frEEk
Administrator
ummm... yeah
Posts: 9660
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posted August 28, 2006 04:36 PM
how many sets of brake rotors you gone thru?
i'm on my third set of front brake rotors and after my last trip they're warped... again. my stockers warped kinda soon (dont remember the mileage), then the replacements (EBC Prolites) warped after a year or so, and now the current replacement EBC Prolites (with the petal cutouts) warped, and it happened all in a day which seemed odd. and not a day of hard riding even.
so my point is, am i doin somethin weird or does the 12 just eat thru rotors?
   
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fish_antlers
Administrator
The Truth is Out There
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posted August 28, 2006 05:02 PM
 Edited By: fish_antlers on 28 Aug 2006 18:13
quote:
so my point is, am i doin somethin weird or does the 12 just eat thru rotors?
yes... you are doing something weird... as near as I can tell after riding with you and trading off with you, what you are doing is this: You are "lugging" your engine (or under revving it), therefore you have little to no engine braking when riding.
You do this as a force of habit to deal with the buggered fuel delivery on your bike, as it is essentially unrideable under normal operating conditions. To ride your bike smoothly, you are forced to take corners 1 or 2 gears higher than you would with a normal (properly tuned) bike.
What this creates is the 4 stroke equivalent of an unbelievably heavy 2 stroke (as 2 strokes have no compression braking), forcing your front brakes to do all of the stopping work for your 12R.
If your FI was sorted and your bike was rideable I suspect that you would naturally grow to ride the bike "normally", but in it's current state of tune (or lack of) I'd hazard to say that that is going to be next to impossible.
I'm 110% sure of my diagnosis. I'm not saying this to be insulting, so dont take it the wrong way. Before I traded off with you I didnt understand, but now I do.
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What business is it of yours where I'm from, Friendo?
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CrotchRocket
Moderator
Bracket Racing with Betsy
Posts: 8038
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posted August 28, 2006 05:19 PM
Edited By: CrotchRocket on 28 Aug 2006 18:19
On my 2000 they warped after 2000 miles...Got new ones from the dealer under warrentee 
No problem with my 2002...I'm so glad I bought the 2002, it's soo much better than the 2000...
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Jason Miller StreetBike Seminars
*****DragRacers do it better, because they dont cut Corners*****
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frEEk
Administrator
ummm... yeah
Posts: 9660
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posted August 28, 2006 05:27 PM
quote:
yes... you are doing something weird... as near as I can tell after riding with you and trading off with you, what you are doing is this: You are "lugging" your engine (or under revving it), therefore you have little to no engine braking when riding.
yah cept i dont use the brakes all that hard. fact is, except for the relatively rare cases where i'm really pushing it, i hardley use the brakes at all. like on this trip, sicne it was all long distances and mainly straight roads, the brakes hardley got touched.
CR< i dont' get that cause as far as i know the brakes were not changed until the 2004 came out with radial.
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CrotchRocket
Moderator
Bracket Racing with Betsy
Posts: 8038
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posted August 28, 2006 05:59 PM
I dont know either...Maybe different pads or just one of those things???
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Jason Miller StreetBike Seminars
*****DragRacers do it better, because they dont cut Corners*****
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aliveagain
Needs a life
Posts: 5033
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posted August 28, 2006 06:11 PM
Maybe it's time to look at your caliper pistons.
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I wondered why the baseball kept getting bigger. Then it hit me.
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fish_antlers
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The Truth is Out There
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posted August 28, 2006 06:51 PM
Edited By: fish_antlers on 28 Aug 2006 19:51
it's because of what I said... really... you guys dont "get" his riding style... he rides the bike under 5 grand.
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What business is it of yours where I'm from, Friendo?
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wannabe
Pro
Posts: 1931
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posted August 28, 2006 07:29 PM
Still on my first set of rotors on my 2001. (of course, I only have a little over 2100 full throttle miles on the bike.)
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frEEk
Administrator
ummm... yeah
Posts: 9660
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posted August 28, 2006 07:59 PM
quote:
Maybe it's time to look at your caliper pistons.
don't think so. on my second set of calipers too.
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zx12mark
Pro
Posts: 1654
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posted August 28, 2006 08:04 PM
35,000 miles on original set....zx12 caliper pistons stick alot.they will heat up your rotors...do you get caught in the rain alot or wash the bike when you just get off it.
old Chinese saying--------cold water hitting hot rotors = ruffle potato chip rotors.
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frEEk
Administrator
ummm... yeah
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posted August 28, 2006 09:10 PM
hm, that may just be it. i was fine some 1500kms into my trip, then spent half a day riding thru rain, heavy at times, and the next day i found the front end was shaking under brakes. weird thing is, i hardly touched the brakes during the rain cause it was all, as mentioned, straight roads with little to no traffic. there was simply nothing to slow down for. unless they went from perfectly smooth to badly warped in one or 2 stops (and not exactly emergency stops at that)...
i just find this all very frustrating. i'm really picky on brakes, i like them to be electric smooth and i can't seem to get any love from the stoppers.
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Y2KZX12R
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posted August 29, 2006 02:11 AM
Edited By: Y2KZX12R on 29 Aug 2006 03:14
I have 19,000 very hard street miles on my 2000 and never replaced the rotors or calipers.
At times I get them so hot you can smell them. I'm on the 3rd set of EBC H-H pads, so I get about 6,000 miles on a set and there gone.
This past winter I disassembled the calipers and cleaned them and there was some signs of slight corrosion around the outer seals but it never caused a problem.
When you are transporting the front wheel around off the bike for tire service are you laying the front wheel down on the rotor? I always lay the back on the chain side and prop up the front so neither rotor gets bent.
I dont know but somthing doesnt sound right.
So you never rev the engine above 5,000 rpm? Thats funny, I never let it get below 5,000 rpm. 
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psycho1122
Pro
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posted August 29, 2006 06:42 AM
Brake Tech.......Done!
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You say PSYCHO like it's a BAD thing!!
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GUNNER
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posted August 29, 2006 07:05 AM
Freek..........It sounds like you have a caliper problem. We kill the brakes down here at places like the GAP and never smoke a rotor. I think Dan killed a set at Maxton once but that's very tough on the binders there. You have a problem for sure that's not normal. How free will your wheel spin at it best when the rotors aren't warped?
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aliveagain
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posted August 29, 2006 08:16 AM
Except for at the track,I rarely see over 5 grand and I never had a problem yet.That's something to think about as far as when to wash.I never thought about that.Are you positive there isn't any air in the lines?
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I wondered why the baseball kept getting bigger. Then it hit me.
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tuusinii
Pro
Posts: 1031
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posted August 29, 2006 11:01 AM
I'd also suspect the calipers but maybe it's got something to do with Your disk-brake pad set not working together? I'm now on 96k km(60k miles) with original disks. The pads have been changed many times with KHI pads and my disks are still straight!
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VincentHill
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posted August 29, 2006 11:26 AM
8,000 Miles of which about 1000 are racing and Using Ferodo Pads no problems and the 2000 Zx12R were for the more Highly skilled riders then they fixed the bike so everyone could ride it 
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Made History @ Daytona and still one fast old man!!
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frEEk
Administrator
ummm... yeah
Posts: 9660
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posted August 29, 2006 11:40 AM
damn, obviosuly there is something wrong with my setup. but i'm on a second set of calipers and a second set of forks, so it seems unliekly that it's any of those items. maybe it's just a matter of (occasionally) riding and (frequently) storing in the rain that kills it. how frustrating.
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aliveagain
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posted August 29, 2006 12:03 PM
I would like to know what you use to clean the front wheel assembly.I'm curious to see if it's acidic and causing corrosion to set in.That would explain multiple caliper failures.
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I wondered why the baseball kept getting bigger. Then it hit me.
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frEEk
Administrator
ummm... yeah
Posts: 9660
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posted August 29, 2006 03:00 PM
clean? what's that?
first calpers didn't fail per se, but running the bike thru winter (ie. salt) meant the calipers became permanently filthy, plus the aluminium fitting washers corroded right thru, draining the brakes completely.
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sagot
Zone Head
Posts: 779
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posted August 29, 2006 08:45 PM
Have you checked the hub? How about the pistons - are they siezed? Sometimes you can't fix them even if you pull it all apart completely.
Clean it - trade it - dual sport!
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Blank
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frEEk
Administrator
ummm... yeah
Posts: 9660
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posted August 29, 2006 11:22 PM
don't think it's pistons/calipers cause of being on the second set. the hub? no idea. wouldnt know what to look for even. but even if so, why would they have gone bad so quickly? and they'r enote exactly a little warped. things shudder like a harley.
dual sport... yah, now there is a sensible thing to do  i gotta make me some money so i can do exactly that. get a nice GS1200 or 990 adventure or something and spend a year on the road.
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Y2KZX12R
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posted August 30, 2006 04:31 AM
What is the runout on the rotors? Verrify that the rotors are even warped before you go nutz.
Do I right on the bike and that will check the wheel (hub) runout at the same time.
Are you adjusting the spacing on the front axle assy per the manual? If you have an older manual there is an addendum to it.
If you dont have it i can email it to you.
In short you need a gap between the spacer and the fork. See the manual.....
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Y2KZX12R
CompetitionCNC.com
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frEEk
Administrator
ummm... yeah
Posts: 9660
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posted August 30, 2006 11:16 AM
re the gap, the dealership always does that stuff for me, so i assume so.
havent checked runout yet. if it's not warped, there's defintiely something wrong there cause it sure as hell shakes under braking.
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Y2KZX12R
Needs a job
CompetitionCNC.com
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posted August 30, 2006 01:11 PM
Do you have a manual?
I wouldnt assume it. They probabily wouldnt know what you were talking about.
Do you have a dial indicator?
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