kzz1
Zone Head
"Show me whatcha workin with"
Posts: 908
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posted September 08, 2002 08:17 PM
Question about the steels and fibers
What should the stack height measure at? Have the Muzzy basket and going on the 4th set of fibers and steels this year. Got 11 fibers and 10 steels (2.0). My question is the first fiber that goes into the basket is the thin one followed by 10 fibers that are the same. Is everyone using the the thin fiber? How many fibers and steels are being used?
  
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ninja12
Needs a job
Posts: 3310
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posted September 09, 2002 09:07 AM
I use the muzzy setup 10 steels and 11 fibers for 1 or 2 trips to the track.
Then i go to 11 steels and 11 fibers (2 steels) together. This was suggested by
KCaby (sp). IT works great, because the 11 and 10 setup will burn your clutches
long before they wear.
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RAC4IT
Needs a job
Bergie
Posts: 3009
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posted September 09, 2002 09:07 AM
 Edited By: RAC4IT on 9 Sep 2002 10:08
I used 11 regular fibers; don't use the thin fiber or the spring it's a waste. Mine exploded 3 times 
so I just started using a full size fiber for #1 instead ever since no problems. (10) 2.0 steels and (11) standard fibers.
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hotrodninja
Expert Class
Posts: 121
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posted September 09, 2002 09:32 AM
Same here, I agree on using the normal fiber for the inside. I've seen the same breakage. By the way, the 2002 clutch has two of the narrow fibers and springs. One on the inside, and one in the middle. They're both gone now.
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Be consistent, win money.
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BA
Pro
Posts: 1592
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posted September 09, 2002 02:39 PM
HotRodNinja and BERGIE, are either of you running any other non-stock clutch parts?
Just making sure we're comparing apples to apples because I haven't been so unlucky yet to break that inner fiber plate running a 10/11 setup. (knocking on wood)
I thought that washer/spring helped to "cush" things a little bit?
Just what is that little sucker for anyway?
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RAC4IT
Needs a job
Bergie
Posts: 3009
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posted September 09, 2002 04:59 PM
I have the Muzzys modified clutch hub and billet basket. Never broke one until I did the billet basket though; if that is a reference point for you. Don't know what the ring is for so I got rid of it 
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ra12r
Zone Head
Posts: 919
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posted September 09, 2002 05:20 PM
all thick fibers, 10 steels 2.0 plus 1 steel 1.6 and measured my stack height based on the bottom out distance for the pressure plate. i run the two steels in the center of the pack,,,,i only order steels now as the fibers have never worn out. I have the Muzzy clutch everything plus all schnitz springs.
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All must bow to the "Ra Supremecy"...
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kzz1
Zone Head
"Show me whatcha workin with"
Posts: 908
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posted September 09, 2002 08:12 PM
Thanks guys! Will try the 10-(2.0) steels and 11 fibers. I could'nt believe how fast I was going through steels and fibers not to mention the cost arg! Still have the "Dry Clutch" as well even with the Muzzy basket and hub. I'm trying something different. Ground a flat spot on the clutch pusher to see if it will allow more oil in the basket? BTW, what is the min. stack height on the clutches?
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ra12r
Zone Head
Posts: 919
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posted September 10, 2002 06:20 AM
Is there any validity to the claims on Easy's board that they gave there clutch TOO MUCH oil and now it is slipping?!?!
Kzz1, please keep in mind that adding that one 1.6 steel and removing that inner spring and little fiber, really made my clutch smooth.
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All must bow to the "Ra Supremecy"...
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RAC4IT
Needs a job
Bergie
Posts: 3009
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posted September 10, 2002 07:10 AM
I'm renting out MIR this Friday and will give the extra steel a try. Should I drop in a 1.6 or an additional 2.0? Otherwise it's a brand new clutch. Also how much should I grind off that puller rod thingy?
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BA
Pro
Posts: 1592
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posted September 10, 2002 06:37 PM
RA12, I just wanted to chime in about that "too much oil" thing from Easy's board.
Maybe I need to go read it again and get updated, but I thought that they were looking at MORE of a probability of OIL WINDAGE slowing them down, vs the clutch slipping?
KEN: I don't know the official stack heights but, I've measured my when stock and got 2.26", 2.25" and I think even a 2.22" unless I screwed up the last measurement.
For the Muzzy's, I only measured once and got 2.20. I don't own a pair of calipers so those measurements are from a year ago, and thus any memory about how I got that measurement is GONE too! 
Bergie, I believe I've seen both .020 and .040 from people concerning how much to grind off. I just took the dremel to mine and eyeballed it while running my finger over it as well. Then I final-sanded it for smoothness.
It's never failed me and my clutches aren't as wet as I'd like them to be, but they're not really dry anymore either. (using Muzzy hub and basket too)
Here's my cheesy old drawing trying to depict how much to grind off. Purely eyeballing it!
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RAC4IT
Needs a job
Bergie
Posts: 3009
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posted September 10, 2002 08:17 PM
THANKS!!!
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swft
Needs a life
Full throttle!
Posts: One MEEEEEELLION
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posted September 10, 2002 08:31 PM
It's for kids! 
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kzz1
Zone Head
"Show me whatcha workin with"
Posts: 908
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posted September 10, 2002 08:50 PM
BA... Took a measurement of the clutch pack I pulled out and it measured 2.08. This # seems awefully low to me!? Checked it twice I'll measure the stack height when I get the new fibers and steels but I still don't know what is the min or max height should be. Guess i'll have to look in the service manual. Also, would I use the factory stack height when using a Muzzy basket and hub? As far as the drawing is concern, i ground off approx .040 on one side. I hope this will make a difference?
RA12R... Have you tried using the 2.0 steel instead of the 1.6?
Which is better... 10 steels and 11 fibers or 11,11? I guess it would depend on the stack height?
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fastestr1
Expert Class
Posts: 300
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posted September 11, 2002 04:57 PM
Ok can you all tell me what the stock set up is so I know what you are talking about with the impovements. I have the black 02 with Kings duel NOS set-up 255 HP and need the best clutch set-up.
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Black 02, 8.99 @ 161.95 motor on NOS
Put one knee down for the curves and both knees down for GOD
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BA
Pro
Posts: 1592
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posted September 11, 2002 06:00 PM
I'm pretty sure that Muzzy states in the piece of paper that comes with the kit and the 'all 2.0 steels', that his stack height is LESS than the stock height, but "is nothing to worry about, there's plenty there....". Seems like he might have even mentioned the height of his kit, or the DIFFERENCE from the stock height.
I can't find that damn thing now. Anyone got one?
FASTESTR1: What in the heck are you going to do with double-nitrous in Hawaii? Aren't you in Hawaii?!?!? You'd hit the nitrous button and BAM!! you'd be at the other end of the island!
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ra12r
Zone Head
Posts: 919
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posted September 11, 2002 09:46 PM
I am using 10 (2.0's) and 1 (1.6),,,,,,,I eyeball the pressure plate distance according to the visual as if looking through the oil fill hole. This also changed my clutch engagement position a little for the good. I can slide my clutch much better now. i currently put both steels in the center as that was where i was getting most of my burned steels. I haven't had to change the fibers in a couple of steel sets now. My fibers are not really wearing much. To me the only distance/height that matters is the distance left for the pressure plate to bottom out on the hub. i just give it plenty of room, by adjusting my steels accordingly. I now just change out individual steels as needed.....which is not that often!
I was asking about the clutch slippaged from over oiling, as posted on the other board??!?!??! i am interested and confused about that,,,,,is it correct?!?!?!?
____________
All must bow to the "Ra Supremecy"...
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BA
Pro
Posts: 1592
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posted September 12, 2002 09:19 PM
Edited By: BA on 12 Sep 2002 22:28
I'm so glad that you (RA12R) and RAC4IT (Bergie) mentioned the improved clutch lever movement, just by adding in that extra 1.6 plate. I have *ALWAYS* had trouble with the lever adjustment when the Muzzy plates were brand new. (10steels, 11fibers)
My lever just WOULD NOT give both full engagement AND full dis-engagement. You could adjust for one, but you wouldn't get the other. It's very odd.
From the sounds of your's and Berg's posts on the other thread, I'm gonna have to check that out myself. Sure sounds like it could help.
Yo, check this out! (PAY ATTENTION KEN/KZZ1!!!)
and just for grins.......
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BA
Pro
Posts: 1592
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posted September 12, 2002 09:31 PM
Well CRAP. that's as big as I can post here I guess. Those pictures are huge but got scaled down either here or at printroom.com.
The stack size is 2.24" - 2.27"
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ra12r
Zone Head
Posts: 919
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posted September 13, 2002 07:31 AM
BA, the addition of the 1.6 steel should make you happy. Then adjust the cable placement.
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All must bow to the "Ra Supremecy"...
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fastestr1
Expert Class
Posts: 300
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posted September 13, 2002 12:43 PM
Yes, I am in Hawaii and I am trying to find the quickest way to get to the other side of the 1/4. hehe
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Black 02, 8.99 @ 161.95 motor on NOS
Put one knee down for the curves and both knees down for GOD
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jessz1
Expert Class
Half the wheels, twice the fun
Posts: 373
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posted September 13, 2002 07:12 PM
You guys that go through clutches so fast slip the shit out of it!!! Stack height?? Who cares. Make it so the lever is right and go race. I have two of the thinner stock steels in place of one of the Muzzy ones. No little inner disk either
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your car is slow
Needs a job
Fuck Nitrous...Got Boost?
Posts: 4089
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posted September 20, 2002 05:31 AM
so 10 2.0s and 11 fibers?
Is it safe to assume that its ok to use at least ONE of the stock 1.6s with the middle of the new ones?
I dont believe that I destroyed or damaged them all.
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Do not taunt happy fun ball!
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RAC4IT
Needs a job
Bergie
Posts: 3009
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posted September 20, 2002 06:05 AM
quote:
so 10 2.0s and 11 fibers? Is it safe to assume that its ok to use at least ONE of the stock 1.6s with the middle of the new ones?
Yes I install (10) 2.0mm + (1) 1.6mm about 6 plates out from the inside so at that point you will have a 2.0 and a 1.6 back-to-back in the pack then continue on as normal ending with the 11th fiber.
As far as engagement and adjustability goes I find that if you put about 50 street miles on a brand new clutch before installing the additional 1.6 steel adjustment is perfect. I suppose it has something to do with the pack having to settle in or something...
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your car is slow
Needs a job
Fuck Nitrous...Got Boost?
Posts: 4089
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posted September 20, 2002 06:31 AM
Got it.... thanks!
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Do not taunt happy fun ball!
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