GOZR
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GOZR
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posted May 30, 2003 12:28 PM
Portland racers? oregon
Who knows kirk from suzukihayabusa.org? from oregon, portland i think.
ZhooliGan, Swft?
he race the Busa..
and answer to one question i ask..
I'm just a novice, and I don't have much to compare it to except that I rode my buddy's Supersport legal Gixxer 750 once. The way my 'Bus is set up, it steers lighter, but slower than a Gixxer. It's obviously got a lot of power. I use the wrong gear (too high) in the back section of our course and don't shift there, simply because it's easier to modulate the throttle. I've got my hands full with cornering, I don't need to worry about a hitch in the throttle. Besides, even in the wrong gear it's got enough poop for a quick squirt to stay ahead of someone trying for a pass. The tire-melting horsepower is readily evident from the darkies I am painting out of turn 9 onto the front straight.
One of the things that a lot of people told me is that it would wear me out wrestling such a big bike around the road course. That has not proved to be the case. I actually found it quite easy and relaxing. I felt like I could have done an entire 4-hour endurance race all by myself (except the rear tire would not last). The only challenge that my body had was dehydration. I hydrated a lot. I'm a former cyclist, so I'm no stranger to pounding the water. But after 20 minutes on track, my tongue was always stuck to the roof of my mouth and I couldn't talk. I think it's the wind blast drying out my mouth. I gotta get that figured out. It's really uncomfortable.
Even set up like my bike is, it doesn't want to change lines like regular race bikes. I led the first two laps of both of my races until we came up on lapped traffic on the third lap. Other bikes were able to change lines and get around them where I couldn't. I also tend to have to take kind of conservative traditional lines. It's not like a 125 where you can pass all over the place. On the front straight, everybody else likes to be up against the wall, so I just stay out in the middle and blow past them and then tuck back in when setting up for turn 1.
There was also the safety aspects of passing lapped traffic. In my second race, I was going to take the race leader on the brakes going into turn 1. I could have done it no problem. I was comfortable with the 20 miles per hour that I was carrying over him. But we were both coming up on a backmarker, and my closing speed on him was more like 70 miles per hour. I would have had to take them both at the same time. The leader was going to go on his left, I was going to go by on his right. But if he had twitched when the leader went by him, I would have vaporized him on impact. So I had to let him go and tuck in behind the leader.
If I never came up on backmarkers I could probably win some races.
If I can get my starts down, that may very well happen. My clutch is stock, and with the hyperactive back-torque limiter, I'm leaving a full second, maybe two seconds on the starting line. At the green flag, everybody takes off, and then I repass them with the front wheel in the air in first or second gear. I always get to turn 1 first, no matter how bad my starts are. I'm going to a street bike shootout at a local drag strip on the 14th to work on my starts.
The acceleration and top speed is phenomenal. If I can't pass someone anywhere else, I can simply pull the trigger on our 3/4 mile long front straight.
Which leads to braking. The way my bike is set up, I'm able to take a suprising number of smaller bikes on the brakes. I'm not real timid with the brakes. I would tend to believe that once I graduate into the expert classes (after two more races) that everyone else will be getting me on the brakes. Hauling it down from 185mph or so seems to take a while, even with the rear tire dancing. It kind of made me feel better to watch an on-bike video of our local #5 guy on his Gixxer 1000 and found that he uses the same braking point that I do on the front straight, even though he's not going as fast as I am and his bike is lighter.
quote:
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Why the busa?
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It was what I had. It already had Sharkskinz on it after the last time I got hit on the street. It already had frame sliders. It was already safety wired.
quote:
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what did you change? or left stock..
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Making changes to get it to stop were real important. EBC HH "kit" race front brake pads. Goodridge -2 sized braided stainless dual front brake hose kit. Motul 600F degree DOT5.1 synthetic brake fluid.
With good brakes, the stock .85 kilo fork springs allowed the forks to bottom HARD. Enough to bark the front tire on braking, and chatter in corners. I'm using 1.0 kilo fork springs. Use this chart to pick yours:
I also had the shock re-sprung and had both ends revalved by Dave Hodges of GP Suspension: http://www.gpsuspension.com . The stock rear spring was a little too stiff and made the rear spin up on corner exits. Now it will wheelie off corners. I'm not good enough to really evaluate suspension beyond this, but Dave did a good job and I trust him.
Getting it to turn is super-important. Just changing one tooth on the rear sprocket is enough to feel when trying to turn the bike. I use stock 17/40 gearing and took two links out of the chain to shorten the wheelbase 5/8". I used a JCS handlebar mount to make room to lower the front 1/2". The rear end is about an inch higher than stock, due to an internal modification of the shock, and a taller rear tire. The OE 190/50 rear tire size won't turn, and doesn't have any traction on corner exits. A 180/55 works way better, but I'm using a 190/55 designed specifically for the 6.0" rear rim and it works really good too.
Tires. I use race compound DOT Rennsports. Green label in back, and blue label in front. The front has a steel belt in it that works like a supplemental steering damper. I've just got my stock worn out 27,000 mile steering damper, and I never get more than just a little wiggle on the gas while banked over. 30psi front and rear. Your track may require different.
Weight. Take everything off that is not motorcycle. I even pulled my engine counterbalancer. My bike is about 75lbs lighter than stock.
Wheels. I use Marvic Penta II magnesium racing wheels. Technically they are not legal for Supersport, but the rest of my bike is pretty much Supersport legal, and unless I was in the top 5 in the expert classes, nobody cares. So I'll be able to run Open Supersport and Open Superbike. A number of local guys do this. The wheels really help in turning, stopping, accelerating, traction, cornering, you name it.
PS- I'm not completely satisfied with my windscreen, but the closest that I have come to a "favorite" would be my clear Zero Gravity Double Bubble "Low" which is also referred to as the Drag version.
As far as rearsets go, I haven't done them yet. I tend to drag my toes. Rearsets would help.
The real cornering limitations on the bike are the stator cover on the left, and the bulge for the clutch cover in the fairing on the right. I recommend a billet aluminum stator cover. If you case the bike on the left, you will oil the track AND bend your crank.
The seat is too long, and flat. I like to ride forward up against the tank, and I tend to slide back on acceleration, then the bars wag when I pull myself forward again. I guess I need a really big butt-pad on the front of the hump.
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-Kirk
OMRRA Novice #705
That great..
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-G
  
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GOZR
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GOZR
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posted May 30, 2003 12:30 PM
I know that between the busa and the 12 there are a lots of things to share .. and to brag 
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-G
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Zhooligan
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posted May 30, 2003 01:21 PM
The only busa raced in the Seattle area has been kind of fun to watch, but has been crashed at least once every weekend. The funny thing was the guy tows it on a trailer behind a Suzuki Samarai (sp?).
The 12 is significantly better for racing then the busa as it has better ground clearance. Can't imagine racing with the stock pegs as low as they are.
Backmarkers are a fact of life. And the fast guys deal with them. And I guarentee you that Kirk is a back marker for guys like John Dugan and Mike Sullivan at Portland! Portland is avery fast 99% right hand track.
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To those who do not count their life in years, but in how life
has touched them in the past and how much it can hold in the
future; -- Youth is forever.
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GOZR
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GOZR
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posted May 30, 2003 01:36 PM
 Edited By: GOZR on 30 May 2003 14:37
http://www.ourchurch.com/member/p/pylandracing/
Kirk's site
I know about the clearance since my boots are dead now and i have to docktaped them . 
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-G
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swft
Needs a life
Full throttle!
Posts: One MEEEEEELLION
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posted June 01, 2003 05:14 AM
Docktaped? Duct Tape?
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swft
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posted June 01, 2003 05:19 AM
I like Kirk's reply, btw. He talks about all the same things I saw out on the track. Turning and braking are the biggest challenges for bikes that big. Passing is not an issue. Hats off to him for doing something different, and who knows, might see him at an endurance race, since OMRRA/WMRRA share the same schedule.
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ZHooligan
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posted June 05, 2003 08:43 PM
Edited By: ZHooligan on 5 Jun 2003 21:49
"As I was getting my self together in the run-off area, I remember looking around and seeing an instrument console. I walked over and picked it up thinking, "This must have come off when someone wrecked." The flagger came over to me and said "don't worry buddy we'll send those back to you pit." I thought wow nice guy. Shortly there after as I layed in the ambulance occurred to me, "those are my parts!"
I saw this in a signature line on another board. Thought it appropriate as GOZR is getting prepard to go racing. It is oh so true! I can recall looking at parts on the track thinking wow I should pick that piece up as a spare for my bike! a few minutes later it dawned on me "hey these are my parts!"
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To those who do not count their life in years, but in how life
has touched them in the past and how much it can hold in the
future; -- Youth is forever.
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GOZR
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GOZR
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posted June 05, 2003 10:08 PM
ZHolligan, true,
Swft i'll tell him that if he see a black 12 on the track to come to say hello/
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-G
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GOZR
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GOZR
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posted June 05, 2003 10:16 PM
Swft how far are you from Portland Oregon ?
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-G
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EastBayDave
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posted June 06, 2003 04:44 AM
GOZR, you going racing? How come OR, instead of where you live: CA?
Thunderhill, Sears, BW, SOW?
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Enjoy the ride!
02' ZRX1200
00' ZX12R sold
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swft
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posted June 06, 2003 04:57 AM
GOZR - About 150 miles north of Portland
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swft
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posted June 06, 2003 05:27 AM
Shit, I would have loved to done a track day today. Instead, I'm working all weekend. Grrr...
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fish_antlers
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The Truth is Out There
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posted June 06, 2003 05:38 AM
kirk has no hair
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What business is it of yours where I'm from, Friendo?
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swft
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posted June 06, 2003 05:47 AM
Who's Kirk, mon pussant?
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GOZR
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GOZR
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posted June 06, 2003 06:22 AM
Dave i'm getting ready.. and in Cal
Need more $ and voila !
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-G
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ZHooligan
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posted June 06, 2003 12:15 PM
I think GOZR's interest in Kirk is he is out there trying to race a busa. nd that is rare to say the least. As rare as racing a 12. I do remeber Kirk on Labusas a year ago when he came did a post about the taste of racing at Portland. He did the taste on his busa and was pretty stoked. He seemed tio imply that he was the fastest thing out there running near lap record times, doing 190 plus on the straightaway in the taste of racing.
Having been an instructor in many a taste of racing session it ain't happening. And certainly not on a busa. But he had fun. and now he apparently is racing his busa and good for him. I checked his site out he seems to be pretty happy. He indicated if it wern't for the guys lappers slowing him down he could probably be in front and winning. Lappers are out there for everyone to experience. And frankly a good rider at Portland should be able to pass regardless as the track has many good lines, it's plenty wide and with the busa power there are two straightaways that should eliminate any issues. But the reality in most all of our cases is the bike will go faster then our right wrist does!
My hats off to Kirk for racing. And I am looking forward to hearing from GOZR as he gets into racing. It is significantly different from street riding and track days. And in most cases the transponder brings reality into the picture.
Locally the track rcord at Portland is approx 1 min. and 8 sec., ast Seattle it is 1 min and 27 sec. approx and in Spokane it is 1 min and 28 sec. approx.
The really really fast guys go about 5 seconds slower then those records. The fast guys a couple seconds slower then that. I am 8 to 10 seconds off of the records on average. And I have met many a really fast, I'm the baddest, I'm the best street rider and track rider on the planet guys and they are typically another 10 seconds behind. So there is always room for improvement. What is even more amazing is the record holdrs run within a tenth of a second of the record lap after lap after lap in traffic!
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To those who do not count their life in years, but in how life
has touched them in the past and how much it can hold in the
future; -- Youth is forever.
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Kirk
Novice Class
Posts: 31
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posted June 06, 2003 12:40 PM
quote:
kirk has no hair
It blew off. 
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Kirk
Novice Class
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posted June 06, 2003 12:58 PM
quote:
Backmarkers are a fact of life. And the fast guys deal with them. And I guarentee you that Kirk is a back marker for guys like John Dugan and Mike Sullivan at Portland! Portland is avery fast 99% right hand track.
Johnny's a good guy. He came out at 07:00AM on the first day of my novice school to take the wheels off his race bike to have his rain race tires dismounted and brought them over and dropped them off at my pits for me to use in case it rained.
I appreciate your guarantee, but I'm not a backmarker yet. That should be in another two races when they kick me out of novice into the expert classes. I'm a little concerned about getting in the way out there, but Johnny tells me that I'm far from the slowest experts in Open Supersport and Open Superbike, and he feels that it will be safer for all involved since the speed differentials will be so much lower when they pass me as opposed to me passing the other novices.
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Kirk
Novice Class
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posted June 06, 2003 01:06 PM
quote:
...I do remeber Kirk on Labusas a year ago when he came did a post about the taste of racing at Portland. He did the taste on his busa and was pretty stoked. He seemed tio imply that he was the fastest thing out there running near lap record times, doing 190 plus on the straightaway in the taste of racing.
Having been an instructor in many a taste of racing session it ain't happening. And certainly not on a busa...
Allow me to correct you:
At the time, I said that the guys that I was circulating with had transponders and were in the high teens. That's about 12 seconds off the lap record.
And I don't remember seeing you there.
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Kirk
Novice Class
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posted June 06, 2003 04:58 PM
John has also been helping me with my sponsors.
I was just talking to him, and I asked about the local track records. He said that he holds the track record at Seattle at 1:27 flat. He's run a best of 1:07.5 at Portland and thinks that there is still room for improvement. I think he said that he and Sullivan go back and forth on the record at Spokane.
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ZHooligan
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posted June 06, 2003 05:03 PM
Edited By: ZHooligan on 6 Jun 2003 19:02
So now if you were running in the high teens your first time out, in the taste of racing format, then and considering most guys improve significantly what are your personal transponder verified lap times now?
As for the track record I am quite familiar with it as it was set in back to back laps by Larry Pegram and Michael Barnes at the Formula USA race last year. On non qualifier tires. Actually both bikes were on tires with over 40 laps on each. And on sub 145 horsepower GSXR 750's. Pegram actually turned in a quicker time but broke 145 hp so it didn't count and cost Larry the pole. In the morning we tuned it to make under 143 and still busted 145 in qualifying.
Do you plan to race at Seattle or Spokane any this year? Perhaps you can make the Spokane endurance race. We plan on running the ZX12 there for the endurance race.
As for your comment about not seeing me there , you are are right. I typically don't race Portland except for Endurance races. But that doesn't prevent me from getting in more them my fair share of races at Seattle and Spokane as well as racing Moto Cross and Super TT races. I made 9 roadracing events last year and rode 4 classes at each race. And on three or four of those occasions I managed to race the Friday Moto cross event and the Saturday Super TT race. And only did another 17 track days, worked as part of the pit crew for Sully at Daytona, Pikespeak, Fontana and Laguna. Then worked with Team Hooters as well. Racing is in my DNA!
You'll have to come to Seattle and turn left for a change! One of the reasons I do the Portland Endurance race so I can remeber what right turns are like!!
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To those who do not count their life in years, but in how life
has touched them in the past and how much it can hold in the
future; -- Youth is forever.
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GOZR
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posted June 06, 2003 06:54 PM
Edited By: GOZR on 6 Jun 2003 19:55
Kirk, ZHooligan and swft i realy wish you guys to meet over there
Guys racing 12 and Busa are Rare. Very Rare!
My hat to all of you.. 
Kirk welcome to this side..
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-G
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frEEk
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ummm... yeah
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posted June 06, 2003 10:41 PM
ok, i'm confused. kirk, you the same kirk from labusas with SS hottie? i havent really kep up with labusas for a while now so i'm a little lost.
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swft
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posted June 07, 2003 05:18 AM
Kirk - Hi Teens sounds reasonable to me. I've done tons of 1:24s on my SV650. And gave away a *ton* of time on that straightaway!
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ZHooligan
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posted June 07, 2003 09:21 AM
Edited By: ZHooligan on 7 Jun 2003 10:22
Hi-teens very reasonable in racing conditions. But not in the taste of Racing format. Kind of like Kenny Berstein running a 4 second quarter mile with 80 bikes on the straightaway.
____________
To those who do not count their life in years, but in how life
has touched them in the past and how much it can hold in the
future; -- Youth is forever.
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