wylde
Expert Class
Posts: 371
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posted June 22, 2006 03:56 PM
Muzzy or OEM ??
im sure you guys have tried every possible configuration,, what is the best setup (clutch) period.. for a street bike that is riden hard,, possibly launched at the track once in a while,,but ran hard otherwise??
i keep hearing about guys using lock ups with soft springs,, others say use 02 hub w/ 636 springs,,and muzzy plates,, whats the real deal??
do you guys notice the free play taken away when hot,, and how many of you are on top of free play to avoid the burnt clutch scenario,, any pointers are appreciated,, my brother just went through another clutch and its only been a few months??
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There you go again,,NOT being aware of yourself !
  
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countersteer
Needs a job
Didn't read the owners manual
Posts: 2207
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posted June 22, 2006 05:52 PM
eh
i went with the muzzys plate kit with the hub + springs
didnt go with basket
clutches are definetly a "wearable" maintenance thing
im about to have to buy a third clutch- my shit is not as tight as it used to be...
if i am in first with the clutch pulled in @ a light, and i race the engine, she lurches foward a little bit at high rpm..... and also when im in first and shift to second on high rpm, she sometimes slips into neutral...... thinking the hub is pretty worn and plates are getting crispy... but anyhow, i think you ought to be fine with muzzys
http://www.muzzys.com/MZ12-CK/index.html
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Scott
Long Island, New York
2006 ZX-14, 2003 ZX-12R
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wylde
Expert Class
Posts: 371
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posted June 22, 2006 07:08 PM
yea,, talked to some guy at muzzys today,, $325.00 isnt bad,, hows the install fairly easy,, ?
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CrotchRocket
Moderator
Bracket Racing with Betsy
Posts: 8038
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posted June 22, 2006 07:10 PM
Happy Reading...This should answer all your questions!!!
Also, the 12 clutch is sensitive to stack height when fibers wear down...So if you use 11 fibers and 10 2.0 steels, your clutch will start to slip when the fibers are worn...If you use 12 fibers and 11 1.6 steels your clutch lasts longer because the stack height is higher and when the fibers wear down, it takes longer to slip because the greater stack height gives more pressure onto the clutch pack!!!
http://www.bikeland.org/board/viewthread.php?FID=13&TID=17845
Remember the 12 cannot be slow riden!!!...Meaning, riding around in a parking lot while the clutch is half way out and riding the rear brake heats the clutch up and destroys the fibers...ask me how I know!!!
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Jason Miller StreetBike Seminars
*****DragRacers do it better, because they dont cut Corners*****
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wylde
Expert Class
Posts: 371
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posted June 22, 2006 08:48 PM
Hey Rocket,, excellent and informative reading bro!,,, if by some chance anyone can add to this thread has the pics of the drilling that was done,, so much talk of drilling,,could mistake you guys for roughnecks,, but if anyone has those pics and has the time to post em,, that would be cool so i can take a snapshot.. good reading material for when you cant ride because of busted ribs!
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lonniemac
Expert Class
Posts: 225
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posted June 23, 2006 07:11 AM
i have the muzzy clutch drilled hub and been running it since 2001. i am totaly happy with it it handles 200 hp with no problem. the only thing is i had to drill a 1/16 inch hole in the puller rod to get oil in the basket. then i used all 6 heavy springs . i race mostly, also i do not offset the last fiber. i line it up with the rest of them. this has been a very good setup and i feel that this is as good as an average dragrace bike. i get around 30 passes on the clutches. i dont wait until they slip before i change them.my rider is very good at launching though. the shaft is so hard with such a small bit i ground a hole with a grinder, wire weld it back closed and then drilled through the weld like slicing butter with a hot knife. i dont have pics but the drill ing is done only in the gap between the collars that is inside the basket when assembled.
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wylde
Expert Class
Posts: 371
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posted June 23, 2006 08:33 AM
Hey Crotch Rocket,,are you basically saying that no matter what year 12 you have ,,that the hot set up is to go with your basic STOCK 02 clutch setup??,, there is nothing out of the ordinary with the part numbers you posted right?,just go about ordering the clutch plates and springs etc.. as if i owned a 02 model correct??
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CrotchRocket
Moderator
Bracket Racing with Betsy
Posts: 8038
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posted June 23, 2006 09:39 AM
Exactly...Go to RonAyers.com and order those Part #s from the 2002 ZX12-b1...
While your at it order an extra hub nut too, always good to have!!!
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Jason Miller StreetBike Seminars
*****DragRacers do it better, because they dont cut Corners*****
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wylde
Expert Class
Posts: 371
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posted June 23, 2006 09:53 AM
 Edited By: wylde on 23 Jun 2006 11:27
Cool Thanx Bro,, my brothers been nagging me,, i guess his just took a shit..
Back in the day,, ive changed the clutches on my CBX,, 20 years later,, how difficult of a task is it,, is there a thread anywhere,, i do have the download ed service manual,, is there a trick to stack height,, or is it cut and dry,, just change out parts and adjust free play??
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There you go again,,NOT being aware of yourself !
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CrotchRocket
Moderator
Bracket Racing with Betsy
Posts: 8038
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posted June 23, 2006 03:51 PM
The most important thing to do when you remove the clutch cover, springs, pressure plate with washer and needle bearings, clutch plates, hub and washer behind it - is to remember how they came out - set them down seperately in the order you took them out including the bolts!!!
Put the new fiber plates in oil over night before you put them in the bike!!!...Dont forget to take off all the cosmolene off the steel plates by using brake cleaner and a shop towel then clean off the lint and put the steels in oil too...
When you put the clutch plates in remember that the steel plates go in with the round edge in towards the motor - sharp edge facing you!!!...When you put the pressure plate on make sure its flush against the friction plate, if not then remove it turn it, then re install until it's flush against the friction...The rest is easy ...
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Jason Miller StreetBike Seminars
*****DragRacers do it better, because they dont cut Corners*****
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wylde
Expert Class
Posts: 371
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posted June 23, 2006 04:39 PM
Edited By: wylde on 23 Jun 2006 17:44
Outstanding,,,just what i was looking for!! guess i get to use my bro bike to practice on! LOL!
I really appreciate the info,, very articulate.. Thanx again Vic
At the risk of sounding like an idiot,, as far as the cable ,,it will only go on one way correct,,as long as free play is where its supposed to be right?? which is about 1/8 inch??
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There you go again,,NOT being aware of yourself !
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CrotchRocket
Moderator
Bracket Racing with Betsy
Posts: 8038
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posted June 23, 2006 09:08 PM
There is an adjustment for the clutch cable where it connects to the clutch rod on the clutch cover, that is where you really make the clutch cable adjustment...The dial on the clutch cable at the lever is for fine tunning the lever play!!!
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Jason Miller StreetBike Seminars
*****DragRacers do it better, because they dont cut Corners*****
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NOX
Needs a job
PMRA / TMRC Super Street 4022
Posts: 3745
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posted June 29, 2006 09:49 AM
Lock up........, fine tune it, and forget it..............
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42 Wins
21 Runner-ups
2010 TMRC Super Street Points Champion
2010 PMRA Super Street #3 Points
2009 PMRA Super Street Points Runner-Up
6 Time Centerville Dragway Points Champion
Sponsored by:
Scorpion Helmets
Galfer Braking
AMSOIL
Steve's Speed Shop
Kawasaki Sports Center
Mickey Thompson Tires
Catalyst Racing Composites
Conway Cycle
Syed Leathers
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wylde
Expert Class
Posts: 371
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posted June 29, 2006 02:12 PM
Edited By: wylde on 29 Jun 2006 15:19
NOX ,, are you saying fine tune a lock up for street use,, or strip?
Lonnie above posted something,,about offsetting one of the fiber plates,, whats that all about?? anyone.
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kawachan
Pro
Posts: 1031
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posted June 29, 2006 05:31 PM
Rick likes the 02 up setup. I personally think it works better to use the thicker steels and one less fiber. Thicker steels won't warp as easily as HEAT is what kills the clutch....IE hot-lapping it at the track, slipping the clutch a LOT, trying to impress your friends by doing a burnout (and you can't get the tire to spin), and other things such as dry-hopping it a few times before coming to the line and practicing the launch over and over again. Lack of oil in the clutch pack is not good at all either.
Let the clutch cool at least 20 min or so after a pass. I also tip the bike to the clutch side before a run and pull the clutch lever in a few times to get the fibers good and oiled. Flat-spotting the puller rod or drilling (EDM) a small hole in it (like Lonniemac said) will help keep the clutch oiled. If you have gone through that many clutches, it might be a GOOD idea for you to pull the pan and see if your oil pickup is clogged with all of that clutch residue. Pardon the pun, but more than a few 12's have been "clutched to death"
Lock up for strip??
Suggestion #1 would be for you to have a Muzzy or Falicon billet basket if you are racing the bike to any extent
636 springs are longer and stiffer, so they will help apply more pressure to the clutch. At higher RPM's where clutch slippage is more evident, that will pay dividends. One setback of that is that your clutch will require more pressure to operate.
Muzzy inner kit uses stock fibers. ONLY use stock fibers.
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RED NINJAS RULE!!
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NOX
Needs a job
PMRA / TMRC Super Street 4022
Posts: 3745
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posted June 30, 2006 05:31 AM
IF you run high clutch pressure, get a basket..........., for sure.........., initial load is what breaks the basket........
Lock up for strip only.............
I have had this bike since nov 2002, it has been raced all its life, does not get street ridden........
It has been in 14 events this year, and 11 finals , just this year alone, so you get an idea of how many passes this clutch has........, same plates and fibers that came off the show room,,,,,,,,,,
12s dont eat clutches if you tune them right....................
Hell, pro stock bike only uses like one set of fibers per season...............
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42 Wins
21 Runner-ups
2010 TMRC Super Street Points Champion
2010 PMRA Super Street #3 Points
2009 PMRA Super Street Points Runner-Up
6 Time Centerville Dragway Points Champion
Sponsored by:
Scorpion Helmets
Galfer Braking
AMSOIL
Steve's Speed Shop
Kawasaki Sports Center
Mickey Thompson Tires
Catalyst Racing Composites
Conway Cycle
Syed Leathers
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wezze93
Expert Class
Posts: 127
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posted July 02, 2006 09:16 PM
ok i have a mtc single stage lock-up on my turbo 12 an it make 330hp so what set-up do i need to run?an i need a good tire to run at 68 inches i dont like the m/t because it dont last it dont have to be a dot tire
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wezze93
Expert Class
Posts: 127
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posted July 04, 2006 10:08 AM
quote:
ok i have a mtc single stage lock-up on my turbo 12 an it make 330hp so what set-up do i need to run?an i need a good tire to run at 68 inches i dont like the m/t because it dont last it dont have to be a dot tire
need help
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lietoome
Needs a job
Posts: 2033
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posted July 06, 2006 05:40 PM
My stock clutch pack lasted 28K miles. Just installed the Vesrah complete clutch kit....very nice feel. I don't have a lot of experience with clutches, but the feel is better than the stock setup. Costs about $300 for springs, fibers, steels, and gasket. I was gonna go with the Muzzy kit, but some of the guys I know swear by the Vesrah(gixxers/zx10s). Not to mention, I couldn't find anyone with a 12 that has actually used them... so I thought I'd try it.
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