08green
Expert Class
Posts: 188
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posted December 07, 2010 10:08 AM
ALL if you guys rock!! Thanks. Jim, ill call in a few days when i get the valve cover off to check out the carnage..I knew THIS board would offer support and help.
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2004 ZX10
2008 ZX14
  
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08green
Expert Class
Posts: 188
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posted December 20, 2010 09:41 AM
Well...
Got valve cover off..and i must say dropping your own engine is was very fun and made me feel a sense of ownership. I would encourage anyone who is mechanically inclined to download a service manual,buy hex kit, 2 magnet tools, rubber mallet, motorcycle jack stand, cam degree kit w/DVD, shim kit and go to webcamshafts and readup on what TDC is and cam degreeing; for starters, you will need a few other things later.
Now for the bad news....immediatly upon pulling the valve cover I noticed a #3 exhaust valve tappet/bucket/lifter was down while the other 15 are up after the cam was removed. Dropped valve? I wasnt able to pull the tappets yet(go to work) but i will be up early tommoro to further inspect damage. Prolly pull the head while im pocking around...
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2004 ZX10
2008 ZX14
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smokinZX14
Needs a life
Posts: 10197
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posted December 20, 2010 10:37 AM
quote:
Well...
Got valve cover off..and i must say dropping your own engine is was very fun and made me feel a sense of ownership. I would encourage anyone who is mechanically inclined to download a service manual,buy hex kit, 2 magnet tools, rubber mallet, motorcycle jack stand, cam degree kit w/DVD, shim kit and go to webcamshafts and readup on what TDC is and cam degreeing; for starters, you will need a few other things later.
Now for the bad news....immediatly upon pulling the valve cover I noticed a #3 exhaust valve tappet/bucket/lifter was down while the other 15 are up after the cam was removed. Dropped valve? I wasnt able to pull the tappets yet(go to work) but i will be up early tommoro to further inspect damage. Prolly pull the head while im pocking around...
Could be bent or it could be just the shim out of place .. ..Good news you found the problem ..
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Smokin Performance Cycles..
Tampa Bay , FL .. Brocks Performance Dealer ..
Gen 2 ZX14R Best ET 8.43 , Best MPH 164.95
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smokinZX14
Needs a life
Posts: 10197
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posted December 20, 2010 10:40 AM
Someone owes me 5 bucks .... 
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Smokin Performance Cycles..
Tampa Bay , FL .. Brocks Performance Dealer ..
Gen 2 ZX14R Best ET 8.43 , Best MPH 164.95
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jpooch00
Novice Class
Posts: 77
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posted December 20, 2010 03:45 PM
quote:
Well...
Got valve cover off..and i must say dropping your own engine is was very fun and made me feel a sense of ownership. I would encourage anyone who is mechanically inclined to download a service manual,buy hex kit, 2 magnet tools, rubber mallet, motorcycle jack stand, cam degree kit w/DVD, shim kit and go to webcamshafts and readup on what TDC is and cam degreeing; for starters, you will need a few other things later.
Now for the bad news....immediatly upon pulling the valve cover I noticed a #3 exhaust valve tappet/bucket/lifter was down while the other 15 are up after the cam was removed. Dropped valve? I wasnt able to pull the tappets yet(go to work) but i will be up early tommoro to further inspect damage. Prolly pull the head while im pocking around...
Could it be a broken valve spring?
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08green
Expert Class
Posts: 188
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posted December 21, 2010 10:15 AM
 Edited By: 08green on 21 Dec 2010 18:50
Got the head off...yup..2 #3exhaust valves are not seated.. but why the knock?? The valves did not hit the piston hard?..Jim advised me to cut the oil filter open to see if there is material in there. I thought a valve would be a "tick" sound more than a "knock"..I wouldnt cash that check yet lee..
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2004 ZX10
2008 ZX14
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08green
Expert Class
Posts: 188
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posted December 21, 2010 10:34 AM
Here are some pics,
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2004 ZX10
2008 ZX14
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08green
Expert Class
Posts: 188
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posted December 21, 2010 10:36 AM
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2004 ZX10
2008 ZX14
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06redzx14
Pro
Posts: 1022
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posted December 21, 2010 11:18 AM
is the pan still on it?
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06 alien head, no flies, PC+hub, 16/45 44 43, air shifter, dry shot
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06redzx14
Pro
Posts: 1022
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posted December 21, 2010 11:19 AM
#3 rod bearing rod spun
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06 alien head, no flies, PC+hub, 16/45 44 43, air shifter, dry shot
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08green
Expert Class
Posts: 188
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posted December 21, 2010 11:55 AM
Edited By: 08green on 21 Dec 2010 21:15
I hope not but here is my theory:
Overevved,spit shim or keeper, valve dropped enough to cause cylinder #3 to not even fire(no compression)(why it was so slow the last time out), piston struck valve so many times rod bearing said "the hell with this shit"
How's that..
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2004 ZX10
2008 ZX14
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SteddyTeddy
Pro
Posts: 1664
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posted December 21, 2010 12:21 PM
The bearing would of went first. At this point be glad you didn't slap the valves harder causing them to break. That would of been nasty!
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E1000
Novice Class
Posts: 34
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posted December 21, 2010 01:01 PM
valves look bent probablly cuz they were floating. replace them and check the valve guides before reinstalling. reseat the the valve and make sure your shims are in place. dont really think you have to worry about the bottom end. these motors are die hard.
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1st GEN ZX14
few bolt ons
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08green
Expert Class
Posts: 188
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posted January 05, 2011 12:36 PM
UPDATE:
Good news: Jim is sending me some valves. Bad news: At least 1 valve guide is shot(had to use a punch to get #3 ex. valves out) 1 guide is cracked at the bottom. I did pull the ex. valves from the next cylinder over and they were ok. So i need 2 guides...Also the shims and retainers for #3 were all beat up as if it was spitting them out then being forced back in when the valve opened.
Jim what do you charge to replace 2 valve guides? My new theory is I simply was a dumb ass and overrevved the bike with my raised rev limit(guhl motors) I know i revved it to at least 12.5k on 4-5 passes the trip before she blew up..I thought my HD valve springs would make it ok..i guess not..note to self..shift @ 10.8k and LIVE.
Thoughts?
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2004 ZX10
2008 ZX14
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted January 05, 2011 12:38 PM
Were you running a thin head gasket??
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Y2KZX12R
Needs a job
CompetitionCNC.com
Posts: 3762
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posted January 05, 2011 02:23 PM
I have guides here but it will need a valve job because guides are never perfectly concentric to the seat after replacing.
I think you should send me the head so I can check it out thoroughly. The last thing you want is more trouble.
I'll get it fixed up for ya.
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Y2KZX12R
CompetitionCNC.com
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kawpower
Zone Head
Mr kawasaki 2 you!
Posts: 887
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posted January 05, 2011 03:39 PM
What springs do u have in it?
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Cecil County 2010 Motorcycle ET Champ. 9 Wins- 4 RUs .06zx14 turboed for 2012 .
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08green
Expert Class
Posts: 188
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posted January 05, 2011 03:49 PM
Edited By: 08green on 6 Jan 2011 00:42
Yes, a thin HG was used. Another theory that comes to mind is exhaust. lash was not correct according to my cam card, thus causing valves to drop. I wont know until i get the cams back in and use my trusty feeler gauge. Carpenter springs.
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2004 ZX10
2008 ZX14
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smokinZX14
Needs a life
Posts: 10197
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posted January 05, 2011 03:59 PM
Again someone owes me 5 bucks ..
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Smokin Performance Cycles..
Tampa Bay , FL .. Brocks Performance Dealer ..
Gen 2 ZX14R Best ET 8.43 , Best MPH 164.95
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jarhead
Expert Class
Posts: 418
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posted January 05, 2011 05:21 PM
Parts can be replaced, and look at the bright side. You now know more about your engine than you did before.
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billeason
Zone Head
Posts: 711
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posted January 05, 2011 05:36 PM
Didn't anyone notice the difference in the piston height in the cylinders of # 2 and 3 ?
You got major issues in the bottom,or some fancy camera action going on LOL
Hope im wrong but looks expensive to me..........
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bill eason
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RICH CRAFT 1
Zone Head
Posts: 681
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posted January 05, 2011 06:31 PM
You should send the head to Jim and let him do a complete valve job and here's why, you either floated the valve and they hit, or your valve clearances were just too close for that many RPMs either way the valve hit and if those four hit maybe the others hit to. you don't have to hit the valve very hard to slightly bend it. it won't be noticeable just looking at it but it will lose horsepower. when he puts the valve in the grinder he can tell if they're bent. Also you might asked Jim if he will set the valve lash because the lash will change. And if you don't have A bunch of shams at I think eight dollars a piece that can get quite expensive. I know this sounds like a hassle but it's no fun to put everything back together and find out something's wrong. I thought Jim's prices were reasonable.
Ken
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Red 06 ZX14 RR
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08green
Expert Class
Posts: 188
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posted January 05, 2011 08:11 PM
I feel pretty good about setting my own lash(got a $79 hotcam shim kit, the same 9.48mm shims that are in the bike)Got my cam degree kit w/ dvd in the mail today!! What you guys think about what billeason said??
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2004 ZX10
2008 ZX14
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06redzx14
Pro
Posts: 1022
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posted January 05, 2011 08:26 PM
I agree with him. there is no way those pistons should have that difference in height. cylinders 2 & 3 should come up and go down at the same time. Did you pull the pan yet?
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06 alien head, no flies, PC+hub, 16/45 44 43, air shifter, dry shot
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RICH CRAFT 1
Zone Head
Posts: 681
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posted January 05, 2011 08:37 PM
I didn't even notice the picture, two and three should be exactly together you can pull the timing cover off the right side of the motor use a 17 mm ranch and move the motor back and forth bet number three doesn't move. you probably spun a rod bearing and broke the rod off even with the crankshaft otherwise it would've put a hole in the block.
Ken
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Red 06 ZX14 RR
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