planning on racing in the Summit series at Sacramento Raceway and Sears Pointe (Infineon Raceway.) Between the two tracks I've got a race just about every weekend starting on January 1st. (NHRA Div 7)
I really don't want to extend my swingarm, but you guys are making me think twice. I was figuring that the wheelie bars (and the strut) would be easier to swap in and out than the extended swingarm. Plus, I like the idea of just being able to dump the clutch at the line.
Here I go waffling again...
____________
-----------
"There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; the rest are just games." - Ernest Hemingway
|
kcadby
Pro
Posts: 1733
|
posted December 06, 2002 11:20 AM
To add to what I posted on your other thread...
Wheelie bars are...a COMPLETE WASTE OF TIME/money with a Street Tire
Yes...even at a GOOD race track...
|
wannabe
Pro
Posts: 1931
|
posted December 06, 2002 02:45 PM
OK, you guys just about have me talked out of going with the wheelie bars. I didn't realize that wheelie bars took that much effort to dial in.
____________
-----------
"There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; the rest are just games." - Ernest Hemingway
|
kzz1
Zone Head
"Show me whatcha workin with"
Posts: 908
|
posted December 07, 2002 06:15 AM
Go with an extended adjustable 0" to 6" swingarm. Frank Adams did ours. And a Shinko or Mickey Thompson shootout tire. Slam the front and rear. Light burnout, stage, launch between 4500 to 6000 and hold on 
|
RedBull
Expert Class
Posts: 406
|
posted December 07, 2002 07:42 AM
If your going to race Infinion, talk to ZX11 Phil about a bar...
These guys said so themselves ! they've never had a BAR !
Don't waste your money stretching the arm & turning you ZX12 into a mini truck...
I saw a guy from Canada with a Bar & a Slick on a 12 go 9.7 in the 1/4...
When I put a bar on my 11 I only had to make one adjustment...
I can still ride it to work with out the bar, nothing else changed,
Popo can't see the slick when it's moving, & it's cheaper than a shootout tire.
I've won 3 Championships with this combination...
One of them was a Super Gas Title !
Red, *<(:{)-
____________
1998 Prostar West Super Gas top ten.
1999 Prostar West Super Gas Champion !
2000 NMRA / Prostar Pro E/T runner up.
2001, 2002, & 2003 NMRA Pro E/T Champion !
2004 #3, 2005, & 2006 NMRA Pro E/T runner up.
2007 Pro St. Legal #6, NMRA Pro E/T Champion !
2008 Motorcycle Drag Race Assoc. SS Champion !
www.dragbike.com - www.MDRA4U.com
www.PMRcomponents.com www.NAARDEN.biz
Photos by www.HooliganUnderground.com
|
MadMike
Moderator
FEAR THE BLACK FLAG!!!!!!!!
Posts: 6579
|
posted December 07, 2002 08:27 AM
How does that Slick corner when you out riding on the street? and I have been low 9.5's on a stock motor with a 6 over arm and I weigh 225 without my gear on, and I dont have to change a thing when I go street riding except take my strap loose. but this is definatly good input from both sides of the fence, wish swft would post over here, so there would be another bar bike input.
Mad Mike
____________
200-MPH CLUB MEMBER!
|
wannabe
Pro
Posts: 1931
|
posted December 07, 2002 12:08 PM
This is the comment that SWFT made on the other board. It just about talked me out of it. I think I'm gonna go with the bolt-on extensions.
quote:
zxlnt speaks the truth! Even airing a street tire down to some rediculously low pressure doesn't work! I got it to hook *one* time off the line, and it broke loose while still on the concrete pad. Spun that fucker up so fast it scrubbed all the rubber off in a long streak sideways. Took it right down to the concrete.  If I laid off enough to get it to hook up off the line, it would invariably break loose around half track in the top of second or when shifting to third. The bar and the slick go hand in hand, imho. One's no good without the other.
|
kzz1
Zone Head
"Show me whatcha workin with"
Posts: 908
|
posted December 07, 2002 07:35 PM
Redbull. what combo are you running and what are your times?
|
RedBull
Expert Class
Posts: 406
|
posted December 08, 2002 08:42 AM
ZX11 9.4 @ 145... I've won 1999 Super Gas Championship...
placed 3rd in the points this year with www.NMRAonline.com
The bike weighs 495 pounds full of fuel,PM wheels,
Mickey 7" slick & a bar, D&D pipe, Factory jet kit.
When are the old IDBA racers going to come out & race with us ?
If you need a place to stay in California, you are more than welcome...
Red, *<(:{)-
____________
1998 Prostar West Super Gas top ten.
1999 Prostar West Super Gas Champion !
2000 NMRA / Prostar Pro E/T runner up.
2001, 2002, & 2003 NMRA Pro E/T Champion !
2004 #3, 2005, & 2006 NMRA Pro E/T runner up.
2007 Pro St. Legal #6, NMRA Pro E/T Champion !
2008 Motorcycle Drag Race Assoc. SS Champion !
www.dragbike.com - www.MDRA4U.com
www.PMRcomponents.com www.NAARDEN.biz
Photos by www.HooliganUnderground.com
|
MadMike
Moderator
FEAR THE BLACK FLAG!!!!!!!!
Posts: 6579
|
posted December 08, 2002 09:36 AM
Thanks Red, Hey I might be making 1 trip out that way to race this season, trying to work with the scedule right now, to see where I'm going.
____________
200-MPH CLUB MEMBER!
|
RedBull
Expert Class
Posts: 406
|
posted December 08, 2002 01:01 PM
If you can race with us, the Las Vegas Events are the BEST !
We get a good rate on rooms from our host hotel...
Last year it was Arizona Charlies...
Red, *<(:{)-
____________
1998 Prostar West Super Gas top ten.
1999 Prostar West Super Gas Champion !
2000 NMRA / Prostar Pro E/T runner up.
2001, 2002, & 2003 NMRA Pro E/T Champion !
2004 #3, 2005, & 2006 NMRA Pro E/T runner up.
2007 Pro St. Legal #6, NMRA Pro E/T Champion !
2008 Motorcycle Drag Race Assoc. SS Champion !
www.dragbike.com - www.MDRA4U.com
www.PMRcomponents.com www.NAARDEN.biz
Photos by www.HooliganUnderground.com
|
kzz1
Zone Head
"Show me whatcha workin with"
Posts: 908
|
posted December 09, 2002 06:05 AM
Hmmm!!!???
|
wannabe
Pro
Posts: 1931
|
posted December 10, 2002 11:18 AM
Just to let y'all know, after waffling back and forth between the extended swingarm & the wheelie bars, I just wanted to let all of you know that I decided to go with the wheelie bars. I ordered them yesterday. They're out of stock, but Schnitz is having them drop shipped from Pingel directly to me.
Thank you all for your opinions!!!
____________
-----------
"There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; the rest are just games." - Ernest Hemingway
|
|
|
|
|
HOME
NEW TOPIC