KZScott
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Posts: 7235
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posted July 20, 2008 04:37 PM
I think im going to try your numbers Karl, mine are close, but im showing 96-97% for 100%tps. it shows 100% when the bike is off, but not during a run.
this is the map i used as a base map to start tuning my bike. its the map i used last season with a mod to the 0%tps as per VH recommendations
this is the map i had going to the track this wknd after 4 tuning sessions on the road
this is what i just loaded into my PC after making a few changes based on the logs from the drag strip
this is a log from a drag pass
the same thing, but with some boxes where i clicked on the map to get the values
im just guessing at what numbers to put in my PC map, but i know where it has to be richer or leaner, and if its "some" or "a lot". ill just keep at it till im just having to make small (1%)changes. it would be really nice to know how much 1 percent of fuel added or taken away changes AFR, but its fun guessing
im also not using any smoothing now that im just looking at a very small section of the log. its much more accurate that way
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01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
  
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rgeorge
Expert Class
Posts: 220
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posted July 21, 2008 09:41 PM
 Edited By: rgeorge on 21 Jul 2008 22:43
I created this table as a quick guideline for making PC adjustments. First, pick the row for the AFR measured in your log, the go across to the column for the AFR you want. The number is the amount you add to your existing PC value.
Note!!!!
The table should only be used as a rough guideline! It assumes that injector pulse duration is directly proportional to the amount of fuel delivered, which is not exactly true, especially at certain duty cycles.
Also, the correction wont be accurate if the PC already has a large (positive or negative) value.
If the cell you need to adjust already has large positive value, this table will undercorrect.
If the cell you need to adjust already has large negative value, this table will overcorrect.
I haven't had a chance to use this table much, please let me know if I need to build in some fudge factors to make it work better.
Rob
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KZScott
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posted July 22, 2008 02:11 PM
hey Rob, the table isnt loading for me
"504 Gateway Timeout
The following error occurred: [code=GATEWAY_TIMEOUT] A gateway timeout occurred. The server is unreachable. Retry the request.
Could not open error file "
could you email it to s_u_fire@hotmail.com?
thx!
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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rgeorge
Expert Class
Posts: 220
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posted July 22, 2008 05:22 PM
.jpg and .xls files sent.
Is anyone else having trouble seeing it above?
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KZScott
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Posts: 7235
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posted July 22, 2008 05:40 PM
we have picture! (in the email) yeah, if anyone else cant see it, ill put it on photobucket and post it. nobody has mentioned not seeing my pics before
it looks like my guesses were pretty close to your table, so i should be close to 12.6 on my next run 
thx!
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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KZScott
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Posts: 7235
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posted July 23, 2008 05:39 PM
Edited By: KZScott on 23 Jul 2008 18:46
ok well i went for 2 runs tonight and got it down to 12.8 at 11500 at 100%. still lean from about 7000 up to 11500. after 2 map adjustments i have a 28 in the 9500 @100% cell. and i have some 20s and high teens in that area of the map now. damn this thing is thirsty hopefully its close on the next run. my map is starting to look like a nitrous map for a stock bike...which i find highly satisfying  . it should pull much better mph at the track this wknd with better mapping. i really doubt 13.3:1 AFR was good for acceleration lol.
oh, forgot to mention. after the first run tonight, i looked at my log and it told me i only got to 80% throttle. WTF? i knew i was WFO, and i was getting -20 for 0... then i remembered i had played around with the sensor to get it to idle higher so i could back my idle screw out. for some reason my idle screw had to be turned in quite a bit after the rebuild, and that caused the fast idle lever to not work. the cam wasnt hitting anything because the idle screw was turned in too far. so my new calibration numbers are -19 and 147. i now get 0 and 100% in my log file
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01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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rgeorge
Expert Class
Posts: 220
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posted July 24, 2008 06:26 PM
You've probably already done most of this but this is what I did before I started logging.
Before you build a fuel map:
Set the TPS sensor with a volt meter per the service manual(with warm idle at 1000RPM).
Then increase idle to the speed you want and record the new TPS sensor voltage. Set this voltage as 0% throttle in your logger software. Record the TPS sensor voltage at full throttle (with the key on, engine not running!) to set 100% throttle in the software
Also, you need to adjust the Power Commander software so 0% and 100% TPS read correctly. With the bike at hooked to the laptop, at idle, press the button to set 0% throttle. Then, hit the kill switch, open the throttle (with the engine not running!) and set 100% throttle.
If you don't do this calibration, the x-axis cells in the PC software don't represent the bikes actual throttle position.
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rgeorge
Expert Class
Posts: 220
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posted July 24, 2008 06:45 PM
Some people like to set 0% in the PC software with the bike at factory idle (1000RPM). Then after you increase the idle, the software will never read less than 1% throttle. Whatever you do, do it once, then don't mess with it again. A small change in the zero definition can make a significant difference in the best map for 0 and 2% throttle.
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KZScott
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Posts: 7235
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posted July 24, 2008 06:57 PM
actually i was unaware of some of that. very good info thank you! what button on the pc do i hit to set 0 and 100?
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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KZScott
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Posts: 7235
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posted July 25, 2008 04:49 PM
so i was going to go to the track tonight, but it was raining a bit, so going first thing in the morning (leaving at 6 am, everything is packed and ready to go). this is the map ill be trying
i got my laptop working and my software transfered and calibrated, so i should be able to tweak the map after every pass. gotta love this technology
also trying out a bit less static pressure with the clutch to see how much it helps the bog off the line. its very easy to see in the log file. also easy to see that im not getting wfo right off the line. my right hand is still in training, and hopefully ill be getting to 100% quicker tomorrow. and my final trick im trying is a lead filled front axle. going by the bathroom scales i put 2 pounds of lead in the axle.
theres a 14 running a dry shot that went 9.15 @157. i want to run him down NA(with him spraying) this wknd. wish me luck
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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KZScott
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Posts: 7235
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posted July 27, 2008 10:18 AM
man did i ever have my bike running like shit yesterday. i cant stress enough how right you were Rob. i adjusted the tps and didnt adjust the power commander. big mistake. went to launch the bike at 7500rpm and holding the throttle constant, the bike would rev up and down from 5000 to 9000 very quickly (imagine the "muzzy" idle with no pc, but way worse and more pronounced). my laptop would only connect to the lm1 so i set the tps back to where it was and the bike ran fine. i get home and it will connect to the pc, no idea why it wouldnt at the track. my tps on the pc allways showed 1 before(i never paid any attention to it) and when i got back home it showed 3. not bad for guessing. i set it up the way it was when the bike was running bad, and i got over 10. i calibrated the tps with the pc and now the bike runs fine and my fast idle works. i had to recalibrate my lm1 aswell.
only got to make 5 passes, so ill keep tuning the bike on the road. my logs from the track are pretty much useless as the tps was off.
went to low with static clutch pressure (ill pm you Nox) and the bike slowed down. didnt want to pop the cover off with a bunch of guys around so i left it as is for the amount of passes i made. it was a nice smooth launch, just not agressive enough, but it was still enough to turn the rim in the shinko....
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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rgeorge
Expert Class
Posts: 220
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posted July 27, 2008 01:34 PM
Sounds like you are getting all the bugs stomped out. You make progress on your bike with a lot less downtime than me. At this rate, you'll have an excellent fuel map soon. Then you can start adding N2O. 
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KZScott
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posted July 27, 2008 02:38 PM
as long as my logs from the track are showing proper AFR ill try nitrous. the rest of the map will still have to be systematically tweaked for driveability on the street, but as long as its ok 100% tps and from 7000rpm up, it gets sprayed as soon as i get everything i need
thx for all your help i would be lost without this forum
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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entropy
Moderator
Posts: 8671
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posted July 27, 2008 03:11 PM
KZ,
is there any reason your 80% column is so different from yr 100%???
I tune at 100%, then just copy that column onto 80%.
I dunno if it helps or hurts but i guessing the 80% should be close to the 100%
Keep up your threads, they are great.
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This moderator uses moderation in moderation
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KZScott
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Posts: 7235
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posted July 27, 2008 03:53 PM
the simple reason is because i havent really logged anything constant at 80% yet. i put it 5% richer from 7000 up compared to my map from last yr, but didnt really get many data points at 80% yet. my main objective was to get 100% done first so its ok for racing. my plan is to get 100% finished, then work on the rest of the map. im going to mark off on the throttle where 10, 20, 40, 60, and 80 are and try to hold the throttle at those places for a sweep up thru the rpm range so i can tweak the rest of the map.
if 80 should be close to 100 ill just copy it like you said. it should make tweaking 80% a breeze. thx for the tip!
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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