JoeGibs
Novice Class
Posts: 73
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posted October 20, 2011 12:57 AM
headlights no worky
i've moved the 12 into the house for the winter, and started in on a few problems that came up at the end of its riding season. the last time i rode it was about a month ago, and it was taken out for the sole purpose to melt the rear tire. in the video, and on the ride home after, the headlights were working fine. but now, for some odd reason, i cant get them to work.
the fuses are good. the headlight bulbs are good. i'm not getting any power at the headlight bulb plug. i've taken all the relays apart and cleaned them up by scraping with a screwdriver and other random pointy tools that i could fit in there, then wiped clean with alcohol on q-tips. at the harness plug that feeds the blinkers and headlights, there's one pin that's constant 12v, that only turns off when i pull the fuse marked "tail" and i'm assuming that pin is hot for the running light in front. (my bike has been stripped naked, i dont have the factory headlight assembly) i'm not getting a light on the tach for the brights, and i've only found one pin in one of the relays that varies when the brights switch is thrown. but then when i check all the pins in the harness, i cant find any pins that have a variance when throwing the switch either way, or a pin that varies when i pull the headlight fuse.
i suppose i should ask exactly where the headlight relay(s?) are located? there's the two relays right up in the same harness as the headlight bulb plugs, but there's also another two mystery relays right next to the fuse block, and another that is tied in with the ignition system. i looked at a fiche but it didnt tell me exactly where its at, nor do i have a manual to try and look it up.
searching google, i came across a couple threads on kawiforums mentioning something about doing a stator/regulator connection fix? i'm still relatively new to this bike, whats that all about? sounded like it could be a possible reason the headlights arent working. something was also mentioned about a headlight fuse next to the battery, but i couldnt find any fuse located around the battery. am i blind?
while doing all of this, i took apart the left handlebar switch housing to inspect the actual headlight switch. everything in there looked mint, and not the least bit of corrosion. completely unrelated, but i noticed a cable popped loose, and not an electrical cable. it was like a clutch cable, but going into the actual switch housing. i traced it back and it connects to a rotating assembly right next to where the throttle cables connect to. anyone want to clue me into what exactly its purpose is?
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zx12mark
Pro
Posts: 1654
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posted October 20, 2011 08:54 PM
fast idle cable.but don`t call it a choke...............
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JoeGibs
Novice Class
Posts: 73
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posted October 20, 2011 09:32 PM
quote:
fast idle cable.but don`t call it a choke...............
might this be the reason she idles pretty rough at startup?
i've been searching the net more and more, and found a suggestion to bypass jump the relay inside the junction box. i jumped the red with white stripe wire with the blue with yellow stripe wire going into the junction box, and the headlights came on. from the sounds of it, bad connectors going to the rectifier/regulator causes this, either from them just going bad or from oil getting into the connectors. so now i have to find a relay to replace this one, unsolder the old one, and solder on the new one onto the junction box board. hope this shit works.
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frEEk
Administrator
ummm... yeah
Posts: 9660
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posted October 22, 2011 08:39 AM
Joe, yer gonna hate this, but yes it is a simple fuse in the battery box. It has happened to me and others many times. In the little black box on the end of the battery is a 20A fuse in a white plastic fuse holder with white wires coming off it (if i remember correctly). No need to solder anything.
The mystery relays next to the fuse box under the tank cover are indeed the headlight relays. Not sure why you having difficulty identifying other bits though, just get yourself the wiring diagram which is provided with the service manual.
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JoeGibs
Novice Class
Posts: 73
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posted October 23, 2011 03:47 PM
i never had a service manual, bought this bike from crashedtoys.com. i have found a couple wiring diagrams and such, but they're tough to read. i just pulled the battery completely out and found the wires and fuse you were talking about, and the fuse is good. the fuse on the fuse block is good too. when i took a jump wire to bypass the relay the headlights came right on. so now i get to unsolder a relay from the board and solder a new one in
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frEEk
Administrator
ummm... yeah
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posted October 23, 2011 09:57 PM
After thinking about it some... I think I went thru the same thing a while back. Forgot all about the relay in the damn fuse box. Took me forever to find if I remember correctly. Good luck with the solder job. Can't recall if I did the same or just replaced it with a used unit.
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JoeGibs
Novice Class
Posts: 73
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posted October 23, 2011 11:09 PM
on all the threads i read on other forums about people replacing the junction box, they all mentioned having paid 100 or more. so i never even considered it, but after you saying "used" a light bulb lit in my little head and decided to check ebay. 20 bucks, i'll take that over trying to solder on that tiny board
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frEEk
Administrator
ummm... yeah
Posts: 9660
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posted October 23, 2011 11:18 PM
Hell my dealer may have even just given it to me, can't remember. But yeah, $20 aint worth that time and frustration. So long as the used relay holds of course...
You did mention the rectifier connector tho: make damn sure you check that out. As mentioned oil travels up the tubing and fries the big connector in the tail. As in melts the whole damn thing. Take a good look and replace if needed. Don't end up side of the road like me with a dead bike and the bill for a new generator.
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JoeGibs
Novice Class
Posts: 73
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posted October 24, 2011 09:03 AM
i'm going to chop it off and solder it all solid, wont ever have to worry about it again.
the more and more i learn about this bike, it seems like it has a million design flaws. that or i've been spoiled by how awesome my 02 r1 has been to me.
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frEEk
Administrator
ummm... yeah
Posts: 9660
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posted October 24, 2011 10:24 AM
Yeah it had its share of issues, some fixed in later models (be glad you don't have a '00... even worse).
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JoeGibs
Novice Class
Posts: 73
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posted October 26, 2011 10:08 PM
shat. just got the new junction box put in and nothing changed. i used a wire to jump the two wires going into the junction box that control the relay, and the headlights came on, just like with my original junction box. i'm wondering what the possibility of both boxes having the same blown relay. but from what i was reading on the other forum, someone said that if you jumped it how they described (how i did) then its the relay. cant be any of the fuses if i can get the headlights to come on, right?
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tuusinii
Pro
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posted October 26, 2011 10:50 PM
I think that the problem is with rectifier of if your lucky just the connector. As I remember the relay is triggered with one phase of the rectifier. If it doesn't get voltage it won't turn on. So first check Your rectifier connector and then check that the rectifier itself works (ie. resistance ok and voltage between all wires is in spec).
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JoeGibs
Novice Class
Posts: 73
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posted October 26, 2011 11:43 PM
alright i'm working on the connectors right now. the one with three pins, with yellow wires coming from the stator, that connector had oil in it. not a ton, but enough to dirty up a couple q-tips. i pulled the wire loom down and started inspecting, and on one of the three wires (on the stator side of the connector) has a white with red stripe wire coming out of it covered by heat shrink tubing. i'm assuming this is the headlight trigger wire? both the rectifier and the stator are working, voltage is exactly where it should be while running.
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tuusinii
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posted October 27, 2011 02:56 AM
Yes that is the right wire.
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frEEk
Administrator
ummm... yeah
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posted October 27, 2011 07:17 AM
I'd say get out our multimeter and see what the voltages are on the relay inputs when the bike is running.
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JoeGibs
Novice Class
Posts: 73
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posted October 27, 2011 11:15 AM
i chopped the wires off the three pin connector and soldered them solid. no headlights still. before i did, i tested the running ac voltage on each pin. one was 18-19v, another 16-17v, and another was 5-6v. the wire connected to one of the yellow wires is solid white, not white with a red stripe. there was some gunk on it that made it look like a red stripe. where does this wire connect to?
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JoeGibs
Novice Class
Posts: 73
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posted October 28, 2011 12:37 AM
alright, i did some more testing. the one wire with the lowest voltage is the one connected to the headlight trigger wire. i traced the headlight trigger wire and find another connector under the tank. i test running ac voltage before and after the connector. before the connector voltage as ~5, and after the connector it was .5 or something insignificant. chop, solder. i test the headlight trigger wire at the connector going into the fuse box, and its now ~5v, but no headlights.
now i'm curious why the voltage is at 5, when it used to be closer to 6 or 7. i go back and test all three wires close to the rectifier, and i'm now getting 8, 8 and 5. i'm currently charging the battery to try again, but for some reason losing half the voltage from only starting the bike three times in a period of 8 hours doesnt seem right. could soldering the wires together have caused this?
could someone do me a huge favor and test the running ac voltage at the 3 pin plug coming from the stator? all three pins.
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frEEk
Administrator
ummm... yeah
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posted October 28, 2011 08:49 AM
Here's something I found written about a kawasaki atv. I would think the same holds true here: "The stator output will be from around 17 to 73 or more VAC, rpm dependent." Note it is AC out the stator. Probably more important to get the voltage out the regulator/rectifier. I'm not certain but pretty sure output form the regulator should be ~14V.
I can't help but think you have this good ol' problem: http://kawasakiworld.com/zx-12r/28775-stator-connector-no-headligths-fix-new-pics.html Great instruction set there. And seeing those pics I do remember, I did solder on a replacement relay onto my fuse box.
BTW, if the rectifier/regulator proves gone, there are universal aftermarket MOSFET units that claim to be more efficient (and therefore cooler) and run only $120.
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JoeGibs
Novice Class
Posts: 73
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posted October 28, 2011 09:28 AM
that's the exact thread i found that started me on the right path. however i replaced the entire junction box. now the relay in this new box could also be bad, but since i did that i found another issue. like i said in the last post, i found a connector under the tank that had voltage before it, but much much less after. i cut that connector off and soldered it solid. i'm tempted to take the headlight trigger wire and connect it to one of the other stator wires to see if maybe one of the stator wires voltage has dropped too low to provide enough voltage for the relay to trigger.
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tuusinii
Pro
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posted October 28, 2011 10:30 AM
Not having my service manual in front of me (You could check online version floating arounf) but anyway from the stator it should be the same voltage across all three phases and the voltage should be more than 5 volts. So I thinks that Your stator is toast. Try connecting the trigger wire for different phase and se if the lights come up... Did You check the resistance on the stator? It should be couple ohms, not 0 or open.
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frEEk
Administrator
ummm... yeah
Posts: 9660
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posted October 28, 2011 02:33 PM
I know when I had issues (tho the symptom was no system charging) the stator was gone. Thought initially just the melted rectifier plug, but that didnt fix it. Assume having the stator trying to make power but pumping it into a dead end probably killed it. I hope it isnt your stator, cause that is a pricey piece. Make sure you test the stator voltage in AC mode.
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JoeGibs
Novice Class
Posts: 73
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posted October 28, 2011 05:51 PM
the stator seems to be working, the charging system is holding strong at 14.5v while running. when i get time tomorrow i'm going to try taking the headlight trigger wire and attach it to a different stator wire and see if it does anything differently. if not, i'm going to either eliminate that headlight trigger wire and wire something up of my own, or find a different place to get a trigger for the headlights.
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JoeGibs
Novice Class
Posts: 73
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posted October 30, 2011 02:50 PM
verdict is in. i took the headlight trigger wire off the stator wire that it was connected to and touched it to a different stator wire, headlights came right on. this tells me the stator is on its way out, so i'll need to keep an eye on the voltage until it completely dies out. i never would have guessed the stator was the culprit to this problem. also sucks that its going out at 13000 miles, but then again when i picked up this bike it was wrecked and the case was smashed wide open. could have been damaged from day 1.
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Michaels12
Novice Class
Posts: 43
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posted November 01, 2011 03:17 PM
simple....lable the three yellows off the stator A B C. check the voltage at 85-120 VAC, between any two
while running at 4000 RPM.
Id try to find an OEM because the output of the "ricks " is slightly lower than stock.
Ive read that ricks does have a MOSFET? regulator that is more efficient and has a better output from the rectifier...
If your stator output is low.....youll end up stranded somewhere.....like me 
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tuusinii
Pro
Posts: 1031
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posted November 01, 2011 10:37 PM
Good You figured it out, but I would also be looking for a new stator ASAP. No fun being left somewhere in the middle of nowwhere when the next phase fails...
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