shiphteey
Needs a job
Posts: 2529
|
posted June 06, 2012 03:13 AM
2012 ZX-14R 1st ride/race Impression
Kinda feel like typing about something else and wanted to write about it while it is still relatively fresh in my head....
Last weekend I had a long time customer ask to jockey his new 14R at the Ohio Mile....I told him if it was ready I'd take his 14R down in place of my street 12R so we can see what it can do.
Modifications to the 14R were as follows:
Full Muzzy Exhaust
Guhl Ecu
Slight regearing in case of normal or favorable conditions (optimistic) supplied by Rich.
Before we had gone I threw out the idea of doing some other inexpensive, minor tweaks which have some known benefits in the LSR world. Lowering the bike slightly would reduce the frontal area and = a little more top speed on the back 1/2. He said NO, its a streetbike (I roll my eyes a little)....NO to race gas.....basically NO to anything else, just ride it in street config the way its ridden on the streets.....OK FINE DAMMIT. Sheesh. I'm sitting back wondering if conditions will be such to prevent a 200 run....maybe.
Having never even goofed around with it in the parking lot I kinda jumped on it blind and did the required shakedown run before I went to work. 187 mph wringing its neck in 5th. Mental note.....with a very stiff headwind and crosswind....and not quite 100% throttle ... it performed well. I knew right then I'd be playing in the 190s all weekend....but 200? Meh I dunno....its still sitting tall, kinda heavy....and relatively tame....but anything is possible in racing. Another mental note: pretty stable and air braking was a drama free affair. Another mental note, even touching the brakes 1% in the parking lot feels like 99% effort on my 12R....finally brakes that MATCH the bike's acceleration and speed capabilities IMO.
I go to work with 7 or 8 passes run throughout Saturday.....of course traction contol default was set to OFF. Launching from 3s.....4s.....5s.....rolling on the throttle easy at first and then quickly feeding it. I kinda had to use my own internal compass to give what I thought would be just enough to maintain forward momentum without some BOG or damn wheelie.....and wheelie it did once or twice but it was smooth so I was able to control it and keep it within an inch or so off the ground. Bike pulls pretty well....even geared down (numerically) pulls better than my lighter 12 geared up.
YES ROY YOURS PULLS SIGNIFICANTLY HARDER THAN THIS, STOP ASKING! And Yes Rich this pulls harder than your 14 surely....but not to the point where I would just dump an older 14 for a newer one. But if I was on a 12 and getting bored with it (not that I am) the 14R would be a great next choice.
So....after about 8 runs, various tucks, minor changes in shift points what did I get....? Everything from a 190 when I hit the limiter through a run exloring the extended rev limiter to a 194.x on Saturday. How much of the variances in speed came from ME vs the everchanging strengths of the headwinds is difficult to say.....when you have winds getting stronger and weaker you might have actually had a better run but it shows slower because of stiffer wind. But overall I was happy with the way the bike ran. Could it have or would it have gone 200+ without the wind that day? I can say honestly, absolutely, 100% no doubt in my mind. This 14R seems to have that low pull that the older 14 had over any stock motor 12R.....however it did seem to still reward you and not nose over in the super high RPMs if revved out. Maybe this thing is a true "R" model in the 6R/9R/12R peakyness feel.....just with a spread of low end and midrange for added fun. From 3000 or 4000 RPMs Roy's 1530 would absolutely rip the paint off this thing, even if it Roy's had an 18T on it. But no diss on this new 14R....pulled well and with sort of a "just scratching the surface" type of modification list to boast with.
Sunday morning I was on the starting line 8:30....splash of pump gas and ready to go. Felt cooler and a little less windy. I zone hard trying to visualize a 200 mph that my determination wants but that my experience tells me will probably still come up a little shy. Hey, a headwind is a headwind and running n/a....you're gonna run what you're gonna run, thats it.
195.something. Felt good....still relatively stable compared to Shane and Roadracer's kawasakis which were shod with BSTs I think that day given the crosswinds? Maybe the BSTs were more sensitive to lateral directional changes (crosswinds) and would sometimes push their front wheels out from under them, or at least try to, while the 14 would just have a slight hint of that but still muscle on without any annoying weaves or excessive movement. Never had to chop the throttle in any run even if it was getting pushed by the wind. Never got to keep running or wait for better conditions as Gerald ran and passed away after that so I packed my stuff and went home.
Despite his death now that I've had a few days to kind of remember the 14 I remember it was pretty nice actually. No, I don't think its leaps and bounds better than the older 14 to be honest. Maybe a small but significant step better, kinda how the 14 was looked at by many to be just a little better than the 12R. As a streetbike it was damn comfortable as I had to use it to run back to the hotel 2 miles away because I forgot my gloves. I got there very quickly giving it lots of gas but shfiting early to keep the dbs down....it still pulled well even when I tried to "kill" its edge by opening the gas quick in 6th at 3k.....still surged ok. Brakes....wow......just the couple of times I used them.....impressive.....this is the way any bike this size and speed should be from the factory IMO. Kinda makes me scratch my head when I think about how much worst the older Busa and 12's 6 pistons shit Tokicos were.
I'm certainly not opposed to trying it again and the owner finally understands how headwinds can take all your efforts and laugh in your face. If we can sync up again I think it will come back with some race gas and lowered....for that alone IMO would have had this 14R going 200....but shoulda coulda woulda right?
A.
____________
Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
  
|
oldkawboy
Needs a job
Posts: 2125
|
posted June 06, 2012 04:49 AM
So many times over the years I heard folks say.......it'll run over 200, they have no idea.
I have no doubt that if Ali says it will, then it will.
I had a chance to ride a bone stock 14R with 12 miles on the clock last year out in California while working a Kawasaki event and came away very impressed with the power. I've got a lot of miles on the 14 and now quite a few on the new R through work and owning an '07, '08 & now an '09.
Just like Ali said, where my stock 14's kinda laid over above 10k this new one pulls HARD right to the limiter, very impressive.
Shane & Rachael have already proved the R will break 200 with the valve cover still in place (in not so good conditions) I too believe the R will crack 200 with limited bolt-ons in decent conditions.
I think back to 2006 when Chad ran 196.1mph at Maxton on a new 14 with twenty somethings mile on the clock and it was stone stock with just an 18 tooth countersprocket.
No doubt the R will surpass that.
I'm thinking a R with the normal bolt-ons and a set of 47 throttle bodies would be an EXCELLENT streetbike!!!!!
Thanks for the good write up Ali. Wish the weather would have been decent, them winds can make or break an event.
Dan
|
Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
|
posted June 06, 2012 05:47 AM
 Edited By: Shane661 on 6 Jun 2012 13:50
I am sure you will see well over 200 mph on the bike. As mentioned the setup wasn't optimized, and the winds were terrible. Race gas and lowered...maybe a few other tweaks, and you will lay down some real mph. lmo, the bike has seen sublte improvements since the Gen1...but not in the engine department. Hp differences are roughly equal to the jump from Blackbird to Busa (we have seen a 22 hp difference between Racheal's and mine, so far). And as much as I hate to admit it, it does make the Gen 1 look a little dated.
I don't think the 14R feels fast, in a 12R sense. It has so much power everywhere, for a stock motor. It reminds me of Racheal's Busa on 6 psi boost, in that sense. But no doubt it would wallop that old turbo at that boost setting....it is crisper and actually makes more power. 
Properly set up, I think you are really going to like this bike. 
Shane
|
WRECKSHOP
Expert Class
Posts: 359
|
posted June 06, 2012 08:17 AM
No bike in total street form is gonna run 200mph. Its designed for the street and not for a 200 MPH+ race in a mile. Therefore any bike including the new ZX-14r has to be setup totally for the mile or a 200+ MPH run. You have to set it up properly for what you are doing. Plan and simple.
|
smokinZX14
Needs a life
Posts: 10197
|
posted June 06, 2012 08:41 AM
Edited By: smokinZX14 on 6 Jun 2012 16:48
Great write up Ali .
To bad he would not let you makes some adjustments to the bike... It's not going to feel like roys bike the way it's set up now . Having rode both bikes i know how you feel . Kawi did their best to tame this bike down in the first 3 gears and for good reason ..If you had the flies removed and the right pipe and mapping you would now have a bike that feels more like roys bike. Even with the flies removed it will be down a little on HP from roys bike in the first 3 gears.. Kawi has seen fit to build in a safe mode in the first 3 gears , pulling the flies helps big time but the ECU still sees you wacking on the throttle and pulls timing to kill some HP and TQ..This goes away when you shift to 4th gear ... That's why the bike seems to pull much harder the the upper gears ... We don't yet have a fix for that problem ...So what you are seeing is low 190 HP in the first 3 gears and 210+ HP in the upper gears.
Having rode roys bike in the 1/4 as well as johnny turbo making some pass we know what it MPH .. Roys bike hit 162 to 163 ever pass no matter if i or johhny rode the bike . My zx14R runs very close to that number at 162.60. On motor the bikes are close in HP numbers ....But with Kawi safe mode for the first 3 gears it just doesn't feel that way till you get in the upper gears ..
I wish you could have rode my bike or Shane bikes and you would have had a completely different day than you had .. My hat is off to you for going 195 on a bike that was not set up for what you were doing ..Even with the wrong set up you still ran great numbers and that tell us all that you Sir have some skills ..
____________
Smokin Performance Cycles..
Tampa Bay , FL .. Brocks Performance Dealer ..
Gen 2 ZX14R Best ET 8.43 , Best MPH 164.95
|
Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
|
posted June 06, 2012 09:23 AM
quote:
My hat is off to you for going 195 on a bike that was not set up for what you were doing ..Even with the wrong set up you still ran great numbers and that tell us all that you Sir have some skills ..
+1
|
GixxerJohn
Zone Head
2012 zx14R SE
Posts: 537
|
posted June 06, 2012 10:26 AM
quote:
quote:
My hat is off to you for going 195 on a bike that was not set up for what you were doing ..Even with the wrong set up you still ran great numbers and that tell us all that you Sir have some skills ..
+1
Skills????? He pinned the throttle in a straight line for a mile and let the bike do its thing. I do that every time o get an empty road. I must be an champion racer by now.
____________
2012 ZX14R SE
|
shiphteey
Needs a job
Posts: 2529
|
posted June 06, 2012 10:33 AM
Is that a challenge?
____________
Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
|
GixxerJohn
Zone Head
2012 zx14R SE
Posts: 537
|
posted June 06, 2012 10:46 AM
Edited By: GixxerJohn on 6 Jun 2012 18:47
quote:
Is that a challenge?
What going as fast as i can pin my throttle in a straight line? No my friend that is not a challenge or challenging. Big balls absolutely, but not challenging. What most of these guys here can do on a track now thats challenging.
____________
2012 ZX14R SE
|
CrotchRocket
Moderator
Bracket Racing with Betsy
Posts: 8038
|
posted June 06, 2012 10:49 AM
^ lol...
____________
Jason Miller StreetBike Seminars
*****DragRacers do it better, because they dont cut Corners*****
|
shiphteey
Needs a job
Posts: 2529
|
posted June 06, 2012 11:03 AM
What going as fast as i can pin my throttle in a straight line? No my friend that is not a challenge or challenging.
----Ah, but it is. This is a challenge, this is your official callout actually. I'm pulling your card hommie. Come and meet me at the Ohio Mile. You think going fast in a straight line is only about pinning the throttle? How about your tuck? How about your gearing? How about your overall setup (deja vu)?
Big balls absolutely, but not challenging.
----Kinda like the guys who say going fast in a straight line is easy and mock drag racers....just so happen to be the same people who don't drag race and if they did would yield lackluster results.
What most of these guys here can do on a track now thats challenging.
----So you've taken a talley to find out what "most" people on here can do and it is your opinion that "most" on here run "challenging" times at the strip? You have any data to back up your empty claim? Your feeble attempt at being accepted by some on here by stroking the same dicks whos nuts you used to kick....come on man....be you and not some social chameleon trying hard to impress people. So going quick in the 1/4 mile is for the gods and going fast in 1 mile is just really easy....since its so easy its something you could easily PROVE....by running against me at the Ohio mile next outting....sup? 14R vs 14R stock motor, na....sup? Show me what you got BIG TALKER!
A.
____________
Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
|
GixxerJohn
Zone Head
2012 zx14R SE
Posts: 537
|
posted June 06, 2012 11:23 AM
Edited By: GixxerJohn on 6 Jun 2012 19:41
Hahaha your a fuckin tool. You really think telling me im on their dicks is going to piss me off? Really??? going to have to do better than that my friend. This guys arent shit to me but names on the computer screen. I like them as much as they like me. But the facts are drag racing is a skill. You just said it yourself. Lets say i gear down my 14 lower it and all that. As long as i tuck down oh and im very light, and stay in the gas and your on i don't know lets say a gsxr 750, i will kill you in a long top end race. Now put me on a track with my bike, which is set up almost indentical to smokins and then put him on that said gsxr 750, and he would still fuckin kill me at the track...........hence skill. Thats all im saying.
____________
2012 ZX14R SE
|
1badzx12r
Needs a life
Posts: 8321
|
posted June 06, 2012 11:28 AM
some guys just got to swing off nuttz and think they are tarzan
____________
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S06nIz4scvI
|
GixxerJohn
Zone Head
2012 zx14R SE
Posts: 537
|
posted June 06, 2012 11:37 AM
Edited By: GixxerJohn on 6 Jun 2012 19:43
Oh and another thing, love guys on the internet, they call u out when they know the chances that u live ANYWHERE near where they want to race you is like a 2% chance. And then your a pussy who won't came across country to race them. Gotta love that too. Lets take shanes girl,hell she ran 202mph. Is she a better rider than u??????? No she had a great set up bike. PERIOD. Now give me a great set up bike like wheelies or smokin or eklipse or any number of these guys and i would run like 2-3 seconds slower. I might be a complete asshole but i'm just honest.
____________
2012 ZX14R SE
|
shiphteey
Needs a job
Posts: 2529
|
posted June 06, 2012 11:55 AM
Hahaha your a fuckin tool.
----Awwww....you hurt my feeewwwwings.
You really think telling me im on their dicks is going to piss me off? Really??? going to have to do better than tbat my friend.
-----Who said anything about pissing you off? If I wanted to piss you off I'd start with a slew of insults and go from there. I'm calling it like everyone sees it.
This guys arent shit to me but names on the computer screen.
-----And you are...?
I like them as much as they like me. But the facts are drag racing is a skill.
----And who is arguing the contrary again? Again empty declarations that attempt to make everyone feel really good but at the end doesn't matter. What next....I before E except after C or some other useless Halmark for dummies greeting card shit? "Drag racing is a skill"....who here is disputing that?
You just said it yourself. Lets say i gear down my 14 lower it and all that. As long as i tuck down oh and im very light, and stay in the gas and your on i don't know lets say a gsxr 750, i will kill you in a long top end race.
----Again...who here is arguing that a 750 flat out against a 14R flat out with similar mods and riders is even a "race"? Comapring apples to oranges proves nothing. You're talking about a 14R....good....please stay on the subject! So you do have a 14R...you say you are light....you say that you could set it up to run flat out, right? Then it looks like you are the perfect candidate to run against me at the ohio mile, right? Because after all...its SO EASY! And going about 200 mph is SO BORING I KNOW WHAT YOU MEAN!!!!!!
Now put me on a track with my bike, which is set up almost indentical to smokins and then put him on that said gsxr 750, and he would still fuckin kill me at the track...........hence skill. Thats all im saying.
----And that ain't saying much now is it? How about me vs you 14R vs 14R since you're light and it requires NO SKILL?
A.
____________
Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
|
shiphteey
Needs a job
Posts: 2529
|
posted June 06, 2012 12:07 PM
Oh and another thing, love guys on the internet, they call u out when they know the chances that u live ANYWHERE near where they want to race you is like a 2% chance.
----Read my sig buddy, where do you wanna race at? Where do you live?
And then your a pussy who won't came across country to race them.
----I've been to Utah, TX, FL, OH, NC and Maine to top out and have gone over 200 in all of those states with proof....so quit talking about who's to pussy to come out and run. You're taling to the WRONG person.
Gotta love that too. Lets take shanes girl,hell she ran 202mph.
----Just shy of it, but I'm listening...
Is she a better rider than u???????
----I would not be able to say with 100% certainty that I could always clock a higher speed than she could given all variables constant. I am of a slightly smaller physical stature than her and that can be an advantage depending on the bike. Usually running heads up same spot, same day, same bikes, back to back, and swapping bikes usually paints the picture pretty clear. Can you really compare bike A raced with different modifications, different day, different conditions, different riders? While you can try and infer certain things anyone knows that the only real way to really see how they do is to standardize the data...that would mean running in a controlled environment. Even winds change at land speed races. If I have tailwind on the 14R and go 206 and she has no wind and goes 203 who is "better" in your book? Usually 9/10ths type runs kinda paints a cleaer picture because it is done head to head for long distances.
No she had a great set up bike. PERIOD. Now give me a great set up bike like wheelies or smokin or eklipse or any number of these guys and i would run like 2-3 seconds slower.
----2 to 3 seconds? If thats the case why on earth would you make such comments? Why are you publicly saying, loud and clear, that you are a shitty rider?
I might be a complete asshole but i'm just honest.
----While you may "honestly" believe what you are saying that doesn't make it valid. You do understand that, right? I can honestly believe my Toyota Tacoma will go 100 mph uphill towing 2000 lbs but guess what....all the believing in the world won't change REALITY. And the reality HERE is that we can BOTH be on the 14R and run at the same venue if you like to at least put your theory to the test. Its easy...right? Just pin the throttle! Why didn't I think of that!?!?
A.
____________
Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
|
GixxerJohn
Zone Head
2012 zx14R SE
Posts: 537
|
posted June 06, 2012 12:22 PM
Edited By: GixxerJohn on 6 Jun 2012 20:25
Did you read my post at all?? I know you quoted the fuck out of it. Listen kid i'll say this once. I didn't call you out to race you, just to say the truth. Period. I live in jersey and no im not going to ohio i have a life and career here sorry. And more importantly my bike isn't set up for the mile, is set up for power on the street and everyday riding, full exhaust and geared down. But if me and you had the identical bike and i mean indentical we would be neck and neck kid. Im no rookie i have had a bike since i was six, when mommy bought me a xr80...... loved that four stroke. If i hurt your feelings well sorry lil buddy. And i never said going 200 was boring. Are u and idot where was that quote. I can wheelie like a champ but you dont see me callin u out on that. U do u i'll do me. SPEED RACER!!!!!
____________
2012 ZX14R SE
|
GixxerJohn
Zone Head
2012 zx14R SE
Posts: 537
|
posted June 06, 2012 12:30 PM
So lets just keep on going back and forth over the internet, this is accomplishing soooooooo much. My virtual penis is bigger than yours. Oh and if i don't keep answering u back......it's because i stopped giving a shit.
____________
2012 ZX14R SE
|
shiphteey
Needs a job
Posts: 2529
|
posted June 06, 2012 12:51 PM
Did you read my post at all?? I know you quoted the fuck out of it.
----Oh I did.
Listen kid i'll say this once.
----"Kid"...haha.
I didn't call you out to race you, just to say the truth. Period.
----Which was what exactly? That drag racing takes skills but land speed racing takes no skill? Is that what you are asserting? If not what are you saying....don't be shy. The topic of this thread was my impressions having raced/ridden it for the first time at a land speed venue...are you in the ballpark or debating about something that has nothing to do with the subject at hand?
I live in jersey and no im not going to ohio
----Its an 8 hour drive for me man....I'm coming from VA...you don't hear me crying....probably about the same distance and time for you too.
i have a life and career here sorry. And more importantly my bike isn't set up for the mile, is set up for power on the street and everyday riding, full exhaust and geared down.
----Well then, I guess you can stay in your safe little bubble world and not step outside of that. You get to talk shit from the sidelines while the "KIDS" race and explore the outer limits of said motorcycle.
But if me and you had the identical bike and i mean indentical we would be neck and neck kid.
-----Again....any way of backing up this claim? Would you like to find a spot between you and I, maybe MD or PA to run? That can be arranged but if we're dancing on the street its 4 digits. Been ratted on enough and I'm not racing a total stranger for free. Lessons cost money KID.
Im no rookie i have had a bike since i was six, when mommy bought me a xr80...... loved that four strokes. If i hurt your feelings well sorry lil buddy.
----Who said you were a rookie? So defensive...but yet you have nothing to really show for your accomplishments and have time and again been caught with your pants down on the site. Just let it go.
And i never said going 200 was boring. Are u and idot where was that quote.
----You stated that it took skill to drag race but that it really didn't take much skill or effort to just hold it wide open.....as if holding it wide open was all that was needed. Maybe in your mom's minivan.
I can wheelie like a champ
-----I can do more pullups than you.....but its IRRELEVANT to the topic at hand.
but you dont see me callin u out on that. U do u i'll do me. SPEED RACER!!!!!
-----Then again you didn't start a zx14 wheelie thread and have me come in talking sideways now ... did you?
____________
Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
|
Lucky14
Pro
Posts: 1439
|
posted June 06, 2012 12:53 PM
quote:
.........But if me and you had the identical bike and i mean indentical we would be neck and neck kid..........
____________
You only need two tools: WD-40 and Duct Tape.
If it doesn't move and should, use the WD-40.
If it shouldn't move and does, use the duct tape.
|
shiphteey
Needs a job
Posts: 2529
|
posted June 06, 2012 12:54 PM
quote:
So lets just keep on going back and forth over the internet, this is accomplishing soooooooo much. My virtual penis is bigger than yours. Oh and if i don't keep answering u back......it's because i realized that you are actually going to pull my card and humiliate me by showing that its not just about pinning the throttle. I didn't think you'd be this persistent in proving me wrong, most people on here don't waste their time with my troll ass.
Fixed.
____________
Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
|
Wheelie
Needs a life
Old Man
Posts: 6902
|
posted June 06, 2012 01:03 PM
quote:
. i have a life and career!
Resident TROLL LOLOLOL
wee
|
Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
|
posted June 06, 2012 01:10 PM
Edited By: Shane661 on 6 Jun 2012 21:11
GixxerJohn is the resident troll. Reality is this...LSR is a lot harder than most people think. In our 1 mile venue people use dragracing skills, and all of the other skills required to increase mph. Shift points, tuck, tuning, traction, overall bike setup..very challenging. I have done both fairly extensively over the past 6 years (compared to the average street rider, especially!), and that is my assessment.
Shane
|
shiphteey
Needs a job
Posts: 2529
|
posted June 06, 2012 01:22 PM
quote:
GixxerJohn is the resident troll. Reality is this...LSR is a lot harder than most people think. In our 1 mile venue people use dragracing skills, and all of the other skills required to increase mph. Shift points, tuck, tuning, traction, overall bike setup..very challenging. I have done both fairly extensively over the past 6 years (compared to the average street rider, especially!), and that is my assessment.
Shane
Oh yeah, well Shane if you and I had identical setup...and I mean identical....and we weighed the same....and I mean the exact same....we'd be neck and neck. And if we had the exact same farts...and I mean exact same farts....it would be neck and neck. One fish 2 fish red fish blue fish. See spot run....run spot run!
____________
Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
|
JZX
Zone Head
Posts: 943
|
posted June 06, 2012 01:30 PM
Ahhh, Gixxer "Doucheboy" John, knows LS racing...
____________
06 ZX14 65"
Best 1/8 mile 5.68@126.4 on a 1.41 60'
Best 1/4 mile 8.87@152.7 on a 1.47 60'
|
|
|
HOME
NEW TOPIC