stevewfl
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posted May 24, 2007 10:31 AM
kew beans- I noticed a "second" difference came with a HUGE price tag and the DUC being significantly more uncomfortable to ride on the street than the 600. (worst bike tested).
See, I'm interested in the Duc. I just can't subscribe to buying a bike for no other reason than "look at me I'm on a Ducati". If it costs 5K more than a jap Honda, shouldn't it be a lot faster and a lot more comfortable and a lot more everything. A 600 shouldn't run close to it on performance and better on the streets. Am I way off here, or is the only reason people purchase it is because of brand name?
Fish beat me up if I'm way off since you just got one too.
I really didn't subscribe to this thread to beat up on the 1098
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2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
  
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deathpulse
Pro
Posts: 1688
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posted May 24, 2007 01:07 PM
OK. Let me clarify this a bit. One second per lap on the track is HUUUUGE. in 10 laps thats 10 seconds, 20 laps 20 seconds and so forth. You are VASTLY underestimating the track difference, although the real deal here will not be found in any magazine. You need to ride both and decide which works better for YOU. Maybe you turn better times on the 600?? track times are derived from the rider, not from a magazine.
In the 1/4 mile - again, this has many factors. I'm a crappy 1/4 miler  . I don't do it much. The 1098 is close enough to the 12 and 14 to me to be as fast (for me) . Can you add mods like larger pistons, turbo's, nitros etc and make a bike faster? SURE, but I'm not really into that.
The 1098 is more comfortable for me (6' 2" tall) than the 600's I've ridden and its more comfortable than my zx-12r and the zx-14's Ive been on. The only place the 1098 falls short for ME is 2 up riding. A passenger really isn't that comfy. but then again 2 up riding sucks for all sport bikes. For really comforrable 2 up riding, get a cruiser. So, the 1098 is equal to or better than a combination of 600 and my zx-12r. Total the two and you spend more than the 1098. Of course, money is not my real guideline to determining what bike to get  .
How is the 600 "close to it in performance and better on the streets" again?
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stevewfl
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posted May 24, 2007 02:37 PM
How is the 600 "close to it in performance and better on the streets" again?
Let me repeat, only the EXPERT track racer was faster on the 1098 regarding lap times, and that was by a second. So for me the track is not where I would see a $5,000 benefit.
OK what was said about the street/comfort:
"A comfort based pecking order sent the Duc to the back. Its exhaust heat, hard and high seat and stretched reach to the low bars make it the least comfy"
The 6'2" tester stated quote "The Duc is the least comfy of the 5 bikes tested. Riding position is more wristy. The seats high, which put pressure on my-"
Now for the CBR600RR-
"On the opposite end of the comfort/livability spectrum was the CBR, which garnered positive comments from everyone".
Many positive things were said about the CBR, but to answer your question of how the CBR is better on the streets I'll quote the tall rider's comment as most fitting ""higher bars and softer seat are a huge plus"
So basically, for 5,000 less, you get a more ergonomically correct bike with the CBR. And this magazine's testers is not the only pro critic that has said this about the new CBR.
So for me, the street is the other area I would certainly not see any benefit from purchasing a Duc. The one reason I can see for purchasing the Duc is it absolutely looks the most fabulous, but as I said I'm not into bikes for the "look at me I ride a Duc" factor.
There are pages after pages of write-ups about the 5 bikes. Maybe you disagree with all the testers that agreed the DUC was the most uncomfortable of all 5 bikes, maybe you don't, but the articles were interesting reading for me and after looking at the spec sheets on the bikes i can see why the Duc would prove to be an unerginomical bike for me being tall. Thats why I warned Fish about doing sport touring on it in my above post.
Again not to bust the bike but its no faster on the track to the average track junkiew such as me that works full time and only sees the track on occasional weekends, and it doesn't win on the street. So I'm still open-minded to it I'm just not seeing a value purchase yet :P
____________
2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
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deathpulse
Pro
Posts: 1688
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posted May 24, 2007 03:57 PM
Dude. I hate to say this, but you are a classic "magazine racer". Please take my advice. Don't live on the performance numbers or experience of magazine editors. use them as a guide and nothing more. Try stuff out on your own and make your own conclusions. Real world conditions change, rider skill changes, bikes are slightly different one from the other... .some suggest some manufacturers give mags "ringers"... all of this stuff happens. Have you ever driven a 1098? If not, you really can't find out for yourself.
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stevewfl
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posted May 24, 2007 04:19 PM
I agree with media bias.
Regarding the rgonomics, I read the spec sheets. Regarding the lap times, it only makes sense the 600RR makes faster lap times unless your a pro pracer. Thats not only for the Duc, but any litre bike too compared to a hot 600.
regarding the mirrors, you guys posted it here and so did the pro magazine racers.
I'm all good with the 1098 anyway though, thanks for the comments 
____________
2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
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deathpulse
Pro
Posts: 1688
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posted May 24, 2007 04:19 PM
also - mags tend to favor the highest add revenue "clients". .
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deathpulse
Pro
Posts: 1688
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posted May 24, 2007 04:29 PM
lol - you use your mirrors?? . I agree on the mirrors though - garbage. Don't use em much anyway though. I'd try the 1098 if I were you. I'm 6'2" tall and the 1098 is MUCH more comfy for me than a 600RR. I tend to ride with relaxed arms etc and put most of my "grip" on my legs... so I don't experience any wrist issues... but then again you may ride differently.. TRY IT BRO . Word of caution though... if you try one.. you may want to buy one... I did!!
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deathpulse
Pro
Posts: 1688
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posted May 24, 2007 05:34 PM
Here is one final thought for you though Steve... I'm betting at your track skill level the BEST spend of money to make you faster is on the most CRITICAL part of the bike for speed..... YOU . I'd take all the classes I could. If you haven't already, do Keith Codes classes 1 through 4.. then a few level 4 classes and move on to his R.A.C.E stuff. EXCELLENT program. All said and done it will be the BEST spend to make YOU as fast as you can be on ANY bike .,... oh yeah.. and its a HOOT too. How long have you been racing?
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stevewfl
Moderator
Posts: 27920
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posted May 24, 2007 06:25 PM
quote:
lol - you use your mirrors?? . I agree on the mirrors though - garbage. Don't use em much anyway though. I'd try the 1098 if I were you. I'm 6'2" tall and the 1098 is MUCH more comfy for me than a 600RR. I tend to ride with relaxed arms etc and put most of my "grip" on my legs... so I don't experience any wrist issues... but then again you may ride differently.. TRY IT BRO . Word of caution though... if you try one.. you may want to buy one... I did!!
Ya I'm afraid you may be right about trying it.
I enjoy classes when I have the opportunity and I race in the CCS series when I have a chance. My next class will be team hammer at Daytona in October (hint Fish/PK lets ride that track!).
I'll be sneaking some classes in before that too if lucky
____________
2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
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martinc
Parking Attendant
Posts: 17
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posted June 16, 2007 04:05 AM
Hello,1st post.
That test was made with a seasoned club racer that race Ducatis...so it wasnt very fair if you think about it.
martinc,1098S Tricolore
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