matt sterbator
Pro
Hiding in the bushes
Posts: 1367
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posted October 20, 2007 04:49 PM
quote:
quote:
yes but as rpm increases the spark has to start earlier to keep up right?
Problem is When you reached the Point of Diminishing Returns! Firing soo early that the Explosion is resisting the upward movement of the Piston! A few degrees may be good but more may be bad! This issue is always a Compromise and part of that is Fuel economy, Power and Torque
Ummm... isn't that called pre-ignition, otherwise known as detonation. Ya know, the stuff that puts holes in pistons.
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bigbore4
Zone Head
Posts: 806
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posted October 20, 2007 08:32 PM
Pre ignition is not the same as Detonation. Both are destructive, but preignition is caused by ignition source other than spark, such as Hot carbon or problems in the squish area of chamber. Detonation is intiated by spark and agravated by lean conditions or high chamber temps.
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Y2KZX12R
Needs a job
CompetitionCNC.com
Posts: 3762
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posted October 21, 2007 04:00 AM
quote:
Pre ignition is not the same as Detonation. Both are destructive, but preignition is caused by ignition source other than spark, such as Hot carbon or problems in the squish area of chamber. Detonation is intiated by spark and agravated by lean conditions or high chamber temps.
+1
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Y2KZX12R
CompetitionCNC.com
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Y2KZX12R
Needs a job
CompetitionCNC.com
Posts: 3762
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posted October 21, 2007 11:36 AM
Just as a reference, my bike as delivered with several hundred miles on it made 162 hp.
After I did a lot of modifications but no aftermarket parts it made 172. Now it when it made the 162 it was making 178 like kawi says it was supposed to then thats a 16 hp difference from countershaft to rear wheel. So that would make the bike 188 countershaft hp after the mods. None of these figures factor in ramair.
Now Doug M. went 199 on a bike with a muzzy pipe that dynoed 175 hp (or there abouts if i remember correctly) so that would put my bike with the mods but NO aftermarket parts at about 197 mph.
I'll bet on 197 mph is about all you will see without changing the primairy pipe diameter and length reguardless of the muffler mods it has on it.
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Y2KZX12R
CompetitionCNC.com
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Phantom13
Zone Head
Posts: 736
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posted October 22, 2007 12:55 PM
If anyone is going to do it.... it's someone the size and skill of Ali Abubakar or Chad Millholland.
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supra5677
Pro
Posts: 1279
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posted October 22, 2007 01:08 PM
To Y2K what about with 1000 more revs and the pre production 45 tooth?
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shiphteey
Needs a job
Posts: 2529
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posted October 22, 2007 03:54 PM
I could volunteer doing it on video. There is a spot I found 2 hours from my house....about 10+ miles of flat roads....about 1 mile intervals till a hill or bend but it could prove a good spot. Seems a couple hundred feet above sea level.
I still have my stock pipe that I'm supposed to send off to jagrates that I still haven't gotten around to yet (now that the season is over I can get to it!).
I still have my stock rubber boots for the intake side.
I'd need to get a hold of the ecu since my ecu is now the 600 rpm extended version as well as stock filters. Would "no" filters or BMCs be fair in doing this test?
I'd also need to get a hold of stock wheels...and we would all need to agree on a tire, presumably the latest 200 series tire made for a 12? I know Warp12 still has Vincent Hill's old Dunlop 208...not sure how worn it is....that would obviously affect mph up top a little.
How about clutch set up? I'm on a muzzy set-up...would that be "fair" in this test?
I can go back to stock bodywork minus the rear fender, signals and mirrors.
A cool, dry winter day sounds like a plan!
We would also need to agree on a fuel type...presumably 93 pump but any brand? I'm on stock injectors and still have my stock fuel pump laying around.
FWIW, 18/45 gearing at Maxton, and usually do when spraying...a little past 12k indicated and its a 200+ mph run....11,8s usually yield high 190s.
I would need a witness or at least someone videoing the run. My motor has stiffer valve springs in it presently which actually puts me down an hp or so theoretically but makes it safer spinning higher RPMs.
Whatever, I'm game....let me know wussup!
A.
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Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
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shiphteey
Needs a job
Posts: 2529
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posted October 22, 2007 03:57 PM
BTW, I too have heard from several people that too much advance up top is no good....marginal diminishing returns and it can actually rob a little HP....but since RR said it has -3 degrees already from the factory then adding 3 degrees pretty much sets it back to 0???
FWIW I run +5 up to about 8k...then -3 all the way to the rev limiter (since I spray higher RPMS). I would taper the advance like greenmamba1 did on 12.org but haven't gotten around to it (+1 advance till 2-3k....then +2 till 4k or so, peaking at 5 from maybe 5-10...then back DOWN the numbers to 1 I believe at super high rpms).
A.
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Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
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supra5677
Pro
Posts: 1279
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posted October 22, 2007 06:59 PM
After testing out the ecu today I can almost but certainly say the bike will do 198 plus with stock exhaust.. go ram air to 12600rpm, ignition to 12600, and fuel to 12600rpms, Ignition tapers off a lot in the ecu as the rpm's rise... might want to check with RR for the ecu changes.. Don't forget the 18/45 sprocket... I would keep the timing at +5 at least all the way to limiter.. (Brock Davidson used +7 at high revs)
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KZScott
Needs a life
high on speed
Posts: 7235
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posted October 22, 2007 08:39 PM
TRY IT! I want to see if its possible too lol 
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01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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shiphteey
Needs a job
Posts: 2529
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posted October 23, 2007 03:43 AM
Supra, what is your height/weight? Do you have a stock pipe around? Do you have a smooth, flat road where you are willing to risk life, limb, freedom and tons of fines for the greater good of "the people"? COME ON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
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supra5677
Pro
Posts: 1279
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posted October 23, 2007 06:11 AM
I'm 6'4 160 pounds.. No stock pipe.. I live in the San Francisco Bay Area.. I have a wife and child with 1 on the way... No way I'm I doing anything above a bill 75.. with the guys I ride with the first to 175 wins.. I just think the bike is capable with the stock pipe and ecu reflash..
supra
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psycho1122
Pro
Posts: 1608
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posted October 23, 2007 07:08 AM
Timing Advance (too much) + High Rpm + High Speed (5th. or 6th. gear) = Burned Piston!
Be careful!
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You say PSYCHO like it's a BAD thing!!
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