Y2KZX12R
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posted February 07, 2008 04:33 AM
CNC ported zx12r head....
We have started development on a CNC ported head for the 12r.
I have a few questions and decisions to make.
How many of you with 1360-1427 engines would be more concerned with power above 7500 vs power thruout the powerband?
In otherwords would you guys be willing to trade off some midrange for additioal power up top?
I know my self with the 1375, I'm willing to trade off some.
Also, are there many people that would want a stage 1 for a 1199-1290 engine?
I'm just trying to get a feal for what you guys would want for your 12r's.
Thanks
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shane661
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posted February 07, 2008 05:21 AM
I would be very interested in a stage 1 head. I have heard that the 12 has a pretty decent head in stock form...do you think you will see significant gains on the stage 1?
Shane
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entropy
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posted February 07, 2008 05:53 AM
Jim,
you KNOW what I want for my 1427: hp @ 9000-11500rpm, really couldn't care less what happens at mid and lo rpm. It has so much lo-mid hp, I don't need any more for a track only bike.
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psycho1122
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posted February 07, 2008 07:19 AM
Jim;
I am definately interested in a head that would take advantage of my 1270 w/ 14:1 CR.
I am also concidering running an extended RPM limit to 12,500 max.
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oldkawboy
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posted February 07, 2008 07:40 AM
Jim,
I'm gonna freshen up the old 12 with a 1270-1290 kit. I just got a set of Muzzy cams from Karl, have an extended ECU and a new Muzzy Pro Pipe.
What do you suggest? It's gonna be a mile only bike but I do need the good acceleration.
Dan
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Dane
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posted February 07, 2008 03:08 PM
 Edited By: Dane on 7 Feb 2008 15:10
I'm interested, ........
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chavcat
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posted February 07, 2008 06:14 PM
I'm interested in a 1290 set up.
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Y2KZX12R
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posted February 07, 2008 06:22 PM
quote:
I would be very interested in a stage 1 head. I have heard that the 12 has a pretty decent head in stock form...do you think you will see significant gains on the stage 1?
Yes the 12r head is excelent stock. Its much better than a Busa head and the zx14 head isnt as good as a busa head. So that should tell you somthing.
For a stock displacement, stock cammed zx12r, I dont see much reason to do more than "clean up" the ports. not that i dont want to sell CNc ported heads but theres not much bang for the buck there.
With a 1270 and an extended ECU and maybe cams.... well thats another story.
And a stroker will certainally bennifit.
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Y2KZX12R
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posted February 07, 2008 06:36 PM
Dan, I have to do some math and velocity calcs to see what size ports will work best for the big bores. Were just lighting this candle now. Its gonna take some testing, probing, velocity mapping etc to nail it down.
The busas wide range in possable displacement requires 3 ports to cover the spectrum of 1299-1700cc. The 12r is typically 1199-1427cc range so there will most likely be just two ports needed.
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Y2KZX12R
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oldkawboy
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posted February 07, 2008 07:14 PM
No hurry on my end Jim, I'm just picking up parts when good deals come along.
Dan
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KZScott
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posted February 07, 2008 07:19 PM
Jim, how does nitrous affect the best port design? is it best to have a slightly larger exhaust port than one would normally use for x displacement if substantial spray was going to be used? just curious... for example, VH's 150 shot on a stock displacement motor. would that work best with stage 1 intakes and stage 2 exhausts? (hoping to clear up something i read awhile back)
thx!
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01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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Y2KZX12R
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posted February 08, 2008 04:09 AM
Edited By: Y2KZX12R on 8 Feb 2008 04:10
Scott, turbo and heavy nitrous bikes need to get the extra volume out so in general, they like a better flowing port, but flow numbers on exhaust ports are tricky. We test at very high test pressures on the exhaust ports and look for flow seperation and turbulance with a pitot probe. Pressure bias is key.
But thats all I really want to say on that. Sorry.
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Y2KZX12R
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KZScott
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posted February 08, 2008 06:15 AM
thx Jim, thats all i really needed, I dont need to how how you do it, just that you can 
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01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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Y2KZX12R
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posted February 10, 2008 04:10 AM
On another note, due to the limitations of cam selection by the "small" zx12r bucket we will be offering over size bucket options as well.
I've been simulating cam profiles on the 1375 with the CNC ported head and like what i'm seeing. However we will be boring for bigger buckets.
The busa bucket at 28mm or a Kibble White bucket at 28.5mm will allow much bigger cams to be run with the same durability of a stock lobe profile on a stock size bucket.
This will allow us to offer some radical cam profiles for the 12r that were not possable before. This combo of CNC ported head, big buckets, matched cams, extended rev ECU Gas ported CP pistons, at 1375cc should make some serious HP.
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Y2KZX12R
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entropy
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posted February 10, 2008 06:10 AM
hey Jim,
speaking from experience i wish i didn't have, I'd advise initially boring to busa size 28mm, so that in case of misfortune, you can still go to 28.5.
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Y2KZX12R
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posted February 10, 2008 07:48 AM
Yea, good idea Karl. Do you know how close your cams come to the bucket edge?
If not, its easy, you can put some dykem on the bucket and rotate the assembly and take a measurement.
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KZScott
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posted February 10, 2008 09:03 AM
expirience, something you get right after you actually need it....
so what are the limits(cams size) of stock buckets ?
also, what are the limits on non gas ported pistons? im planning on running some nitrous on 86mm pistons(stock stroke for this rebuild) with an extended rev limit like Karl (12500)
thx!
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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entropy
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posted February 11, 2008 12:41 AM
quote:
Yea, good idea Karl. Do you know how close your cams come to the bucket edge?
If not, its easy, you can put some dykem on the bucket and rotate the assembly and take a measurement.
I don't know how close, but i'll try the Dychem. Good idea!
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Y2KZX12R
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posted February 17, 2008 05:52 AM
If you look closely at a used bucket you can see the wear pattern.... you can see an aproximation of how close it gets.
You can also see if a bucket came from the exhaust cam or intake cam.
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supra5677
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posted February 18, 2008 10:14 AM
Hey Y2K.. I just picked up a box stock 01 zx12r with a fresh engine.. I'm trying to squeeze the most out of it with the stock exhaust, cams etc. (similar to what you did).. With an extended rev limiter and timing via RR you think you can do something with the head from 7500 to 12,200 Rpm's?
supra
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Y2KZX12R
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posted February 18, 2008 05:42 PM
We did the stage 2 head first for the 12r, which is designed for the 1375+ engines.
But the Stage 1 will be intended for 1199-1320 engines. You may see a small loss of power on the 1199cc engine below 4500 rpm but there should be nice gains above 8000 all the way to the limiter.
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supra5677
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posted February 19, 2008 08:46 AM
how much gain in RWHP?
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KZScott
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posted February 19, 2008 12:34 PM
i doubt the design and testing is done yet....
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01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
|
Y2KZX12R
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posted February 19, 2008 05:40 PM
Supra, its hard to say at this point what the hp gain will be.
I'm going to be ready to make chips next week with the stage 2.
I'm also boring out the head for 28mm (busa) buckets so I can run custom ground "special"  cams.
This first stage 2 head will go on my own personal bike. Its a 1375, and it will have a fresh set of custom lateral gas ported CP pistons.
It should make some steam.
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Hells Dark Lord
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posted February 19, 2008 05:51 PM
if i were going to do this mod it would be on my stock motor. I would want to go for HP/TQ throughout the RM range. Something with a little more cam, better air flow, and adjustable cam sprockets.
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When in doubt, lean farther and go faster....
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