redelk
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posted December 10, 2003 10:47 PM
Mladin won't race his Superbike at Daytona
I found it both interesting and courious on what Mladin said as Suzuki was loading up their bikes...
Suzuki's Mat Mladin said he would not test the Suzuki GSX-R1000 at DIS on Wednesday. "I won't race at Daytona again," said four-time and reigning AMA Superbike champion Mladin this morning in the wake of yet another suspected tire failure yesterday at Daytona. Mladin added that he would only compete in the 200, a race he has won twice, on a 600cc motorcycle.
Source: AMA News.
Is it really the tire failure or could Suzuki's top rider be throwing in the championship towel before the season has even started? Unquestionably, DiSalvo's crash due to tire failure has upset a lot more riders than just Mladin. Still, while the other riders are also questioning the tire safety issue concerning the liter bikes, none of the other riders have indicated that they will not be competing in either the Superbike or Superstock classes on March 6th. Including DiSalvo, Buckmaster, Spies and Bostrom, all who have had high speed tire failures at DIS.
So I ask again, is Mladin already given up on the GSXR1000 for '04 or does he really believe that his talents will let him make up the lost points as the season progresses on "less dangerous" courses? Wasn't also Mladin (and many of the other riders) that complained about the track conditions on just about all the other venues (and for good reason, IMHO), with the exception of the outstanding facilities at Barber?
I don't that it's just Mladin that has given up on the Gixxer. To me, it looks like if Suzuki let's him get away with skipping Daytona (at least on a Superbike), they too... have given up. If their bike and rider could attain the speeds or lap times of DiSalvo's SUPERSTOCK R1, their could be some legitimacy to their safety concerns. Sadly, the best Mladin could do was "get close" to the times of the R1 Superstock bikes.
BTW - check out what the rim sizes were on the tires that failed. DiSalvo's was a 17" and they are talking about letting Superstock bikes run a 16.5" rim. The thing is, that what was on Spies bike when his tire let go last October. The failure on Spies bike was ruled to be a "manufacturing defect" and not due to the stresses of the highbanks.
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There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely games.
-Ernest Hemingway
   
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Ninjaman12R
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posted December 11, 2003 04:18 AM
Interesting Sherm,....
Sherman,
I've been keeping up with the tire test and while I do feel there is a need to improve the Dunlops, I also feel Mladin has his panties in a wad.  He has been very candid these past few days about his frustrations with the '04 GSXR 1000. He has a valid point about the tires, but I think he is using that as a scapegoat. All the guys know there are problems with the tires at Daytona.
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EastBayDave
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posted December 11, 2003 04:41 AM
There's always been tire troubles at DIS, it's just the new liter bikes are making more HP than they ever have before...
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Enjoy the ride!
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Zammy
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posted December 11, 2003 05:38 AM
What a wuss, The Hondas were going much faster without all the piss'n and moanin'. But those guys still have their jewels. Maybe Australia would be a safe place for Matt to race ,mate.
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necro
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posted December 11, 2003 06:53 AM
What happened?
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jonwright
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posted December 11, 2003 08:34 AM
Yeah - Spies had bitched as well. Although he didn't say we wasn't going to race.
I kinda figure if the racer boys like that piss and moan it's probably pretty legit - most of those guys really do put their bodies and life at risk to win - that's a pretty big gamble in the first place.
So, to begin with they have more nads than most every one on this board, IMHO. But, yeah, he could be compaining if he thinks he won't win.
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rubber pants
Zone Head
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posted December 11, 2003 08:54 AM
Sounds to me like he knows the bike will not be competeitive this year at DIS anyway and wants to just go home that weekend! lol (Chicken Pooper)
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k bryant
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posted December 11, 2003 10:06 AM
There is no rider who has better credentials to speak out on safety issues of himself & fellow riders than Mat. I know Mat personally, and as a matter of fact, we meet next to go over our Honda Australia contract we're working on for Mat Mladin Imports.
I definetly have a bias towards the Honda Race team. That's where my investment and efforts are placed in racing (though personally, I'm a Kawboy too!). But believe me, there is no more respected, fierce, and feared competitor that we worry about, than Mat. We are worried about the same tire issues that Mat is; period!
Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and I'm not suggesting anyone suppress their opinions here. But unless you've held the throttle WFO on the banks of Daytona for extended periods of time, you're opinions are just that; opinions. They are not valid facts. I have. And it's not the same as doing it in a straight line. Not even close. It goes through your mind every once in a while about "what would happen if a tire fails". When you start thinking about it too much, it's time to change the enviorment. That can be rules or retirement.
Guys, this is just tire testing. It's a long way till March. Everyone is feeding off instant reactions and emotions. If you think Mat and/or Suzuki is going to actually not race Daytona, think again. Oh, and talking to BBoz, if you think tire issues aren't on their minds (they just aren't noting it in the press) your wrong. Everyone is concerned. He also would not bet against Mat winning on a Superstock version of the GSXR1000 and/or a FX600. This guy (Mat) burns more fierce than anyone I have ever met when it comes to winning. He expects perfection and that's what champions are made of. So unless you're a 4x Superbike Champion, pulling the throttle cables at Daytona, who are you to criticize him?
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rubber pants
Zone Head
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posted December 11, 2003 10:53 AM
Well........ lets not get too serious here, Iwas just commenting on what he said before the tire issues there this week. He said and complained that the Suzuki was lacking in the HP dept. (Compared to the Honda) So I thought it was a good time to stur up a little conversation here as it has been a little boring as of late. But I sure do understand tire failure! It's gotta be scary for sure . Hell I had a rear tire let go at 100 MPH on my 12 in the middle of a traffic infested I 5 last summer on our way to Leguna, that scared the be jeepers outta me , parked the bike and there it was NO TIRE just bits on the rim smoking!!!! I could not imagine that happening at 185 MPH or so!
No criticsim meant as Matt is one hell of a competitor that for sure!!!
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zeta xray
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posted December 11, 2003 11:09 AM
IMHO Daytona has been out paced by the bikes. They are just too fast for that track layout. I admit that I am not a Matt Mladin fan. On the other hand, I have always respected his drive and talent but I now have more respect for him taking a stand because he feels it is unsafe. He was bound to know that it was going to invite criticism and negative speculation. I am disappointed that the other riders have not stood behind him on this. Leave Daytona to the Bike Week Harley crowd and move the races to Barber. 95% of the Bike Week crowd never attend the races anyway.
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k bryant
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posted December 11, 2003 11:33 AM
I try not to get too caught up in it, but it's difficult. I've been there as a racer, and as a sponser. I don't want my guys getting hurt, as I'm sure nobody else does.
Mat can be a hard guy to get close to. I value my relationship with him. He is intense. But he speaks his mind and can be brutely honest. Some people have a very hard time with that. I wish the other riders did indeed back his opinions more, but I believe they may have more clauses in their contracts about such things. As well as not wanting to make as many waves. Mat lays it on the line, and accepts the consiquences....
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redelk
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posted December 11, 2003 12:06 PM
I don't believe that I have necessarily "slammed Mr. Mladin, either personally or professional. If anyone deserves a "spanking" it's his "keeper" at Suzuki for letting him make such a statement without putting some kind of corporate spin on it. Something like, "We are reviewing this and previous tire failure incidents. At the conclusion of all the investigations, we will determine the level of our participation at that time.". This way, the seriousness of Mr. Mladin's (and again, many other riders and teams) is not ignored, but removes the "finality" of not running a factory bike in March.
ZX's point about outgrowing DIS is spot on and it would be wise for DIS and AMA to revisit and review the course layout for the upcoming event. In it's current configuration, the limited benefits of spectators enjoying the high speeds and drafting possibilities is far outweighed by the riders safety. To force any tire manufacturer to come up with a single purpose tire for just this event is ridiculous and put an unrealistic burden on those manufacturers. Daytona is like no other event on the circuit. It's not that it's uniqueness is to be radically altered to make it just like any other event, but to ignore the obvious safety hazards of such an event is rather cavalier on AMA's part. It, once again, underscores AMA's lack of respect or concern for it's competitors that race under it's (newly redesigned) banner.
Though I am no fan of Mr. Mladin, I do have the upmost respect for him as a rider and what he has accomplished. I also feel that his concerns are legitimate. My point is that his method of bringing these concerns to the forefront, though effective, is hardly the best way to do it. Many feel that his method does more to acknowledge his perceived attitude and ego problem, thus allowing the real issues to ignored... again.
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There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely games.
-Ernest Hemingway
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VincentHill
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posted December 11, 2003 12:38 PM
There are always going to be tire problems at Daytona! Usually center right from the Banking. Remember, Daytona was run up until the med 80's with one (1) tire. These cast iron tires made by Goodyear would run the race, but at reduced cornering speeds (Faster and you fall down and go bang!). Barry sheen really did up his legs from a flat tire and that caused the rule of Metal caps on the tire valves (The realized that the centrifugal force was pulling the valve stems in and losing all of the air out of the tires! Hence the bent stems on the 2000 ZX12R'd to avoid this very problem!
Matt has already suffered a tire failure at Atlanta and sure does not want one at Daytona, who can blame him! Kurtiss Roberts must not be there because no one I know is harder on tires than him! The Irony of him is, his dad, knew that tires would be a problem, so used differedt lean angles during the 200 to use different parts of the tires so he could go fast at the end!
Everyone knew last year that the "Qualifying tire" they were using only had "1" Serious lap in it before it went away! The Tire companies know this also and just should agree on a performance level of the race and qualifying tires for Daytona and war after Daytona! ALso remember, they had restrictor plates (31 MM) on the bikes to slow them down and went to 750's as the ultimate way to slow them down! Now with technology being even better than it was in 1985, what are they doing? Going back to the 1,000 CC Bikes! Guess what, the tires still have not caught up!
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Zammy
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posted December 11, 2003 02:48 PM
k bryant , you're right. Who am I to criticize him. I guess he's been getting more and more obnoxius in his interviews concerning other riders or other brands . It just sounded like more whining to me. I didn't know such a tire threat was really a larger concern with the Honda guys than last year. As you said they just weren't going to the press with it. Maybe the 200 should be a 600 race. I think they should also race what tire they qualify on.
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k bryant
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posted December 11, 2003 03:07 PM
Agreed.
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k bryant
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posted December 11, 2003 03:27 PM
There is another tire test scheduled for January. Apparently this one will not be monopolized by Dunlop (all mfgs are invited). This is a positive step by the Speedway to open an additional test date to try the next generation fix to the tire problems. But man, ioverall, t's a huge expense to get the teams back out there.... We don't have much choice, because Fontana just does not apply the G-Forces, and/or sustained high speeds to the tire. Daytona is one of a kind.
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zeta xray
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posted December 11, 2003 04:38 PM
I don't remember where I read this. An engineer who was asked to redesign and update an existing track said something to the effect that, if you built a brand new state-of-the-art race track today and incorporated all of the latest technology in track safety, in 10 years some elements of it would have to be redone to accomodate the increase in performance levels of the vehicles that are racing on it. When was the last update of Daytona? DIS has said they are not the problem because they haven't changed in years. In their view, the problem is with the bikes and the tires. I would venture to say that good old Texas World Speedway is a better design for modern motorcycles and could be made safer, easier than Daytona could ever hope for.
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slug
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posted December 11, 2003 05:20 PM
having watched races in person at daytona, i'd have to say the track SUX for a spectator. even in the infield your view is crap. the fastest part of the track is not the most interesting.
in cases like this i think the televised racing is better watching. i love to be there in person, and to hear and smell and feel the bikes going fast, but the fact is you get a MUCH better view of the action with the tv cameras.
that being said, i'll still go to one, but i'll leave the comptuer set to record anyway ;P
as far as the tires and such, well, if i was racing privateer, i would ignore daytona personally. there is no way i am going to run that fast that close to a freeking wall. granted there are dozens of riders who do it every year, i do not feel that level of risk is worth the effort. frankly, i would be too weirded out by that wall and such that i would NOT enjoy myself. and if you cannot enjoy yourself, there is NO reason to do it. When it ceases to be fun, it ceases to be worthwhile.
taking risk of that magnitude, and not enjoying the activity, is just punishing yourself. why do it?
as an aside i haven't raced, but i do participate in trackdays. next year (if job/finances/time permit) i'll get my license and dabble a bit in the CCS circuit. local guy here races CCS and does well, i'll prolly motorpool up with him and get the hang of things.
watching the foreign races, and the american ones, it is amazing the difference in trackside features. i think Barber is the closest american track to the same level as the good foreign ones. i hope to see a gp series there in 05
oh well, just my pennies
  
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DB
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posted December 11, 2003 05:59 PM
Let's move Daytona to the Indianapolis Motor Speedway. They did some track testing there not to long ago. Better yet, have them race at both. Just as Daytona is a one of a kind place the same can be said for Indy. The 500, The Brickyard, Formula 1, now let's bring the GREATEST race of all there. motorcycles!!!!!!!!
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Dan
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swft
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posted December 11, 2003 06:56 PM
Face it, motorcycles don't have the draw for IMS. Period.
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necro
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posted December 11, 2003 07:58 PM
Good for him. I wouldn't either (mainly because I am so slow )
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DB
Pro
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posted December 11, 2003 08:55 PM
if Formula 1 can draw then motorcycles can too
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Dan
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rubber pants
Zone Head
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posted December 11, 2003 11:31 PM
"F 1" To me means "Falling" to sleep in "1" friggin minute! Bikes or Cars ................ the most insane waiste of resorses known to man!! Period ........... No competition! That's why I like the Supersport /Superstock type racing. (Listening AMA?) Showroom machines/ rider/machine determing the outcome.
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DB
Pro
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posted December 11, 2003 11:43 PM
and I AGREE
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Dan
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frEEk
Administrator
ummm... yeah
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posted December 12, 2003 01:43 AM
wow, if u can fall asleep watchin F1, well... then ur one tired man  i love stock based racing cause of course it's a good representation of the vehicles we actually use, and it's budget minded, plus of course the greater ability for the drivers/riders to shine thru, but i love balls to the wall anything goes racing liek F1 (tho it's hardly anything goes) jsut as much. it's exploring the limit of what us humans can do with technology. the machines are just as interesting as the racing and racers to me, in both stock based and even mroe so in forumla racing. but hey, to each his own! 
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