KZScott
Needs a life
high on speed
Posts: 7235
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posted August 03, 2009 08:52 AM
shock setup? 68 in wheelie machine
so i posted this in the raining thread:
didnt have many passes today, and they cancelled the heads up bike class. played with the clutch and got it very close. the 2 step makes the bike a whole new animal! it kept flashing the tach, so i kept upping the static. in big jumps (too big) like 100 thou of shim at a time lol. well after a few of those, it felt good, but was picking the front end up so i had automatically been backing out of the throttle briefly when it did. a friend got a video, and it was only lifting about 6 inches before i backed out of it. i thought it had been going much higher, so next pass i held it WFO....big mistake. i think i tried to shift to second, but im not really sure. I had a 68 in WB bike with about 14 pounds of ballast hanging on the forks pointed damn near vertical. came down really hard, the CF seat and the gas tank have NO give. I run my visor open about an inch, and the windscreen managed to slide right in and smack me on the upper lip and nose. blood all over the tank ect ect. i tried to feather it, but was a couple tenths too late, and did a smaller (2 feet??) wheelie after it hit, after that i shut it off and pulled over. safety was right there, to see if i was ok, i was a little wobbly on my feet im told, but i was fine. took my helmet off and checked the bike. not a thing wrong. my oil pan has about an in of extra ground clearance as the drain plug is moved to the front, and i only strap the front to lower it, no lowering thru the clamps. they got dad to run it the rest of the way down the track and back to our pit, they made my get in the truck and got the bleeding stopped. took a 30 min break to get most of the pain to go away(pretty sore right now tho) and pulled 50 thou of shim, jumped back on and made a pass. felt a lot better, but i backed out when it started to lift again. cooled down for 15, pulled another 25 and made a pass. it started to pick up just a bit and i backed off, it would probly have been fine(maybe carried the front wheel a foot), but i was a little nervous of another monster wheelie, i ran a 9.36 at 149.5 and decided to call it a day. Im thinking the amount of static i have now is very very close to where i want it, im sure it would have been a very low 9 if i had of held it wide open. didnt even bother with nitrous. i dont see how i can spray in first gear even with a progressive controller....
Nox, going to PM you on psycho about the static.... I had a lot of shim in there....maybe enough for a spring change???
so im running a stock shock with the compression and rebound set at full hard... the stock spring is shimmed 3/4 of an inch, and is cranked down maybe 2/3 of the way? last yr with the spring cranked down all the way(no shim), and at 65.5 in wb, the tire was rubbing the tail on a hard launch. this yr at 68 it hasnt touched, except for the monster wheelie. what can i do to the shock to help my short times without sending it away, or buying a better one?
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
  
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NOX
Needs a job
PMRA / TMRC Super Street 4022
Posts: 3745
|
posted August 03, 2009 12:53 PM
Stock shock is the problem.........
I fought it forever. Will check my pms........
____________
42 Wins
21 Runner-ups
2010 TMRC Super Street Points Champion
2010 PMRA Super Street #3 Points
2009 PMRA Super Street Points Runner-Up
6 Time Centerville Dragway Points Champion
Sponsored by:
Scorpion Helmets
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AMSOIL
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Mickey Thompson Tires
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KZScott
Needs a life
high on speed
Posts: 7235
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posted August 03, 2009 02:21 PM
what will an aftermarket one do for me? what is the stocker lacking? as in what do i need? more compression, rebound, spring pressure...?
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
|
NOX
Needs a job
PMRA / TMRC Super Street 4022
Posts: 3745
|
posted August 04, 2009 05:52 AM
slower rebound, and a stiffer spring.......stiffer compression will come with it as well.......
A LOT slower rebound....., thats where most shocks suffer, and I really like mine, but it could even stand it a touch slower, and I am sending it back again this winter.....
____________
42 Wins
21 Runner-ups
2010 TMRC Super Street Points Champion
2010 PMRA Super Street #3 Points
2009 PMRA Super Street Points Runner-Up
6 Time Centerville Dragway Points Champion
Sponsored by:
Scorpion Helmets
Galfer Braking
AMSOIL
Steve's Speed Shop
Kawasaki Sports Center
Mickey Thompson Tires
Catalyst Racing Composites
Conway Cycle
Syed Leathers
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted August 04, 2009 06:03 AM
 Edited By: Shane661 on 4 Aug 2009 14:04
Scott, let me just say this:
There are more issues here than just a shock. The motorcycle and machinery are only doing what you tell them to do. I don't think this setup and clutch are helping you. I wish you the best with it, but consider going to a hand clutch and mastering throttle and clutch control. And if you are still using a two-step, ditch that too.
I am not an expert, nor have I ever claimed to be. I'm just trying to help.
Shane
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kawasakijockey
Pro
Posts: 1876
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posted August 04, 2009 07:34 AM
KZ, are you lifting the wheel at the hit or down track?
____________
Get on the shortbus boys 'cause its time to get schooled.
2007 ZX-14
1.38 60ft
9.03 @ 149mph
8.95 @153 small shot n2o
8.68 @160mph 5lbs boost
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NOX
Needs a job
PMRA / TMRC Super Street 4022
Posts: 3745
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posted August 04, 2009 03:06 PM
The problem with his wheel lift is not the clutch, or the two step..., it can easily be done with a single stage and no bars. I have done it........
he is bottoming the ass of the bike, then its a strut, then it lifts......., before 60 ft.......
His set up was fine and smooth last year, now he has changed it, and it takes a little time to fix that.......
It took me a touch to get the multi set up on mine smooth, after switching from the single stage set up.......
If the rules allow a two step..., I would use it......, VERY consistent.., if you know what you are doing...........
Scott, are you just barly holding the throttle on the two step, or at WFO?
It needs to be at WFO on every pass, and never let out........, and tune the things I told you from there..., in case I forgot to tell you that........
If you can, call me tonight before 8pm central.......
and guys, if you have not rode a bike with a good shock...., you have no idea how much smoother it makes the launch......, I feel like my front end is off the ground two feet, and its only an inch high.........
look at my avatar......., i could not get that to happen with the stock shock.......
____________
42 Wins
21 Runner-ups
2010 TMRC Super Street Points Champion
2010 PMRA Super Street #3 Points
2009 PMRA Super Street Points Runner-Up
6 Time Centerville Dragway Points Champion
Sponsored by:
Scorpion Helmets
Galfer Braking
AMSOIL
Steve's Speed Shop
Kawasaki Sports Center
Mickey Thompson Tires
Catalyst Racing Composites
Conway Cycle
Syed Leathers
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NOX
Needs a job
PMRA / TMRC Super Street 4022
Posts: 3745
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posted August 04, 2009 03:15 PM
These are crappy vids, but
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wXEHB41kFzA&feature=related
This was this year.., first set of bikes, buddies wife took these vids.., my camera is broke, forget the clutch set up, and the first pass, my bike was decent, but my idiot butt did not shift, and I let off, and it rode on the limiter.
- about 1.2 into the movie there I am again, made and adjustment to the clutch......(wrong), and second gear came FAST.....but watch my rear end, and how it takes everything......, -2, +4, at 7500........
This was a similar set up last year.........,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=leEF5Ay3uJE&feature=related
With the wrong shock......, had to keep the clutch soft, to keep the front wheel down, and it still comes up in second....
____________
42 Wins
21 Runner-ups
2010 TMRC Super Street Points Champion
2010 PMRA Super Street #3 Points
2009 PMRA Super Street Points Runner-Up
6 Time Centerville Dragway Points Champion
Sponsored by:
Scorpion Helmets
Galfer Braking
AMSOIL
Steve's Speed Shop
Kawasaki Sports Center
Mickey Thompson Tires
Catalyst Racing Composites
Conway Cycle
Syed Leathers
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted August 04, 2009 04:17 PM
It seems like a whole lot of work to avoid learning to ride the bike. In the time he has spent fooling with this setup, he could have went faster hand clutching it.
My point about ditching the clutch and the two step is that it is keeping him from learning how to ride the bike. Seat time is the key, and the more time he spends messing with the setup, the less quality seat time he is going to get.
I am going to leave it at that. I wish him luck with whatever setup he chooses. 
Shane
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NOX
Needs a job
PMRA / TMRC Super Street 4022
Posts: 3745
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posted August 04, 2009 04:25 PM
You are very correct......
But, look at pro street...., they don't "RIde The bike" they tune the bike to do exactly what they want it to do with as little rider input as possible........
That is what scott is doing, it takes time.......
Hell, it takes time, just to set one up with a good slick and bar set up like Roy runs.......
If he had to run a stock type clutch like they do at that track in Texas, or if he was not allowed a two step, different story......
What you say is true....., and there are a lot of guys up here that look at it the same way.......
running a set up like we do, is all about controlling the violence....
scotts use of a two step pissed it off.........., now he has to learn what calms it down......
____________
42 Wins
21 Runner-ups
2010 TMRC Super Street Points Champion
2010 PMRA Super Street #3 Points
2009 PMRA Super Street Points Runner-Up
6 Time Centerville Dragway Points Champion
Sponsored by:
Scorpion Helmets
Galfer Braking
AMSOIL
Steve's Speed Shop
Kawasaki Sports Center
Mickey Thompson Tires
Catalyst Racing Composites
Conway Cycle
Syed Leathers
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NOX
Needs a job
PMRA / TMRC Super Street 4022
Posts: 3745
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posted August 04, 2009 04:27 PM
One of the winners this year in Super Street at PMRA uses a Two step......, on a 64 or 66 inch zx14.
His bike works pretty well, from what little I have had time to watch it leave......, not sure how he has it set up........
Our index classes at home do not allow it, or I would run one, it would make me that much more consistent........
____________
42 Wins
21 Runner-ups
2010 TMRC Super Street Points Champion
2010 PMRA Super Street #3 Points
2009 PMRA Super Street Points Runner-Up
6 Time Centerville Dragway Points Champion
Sponsored by:
Scorpion Helmets
Galfer Braking
AMSOIL
Steve's Speed Shop
Kawasaki Sports Center
Mickey Thompson Tires
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NOX
Needs a job
PMRA / TMRC Super Street 4022
Posts: 3745
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posted August 04, 2009 04:35 PM
Oh, and yes, you can spray in first........
But you gotta get some consistent runs on motor first..........
We will go there later........
____________
42 Wins
21 Runner-ups
2010 TMRC Super Street Points Champion
2010 PMRA Super Street #3 Points
2009 PMRA Super Street Points Runner-Up
6 Time Centerville Dragway Points Champion
Sponsored by:
Scorpion Helmets
Galfer Braking
AMSOIL
Steve's Speed Shop
Kawasaki Sports Center
Mickey Thompson Tires
Catalyst Racing Composites
Conway Cycle
Syed Leathers
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KZScott
Needs a life
high on speed
Posts: 7235
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posted August 04, 2009 05:29 PM
thx for the call Heath, yeah, it got way more violent with the 2 step this yr... last season my data logs showed me not going WFO untill allmost second gear. it was smooth untill i started getting more agressive on the gas. started flashing the tach a tiny bit. Im launching with the 2 step WFO every time now. even with a lower launch rpm, it has way more power. Im going to try it at 5000 instead of 5500 (7000 last yr).
it kept flashing the tach so i kept adding static in big jumps, i went over the limit, and now ive backed it down to allmost where it was flashing the tach. its actually just one 25 thou shim more. obviously my game is a little off from damn near going over backwards, but i think this setup is very very close now. i really need to get to a test n tune saturday, but i have too much other stuff going on. i know i need more seat time. my lights suck, and i want to get vids so i can see what its doing and what Im doing.
I dont think this shock will let me spray in first tho... im thinking second gear activation with a big initial hit and very quick build time
should i back the spring off a bit untill it rubs the tail, then make it a little stiffer? just to be sure im getting as much squat as possible? (the paint is fucked now anyway so i dont care if it hits)
Ive made a change for nearly every wknd in the last 2 seasons Shane, it would be like learning to ride a new bike every time
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
|
kawasakijockey
Pro
Posts: 1876
|
posted August 04, 2009 06:21 PM
What kind of 60's are you getting out of yours?
____________
Get on the shortbus boys 'cause its time to get schooled.
2007 ZX-14
1.38 60ft
9.03 @ 149mph
8.95 @153 small shot n2o
8.68 @160mph 5lbs boost
|
KZScott
Needs a life
high on speed
Posts: 7235
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posted August 04, 2009 06:42 PM
this wknd was low 1.6s, which is not even close to what it should be. ive done 1.49, and "should" be able to get 1.45... i have the rest of the pass down, just not the important part, but its getting there. 9.3s with 1.6s should mean i can run 9.0-8.9s with a better launch
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
|
NOX
Needs a job
PMRA / TMRC Super Street 4022
Posts: 3745
|
posted August 04, 2009 09:25 PM
if it was me, with your set up, I would set the compression to full hard.....(it affects the rebound....., set the rebound to as slow as it will go......., and set the spring where it just quite does not bottom the shock......, might have to adjust the ride hieght......, ie, thats why my tail and the tail of a lot of bikes at static sit so high.......,
but look to the left, and you see what it does when i drop the clutch........
also, when you get a chance call me back...i have another way you can help keep it down...., with some added hp.......,
____________
42 Wins
21 Runner-ups
2010 TMRC Super Street Points Champion
2010 PMRA Super Street #3 Points
2009 PMRA Super Street Points Runner-Up
6 Time Centerville Dragway Points Champion
Sponsored by:
Scorpion Helmets
Galfer Braking
AMSOIL
Steve's Speed Shop
Kawasaki Sports Center
Mickey Thompson Tires
Catalyst Racing Composites
Conway Cycle
Syed Leathers
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KZScott
Needs a life
high on speed
Posts: 7235
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posted August 05, 2009 06:03 PM
I have a set of Muzzy links in the middle hole, its either that or stock, which puts the tail waay up in the air do to the long arm and downward angle. way higher than stock... should i try it way up? this is what it looks like ready to go now. opinions on body position are welcome, Ive seen guys launch way out over the tank, and others sitting in the seat...
I noticed im pulling my feet up way to quick too, which is part of the problem too.
Ill give you a call soon, super busy week.... down with more HP is good 
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
|
Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted August 05, 2009 06:54 PM
Scott, you should try to get some threaded links so you can set the bike up right. It is sitting way up there.
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NOX
Needs a job
PMRA / TMRC Super Street 4022
Posts: 3745
|
posted August 06, 2009 06:02 AM
Get the front end LOOOOOWWWWWWW,
my feet go on the pegs as soon as I drop the hammer........
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xnc__GVBgw8
My rear is high, but look at my avatar at what it is when I get two feet out.......
notice how low the front is...., I am like 3.5 inches down in the front..., my sidewinder header is two inches from the pavement, and the coby pan is the same......., shortened shock brings the linkage up, so I have 2 inches all the way......
____________
42 Wins
21 Runner-ups
2010 TMRC Super Street Points Champion
2010 PMRA Super Street #3 Points
2009 PMRA Super Street Points Runner-Up
6 Time Centerville Dragway Points Champion
Sponsored by:
Scorpion Helmets
Galfer Braking
AMSOIL
Steve's Speed Shop
Kawasaki Sports Center
Mickey Thompson Tires
Catalyst Racing Composites
Conway Cycle
Syed Leathers
|
NOX
Needs a job
PMRA / TMRC Super Street 4022
Posts: 3745
|
posted August 06, 2009 06:06 AM
I am so low in the front, if I put that arm on my bike, I woudl be at about 66 or 65 inches........
My arm on your bike would put you at about 70.......
your swingarm pivot and axle should be the same height..., but with a stock header type pipe, that will be hard......
My alternator and clutch cover are about centered with my front axle.........
I could go lower, but only with a muzzy pipe, and koenig pan, and it would only be about a half inch......
____________
42 Wins
21 Runner-ups
2010 TMRC Super Street Points Champion
2010 PMRA Super Street #3 Points
2009 PMRA Super Street Points Runner-Up
6 Time Centerville Dragway Points Champion
Sponsored by:
Scorpion Helmets
Galfer Braking
AMSOIL
Steve's Speed Shop
Kawasaki Sports Center
Mickey Thompson Tires
Catalyst Racing Composites
Conway Cycle
Syed Leathers
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