entropy
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posted July 31, 2006 12:39 AM
major differences between 00/01 & 02/03 motors???
I understand that 00 & 01 motors are basically the same, and that 02 & 03 are basically the same (true???)
If this is mostly true, does anyone know what the major difference is between 00/01 & 02/03 motors??
I know anout the cam sensor issue, any others??
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ninja12
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posted July 31, 2006 10:36 AM
Let me start with my .02 first.
I know they changed the cases to support the larger oil view window,
and I believe they addressed the #3 rod issue.
02 crank is a heavier design, and may help with the #3 problem.
Rods changed to use a different bearing.
Minor changes to the charging system.
And the exhaust cam pick-up moved for the new ECU.
All parts are interchangeable with little or no mods
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osti33
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posted July 31, 2006 01:12 PM
Cylinder head motor mounts are also different from 00-01 and 02-03.
Other than that I think Ninja12 pretty much covered it.
"All parts will interchange with little or no mods". That is correct. I am currently running 00 rods on my 02 crank in my 02 cases...
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entropy
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posted August 01, 2006 02:51 AM
thanks!
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TRNorBRN6001
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posted August 01, 2006 04:57 AM
I also think starter gear might be thicker?
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worm~hole
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posted August 01, 2006 09:40 AM
 Edited By: worm~hole on 1 Aug 2006 10:41
..sorry for the hi-jack, but in the same spirit: what woukd I need to do to swap over the '05 front fork/radial brake assembly in place of the assembly on my '00?
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blitzkrieg
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posted August 01, 2006 06:47 PM
For the record, it wasn't a heavier crank.
Look towards the flywheel and you'll be on the right track. 
Also, that has nothing to do with the #3 bearing failure. Kawasaki gave a blanket "Improved oil distribution" advertising speel on the B model but I did and still do consider that a knee-jerk reaction to all the negative publicity they were getting over the now aging zx-11's that were regularly blowing #3 main out.
$5 Blitz bucks for the first guy that can answer what the true problem with the zx-11 is.
Insufficiently chamfered oil ports are 2nd so don't go there.
In all honesty I've seen/known of more B1 and 2's that have split a lung than A1 and 2's.
Production #'s probably account for that for the most part, but...
Don't kid yourself that the B model is a superior bike. Kawasaki made a boatload of really, really little changes throughout the history of the bike and the motor had several characteristics throughout it's production run:
1) It does NOT like to be run low on oil.
2) If you open it up, you better be hanging on.
Peace. Blitz. 
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blueford
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posted August 01, 2006 07:47 PM
Lets put aside the A1 clutch problem ...OK,
So in the history of all autos and motorcycle models, this one time, the subsequent model is inferior to the first version.
Hello, new bees, whatever Blitz runs, is the cat's meow!!! 
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blitzkrieg
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posted August 01, 2006 08:07 PM
You don't know shit about the A1 clutch problem BF.
If you do. explain the real cause.? We are waiting. I am waiting.
And you are right, I have an R1 too, and it's not too bad.
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ninja12
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posted August 02, 2006 04:18 AM
quote:
For the record, it wasn't a heavier crank.
I disagree.
Although I have not actually put them on a scale,
Look at the starter gear on both and you will know.
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five 0
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posted August 02, 2006 10:23 AM
Crank is thicker on the 02 and up!!!
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ninja12
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posted August 02, 2006 10:45 AM
Can someone explain to me why the change in rod bearings.
Other than the thickness of the retainer tab i don't see a change in the rods.
In my mind it would have made more sence to increase the tab to prevent
spinning in the rod, but Kaw went smaller. Are the 02 rods lighter or something?
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VincentHill
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posted August 02, 2006 12:37 PM
Edited By: VincentHill on 2 Aug 2006 13:39
Ninja 12 did a good job but the Stator Rotor in the Charging system is a Lot different! The Rotor is very small and a lot lighter in weight and makes the 00 & 01 rev like a 2 stroke!
The 02 crankshaft weighs more than the 00 & 01 for more Tractable power
Blitz, on the ZX11 and earlier engines, the problem with losing the #3 crank is sort of 3 fold and sort of Chicken vs the Egg.
The oil line from the Oil pump going to #1 and #2 is about 1 inch long. In the middle of that line at 90 degree angle they brazed another line that is about 6 inches long that turns down to rest on the Oil pan floor then up about3 inches to the #3 & #4 mains to lube #3 & #4 rods. This is part of the problem.
Next is the Oil return Passages in the ZX11 are not very big and it does not take long for the oil to be on top of the engine and not in the crank case. Add to this like doing a wheelie and you will Port the Oil Pick up and the Air bubble will enter the Oil lines. Since there is about 6 inches for the Oil to travel to 3 & 4 and only 1 inch to get to 1 & 2, they are starved for Oil a lot shorter time when the Oil supply is returned!.
Last is the Location of the Counter Balancer. It is near the Oil Pump and is whipping around in the oil creating Oil foam which can also starve the Oil Pump more so with some oil brands than others.
To me, these are the reasons the ZX11 style engines have the #3 problem dating back to 1984 with the first water cooled Kawasaki in- line 4 engine.
Working on my ZX12 I enlarged the Oil return passages to the Crank case in front of the engine. I think Kawasaki would have been better off if they has at least 1 passage at the Back of the engine for Wheelies or Hard Acceleration and the front ones for Braking!
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osti33
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posted August 02, 2006 01:19 PM
quote:
Can someone explain to me why the change in rod bearings.
Other than the thickness of the retainer tab i don't see a change in the rods.
In my mind it would have made more sence to increase the tab to prevent
spinning in the rod, but Kaw went smaller. Are the 02 rods lighter or something?
I have a set of 00 and a set of 02 rods. I can't tell them apart. I haven't weighed them to see if they are different or not. When I get the 00 rods back I can weigh one of each and find out for you.
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gebla
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posted August 02, 2006 10:08 PM
Can you recognize from the outside which engine is what year?
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osti33
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posted August 02, 2006 10:46 PM
Edited By: osti33 on 2 Aug 2006 23:49
quote:
Can you recognize from the outside which engine is what year?
Motor mounts are a dead giveaway for 00-01 and for the 02-up.
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gebla
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posted August 02, 2006 11:04 PM
quote:
Motor mounts are a dead giveaway for 00-01 and for the 02-up.
Could you explain the differences?
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ninja12
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posted August 03, 2006 03:53 AM
the 00-01 have holes for mounting near the outer edge of the head around #1 and #4 exhaust.
02 up have the mounting holes in the center near #2 and #3 exhaust.
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VincentHill
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posted August 03, 2006 07:40 AM
I am still waiting to hear from Blitz!!
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bossman12r
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posted August 04, 2006 12:56 PM
So I cant use a 00-01 rod mixed in with 3 02 rods?
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gebla
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posted August 05, 2006 12:26 AM
Edited By: gebla on 5 Aug 2006 01:26
quote:
the 00-01 have holes for mounting near the outer edge of the head around #1 and #4 exhaust.
02 up have the mounting holes in the center near #2 and #3 exhaust.
Good news, then I purchased a 2002 model engine. After 3 weeks I may be able to drive again this weekend with this new engine.
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ninja12
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posted August 07, 2006 06:46 AM
quote:
So I cant use a 00-01 rod mixed in with 3 02 rods?
I would not.
IF you "must" i would weight them or try to use two of each.
Talk to doug meyer about how to use two different weight rods.
I had to use 2 'j' rods and 2 'k' rods when Kaw decided to quit making the 'j' rods.
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