TedG
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posted January 14, 2008 10:42 AM
 Edited By: TedG on 14 Jan 2008 10:43
Helmet Modifications for Bluetooth and quiet
Well riding is pretty much impossible here at this time of year. So now is a good time to modify my helmet to do a few things.
When I bought the C14 I instantly noticed that my Arai Rx7RR Corsair seemed to be quite loud. I went in search of a quieter helmet, the first place I looked as to Arai because they fit me so well and their quality is second to none. Fine, so what is a quiet Arai? The consensus was that the Arai Profile was as quiet as anything out there. Fine again, so at Laguna I went to the Arai booth and talked to them about a quiet helmet, yet again the Profile came up and they said that the most important aspect of quiet was a perfect fit. OK so they fit me with a medium where I usually wear a large, I told them it was uncomfortably tight and they told me it would break in nicely. So I bought one and found that not only was the thing as loud if not louder than my RX7rr but after an hour my head was aching from the helmet being too small. I suffered through a long break in and it still was painful after 2 hours. The good thing about Arai is that you can get different size pads, so I got a thinner upper pad and the thing was day and night, very comfortable.
So now I have a comfortable helmet and still it is loud. at least in my opinion. So now that I have an Iphone which has a built in ipod, this would be a good time to add Bluetooth to the helmet and also figure out a way to quiet it down.
The problem with that Arai is that just below the ears the padding does not close around your head and wind noise come in big time. Placing your hand in the area really reduces the noise. So closing the holes seems to be the answer.
So all that being said, what is the best Bluetooth stereo setup to use and what to use to full the padding around the ears to quiet things down.
Any thoughts or recommendations out there? Because I spend many hours on this thing some tunes in the helmet, the ability to answer the phone, and most importantly it getting the noise level down when the windshield is down would make long distance riding far more enjoyable.
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Ted
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FASTESTbusaAROUND
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posted January 14, 2008 02:34 PM
Edited By: FASTESTbusaAROUND on 14 Jan 2008 14:36
If it were me, I'd go the canal plug solution with an add-on mic. I use the UM2C's from Westone, which are outstanding and have a 119DB/mw output, which you need for the iPOD/iPHONE output. Concert quality is what you'll get. Serious sound.
http://www.westone.com/content/116.html
Now, in addition to that, I use these in-ear gels and they have an ambient noise drop of over 28DB, when properly sealed (using either KY or spit...LOL) They fit the UM2C's perfectly.
Click to view gels
With these and a good seal on insertion, noise becomes a thing of the past, even without a helmet at 100+ MPH, but the trick is the seal; without a good seal, you get no imaging, no bass and lot's of road noise.
HI FI Audio over BT could potentially suck big time...and it has to be A2DP Bluetooth to get stereo.
You could probably buy a BT adapter and plug into that, but I suspect that sound quality won't be decent. I'd go wired into the iPOD or iPHONE and keep it in your left inside jacket pocket with the wiring up to the helmet hidden through the jacket.
If go BT, you could buy Logitech's or something like them, disassemble them and install it all into your helmet, but you'll still have lot's more noise and shit sound, all with a lot more work to get there too...IMO
Wired would be easier and would give you much more of the things you're looking for, including perfect HI FI sound quality.
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TedG
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posted January 14, 2008 04:08 PM
FBA this is a winter project, you know about winter don' t you? The intent is to try to find something that will improve the experience. Cutting down on noise is #1, then effortless tunes would be nice. I had a set of wired speakers in another helmet and have a wired radar detector speaker in my RX7RR and it is a royal pain especially if you forget to plug in. And let's face it, Plugging in glove, then a stereo, etc is getting to be a royal pain in the ass. It is just a thought and maybe there is something decent out there that someone has tried.
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Ted
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FASTESTbusaAROUND
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posted January 14, 2008 06:11 PM
I plug in from the iPOD in my jacket to my helmet, so it's not plugged into the bike and no messy wires...but I hear you. The BT option will not be HI FI or noiseless, but will work. You can just buy a BT headset and incorporate it into your helmet. That will work for what you need, but there's no way I can think of to eliminate the inherent noise, given that you're not going to use in-ear monitors -- and I understand your reasoning perfectly. I have a few Scorpion EXO700's which are phenomenal lids, but also a bit noisy. When I use the in-ear monitors, I hear nothing at all; I have to lip read. You cannot however achieve this without canal plugs unfortunately, unless you figure out how to get active noise cancellation in there and my guess is that it won't happen.
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TedG
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posted January 14, 2008 06:40 PM
Edited By: TedG on 14 Jan 2008 18:48
Well I actually bought a pair of noise cancelling headphones (Sony) to do put in a helmet a while ago, but I have been using them when I travel. Now with bluetooth there is no noise cancelling. I wonder how well that BMW helmet works?
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Ted
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Hells Dark Lord
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posted January 14, 2008 09:15 PM
had a guy once tell me, that no helmet that has good ventilation will be quiet, and no quiet helmet will have decent ventilation....I am on my 5th Arai. I have had a few Quantam f's, a Quantam 2, and the Astral. I like my astral the best, but they are all loud. I just turn up the music a bit louder and keep going.
As far as blue tooth goes. I am interested to see what you come up with Ted as I would like to do the same thing.
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TedG
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posted January 15, 2008 08:49 AM
The problem is there are so many choices.
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Hells Dark Lord
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posted January 18, 2008 12:38 PM
and none of the choices is cheap..... 
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TedG
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posted January 18, 2008 03:46 PM
Well to start this process I just ordered a Schuberth S1 helmet, and from what I have read it is a very quiet helmet. We will see. I found it for $359 with the fancy paint.
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Ted
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The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
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stevewfl
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posted January 19, 2008 07:18 PM
http://www.kneedraggers.com/details/Dainese_Airstream_Course_DNect_Full_Face_Helmet_DOT_Bluetooth_Matte_Black--630836.html
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rifleman223
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posted January 20, 2008 06:44 AM
Edited By: TedG on 20 Jan 2008 11:58
I have the Nolan NCOM helmet and installed the JM Bluetooth headset. I LOVE it and it is VERY clear. It actually cancels out a lot of the wind noise but you can still hear around you. I have an 8GB Nano (New one) and mounted it with the RAM mount to my left handlebar. I plug it in to a Dongle from Jabra and it takes a feew seconds to pair with the helmet. Once I turn on the helmet, it pairs with my Phone mounted in the middle. I can listen to music for 7 hours straight and if a call comes in, it over-rides the music and you can choose to answer or ignore.
I suggest the newer iPods because the larger iPods have a microdrive and it does not like the vibration of the bike and frequently crashes.
JM Headset:
http://www.jmcorp.com/SeeProducts.asp?PF=30
RAM Mount
http://65.102.174.116/rammount/productdetail.aspx?partnumber=RAM-B-309-2U
Dongle:
http://www.jabra.com/Sites/Jabra/NA-US/products/Pages/JabraA120s.aspx
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TedG
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posted January 20, 2008 12:00 PM
Edited By: TedG on 20 Jan 2008 12:56
quote:
I have the Nolan NCOM helmet and installed the JM Bluetooth headset. I LOVE it and it is VERY clear. It actually cancels out a lot of the wind noise but you can still hear around you. I have an 8GB Nano (New one) and mounted it with the RAM mount to my left handlebar. I plug it in to a Dongle from Jabra and it takes a feew seconds to pair with the helmet. Once I turn on the helmet, it pairs with my Phone mounted in the middle. I can listen to music for 7 hours straight and if a call comes in, it over-rides the music and you can choose to answer or ignore.
I suggest the newer iPods because the larger iPods have a microdrive and it does not like the vibration of the bike and frequently crashes.
JM Headset:
http://www.jmcorp.com/SeeProducts.asp?PF=30
RAM Mount
http://65.102.174.116/rammount/productdetail.aspx?partnumber=RAM-B-309-2U
Dongle:
http://www.jabra.com/Sites/Jabra/NA-US/products/Pages/JabraA120s.aspx
I fixed your links.
This looks like it may be the ticket. I don't think an iPhone will need the dongle??? Because it is already bluetooth enabled.
Update: I just ordered this. It looks perfect. Thanks, even though this forum is very small, the best answers came from here.
So all said, the helmet cost me $359 total, and the headphone setup was $280, combined the total of $639 with shipping is about the cost of just a new helmet.
AND the J&M brand has an interface to a Valentine One!!!! That is another reason for buying it. It gets better by the minute.
I still would like to quiet down the Arai, and looking at the pads on the J&M unit it just may work, This is sweet, can't wait for the stuff to arrive.
____________
Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
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rifleman223
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posted January 20, 2008 03:40 PM
Edited By: rifleman223 on 20 Jan 2008 15:41
Thanks, I did not check the HTML tags.
The headset has A2DP so if the iPhone will broadcast the music (I will check) then you should not need the dongle. You will really like the sound quality. I do not have the iPhone but I am faairly certain that it does not have a microdrive so it should not crash because of the vibration.
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TedG
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posted January 20, 2008 07:32 PM
Edited By: TedG on 21 Jan 2008 15:17
Back to the Arai, I went for a ride yesterday and paid very close attention to what was going on around my ears. I think I know what the deal is. A properly fitting Arai will press against your cheeks and have even pressure around the circumference of your head. But I noticed that around your ears there is little or no pressure in the area where a set of over ear headphones would touch around your ears and none below. Modifying the padding to touch and exert pressure all the way around your ears would IMHO quiet the thing down considerably. Because right now your ears are actually open to the outside world.
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Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
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TedG
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posted January 21, 2008 05:51 PM
Edited By: TedG on 21 Jan 2008 20:39
Cool they just shipped my Headset. I may have to get another one. Because the more I think about it the more I would like to do the Arai also. Because if the Arai was quiet, it would be the perfect helmet IMHO. And from the looks of the J&M earpieces they will seal off most noise.
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Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
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TedG
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posted January 22, 2008 05:48 PM
And they just shipped the Helmet. Now at least during this shit weather I will have something to mess with.
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Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
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Hells Dark Lord
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posted January 23, 2008 07:03 AM
looking forward to seeing what happens Ted....
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rifleman223
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posted January 23, 2008 07:12 AM
I also suggest that somewhere down the line, you get the extended battery and the cigarette lighter power adapter for long trips.
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TedG
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posted January 23, 2008 07:56 AM
HDL, me too.
rifleman that is a good idea, because I plan on making some long ones.
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Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
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Hells Dark Lord
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living life, and loving it.
Posts: 7981
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posted January 25, 2008 08:20 PM
I have 3 Arai helmets in my garage, one of them is going to end up with some kind of system like you are working on....cant wait....I have tried the Chatterboxs and even just ear buds with my mp3 player....would like something better than either....
I do love my chatter box for group riding....it rocks....it just goes dead really quick, and to hook my mpw player up to it I have cords running and it sucks.
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When in doubt, lean farther and go faster....
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rifleman223
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posted January 25, 2008 10:54 PM
No cords, up to 7 hours of playtime on the normal battery. Cant beat that.
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TedG
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posted January 27, 2008 11:45 AM
Well during the Schuberth experiment I pulled out the ear pieces in it and found that the material is hot glued to the foam. The Arais have very nice elastic that allow you to remove the fabric and work on the foam. The hidden details of an Arai really are starting to show through.
Anyway I have put the J&M system into the Arai and have found the perfect position for the speakers, but they are touching my ears and I know that will cause pain. So I need to embed them into the foam about 1/4 inch. But that is easy because of the elastic.
Circuit City had a Sony dongle that works well. What I don't understand is that the microphone is always on and that just won't work, I can't find a way to turn it off.
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Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
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FASTESTbusaAROUND
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posted January 27, 2008 01:21 PM
Is the mic voice activated? It might be setup that way for intercom communications you know...
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TedG
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posted January 27, 2008 01:43 PM
If it is voice activated, it is sensative and any sound just sets it off. When I first started setting it up I thought the iPhone was transmitting a bluetooth signal when I realized the microphone was picking up the what was coming out of the tiny little speaker of the IPhone. Your breating sounds like a horror movie.
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Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
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FASTESTbusaAROUND
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posted January 27, 2008 02:09 PM
Edited By: FASTESTbusaAROUND on 27 Jan 2008 14:21
You are able in some cases to set mic sensitivity on the intercom units, hence the sensitive mic...if it's not PTT, the mic will always be on. Looking at the manual now, seems to me that the mic would always be on...
Are you hearing the mic in your headset all the time now?
Maybe the intercom volume need to be down while in BT mode?
Quote from the J&M site
"And because J&M has designed the intercom portion of our Bluetooth helmet headset as a wired intercom between the two helmets, the seamless communication between the rider and passenger can never be interrupted, no matter what is being transmitted from the linked Bluetooth device, including cell phone conversation."
Means to me, that the mic is always on.
Gotta be able to adjust the intercom volume to down or off -- IMO.
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