johnbull
Expert Class
Posts: 314
|
posted November 03, 2009 01:32 PM
Suzuki K5 engine wont run on 4 cylinders
Guys,
I've just installed a Suzuki K5 motor into a racing car cannot seem to get the engine to run on 4 cylinders.
The number 1 cylinder just wets the plug and tries to fire here and there as though the spark is sparking at the wrong time.
The injectors are all spraying plus there definately is a spark.
Could it be anything to do with a safety feature in the ECU like a limp mode or something that needs resetting????
Any ideas?
Cheers,
Josh.
____________
John Bul Racing. Malta.
  
|
kawasakijockey
Pro
Posts: 1876
|
posted November 03, 2009 02:06 PM
You might check to make sure you didnt cross two coil wires.
____________
Get on the shortbus boys 'cause its time to get schooled.
2007 ZX-14
1.38 60ft
9.03 @ 149mph
8.95 @153 small shot n2o
8.68 @160mph 5lbs boost
|
INTIMIDA2OR
Needs a life
RED rider!
Posts: 13081
|
posted November 03, 2009 02:13 PM
Did you change the spark plug ? Could be a dud.
____________
'06 Passion Red ZX-14
*Lee*
|
johnbull
Expert Class
Posts: 314
|
posted November 04, 2009 06:50 AM
Coil wires are fine and pluga are all new.
Have tried swapping injectors round, coils round, just about everything and the problem remains on cylinder #1. The compression is exactly the same on all 4 cylinders to.
The spark is there on cylinder #1 but it makes me think that it is sparking at the wrong time. Is there anyway that cylinder #1 could have lost its ignition timing????
Could it be that the ecu needs re-setting with the diagnostic tool to remove any errors maybe it is stuck in limp mode??
____________
John Bul Racing. Malta.
|
INTIMIDA2OR
Needs a life
RED rider!
Posts: 13081
|
posted November 04, 2009 09:23 AM
Limp mode would not let you rev up high at all . Basically you give the engine throttle and nothing much happens.
What is happening to you is one cylinder is dead. I had that happen on a car once. Swapped everything and nothing was gained to make that cylinder fire.
But the cylinder had everything it needed, fuel ,spark,compression still nothing.
Did a tune up and the problem was gone!
I think even though It had spark it was weak enough to get blown out by the compression.
Geez I hate when this kind of stuff happens lol!
____________
'06 Passion Red ZX-14
*Lee*
|
BobC
Pro
Posts: 1736
|
posted November 04, 2009 09:49 AM
It needs compression, a big fat spark at the right time and some fuel. Looks like you checked everything but you didn't say if the plug was getting wet.
____________
Candy Thunder Blue 2006 ZZR1400
Stock wheelbase
Max: 205.4 mph in 1.25 miles
2012 ZZR1400 in Golden Blazed Green
Brock CT Full System. etc
Max: 203.1 in 1 mile (so far)
|
06redzx14
Pro
Posts: 1022
|
posted November 04, 2009 10:18 AM
check throttle bodies
____________
06 alien head, no flies, PC+hub, 16/45 44 43, air shifter, dry shot
|
Obba
Expert Class
Posts: 455
|
posted November 04, 2009 01:51 PM
As 06redzx14 says it might be around that area.
I'm sure you know what you are doing, but i always go back to basics when i get problems like this.
I typed in '1 cylinder not firing' in google and it came up with a fair amount of stuff - from dicky DSI's, leaking vacume hoses to carbys (well, throttle bodies).
There might be something that might give you an idea.
Weird one really: If theres fuel, air, compression and a spark - it's gotta go!
Are you sure there is a spark when the plug is in, as in nothing grounding when it's all plugged in?
If the plug is wet, then fuel is getting through. If it was firing when it shoud'nt you'd certainly hear it!
An inductor timing light, with the clamp as close to the plug as possible would at least tell you that a spark, is getting as far as that.
Sorry for pointing out the bleedin obvious, just all i can think of now.
|
johnbull
Expert Class
Posts: 314
|
posted November 04, 2009 02:39 PM
Thanks for your input guys.
Yes the plug is getting wet and you can tell that there is loads of unburnt fuel coming from the exhaust smell.
As Bob C mentioned, one of the things you need is the spark at the RIGHT time. You can hear the cylinder trying to fire here and there but thats it. The exhaust on that cylinder just gets warmish whereas the other 3 get red hot after a minute or so. Is there any possible way that the timing on Cylinder #1 could have got very retarted from the ecu?? would limp mode do anything like this??
Appreciate your input.
____________
John Bul Racing. Malta.
|
INTIMIDA2OR
Needs a life
RED rider!
Posts: 13081
|
posted November 04, 2009 08:26 PM
Does it clear up at all or does it miss all the time?
____________
'06 Passion Red ZX-14
*Lee*
|
johnbull
Expert Class
Posts: 314
|
posted November 05, 2009 12:17 AM
Nop, the cylinder #1 doesnt fire at all. Just pops here and there.
____________
John Bul Racing. Malta.
|
BobC
Pro
Posts: 1736
|
posted November 05, 2009 02:02 AM
 Edited By: BobC on 5 Nov 2009 10:04
Have you investigated whether there's a vacuum leak on the inlet side of that cylinder?
____________
Candy Thunder Blue 2006 ZZR1400
Stock wheelbase
Max: 205.4 mph in 1.25 miles
2012 ZZR1400 in Golden Blazed Green
Brock CT Full System. etc
Max: 203.1 in 1 mile (so far)
|
johnbull
Expert Class
Posts: 314
|
posted November 05, 2009 05:04 AM
Yep. everything is ok with the vacuum hoses etc. Since the engine was bought from a breaker, I am becoming and more convinced that someone has once tried messing around with the ecu and somehow retarded the timing on cylinder #1. My next step is to check each cylinders timing with a strobe light. This should definately indicate whether the #1 timing is out correct?? Even had the head off yesterday to see that everything is ok and all is fine.
I have read alot about people being able to access all the parameters in these ecu's (ignition tables, fuel maps, rev limits etc.), this is why I am nearly positive that it is something to do with the ecu's ignition map for cylinder #1.
____________
John Bul Racing. Malta.
|
BIGZXDADDY
Expert Class
Posts: 270
|
posted November 05, 2009 10:11 AM
suck, squeeze, bang, blow is what needs to happen in that order. you checked the squeeze w/ the compression test but did you check the suck? compression doesn't always mean that the cylinder can pull in an air charge. a quick check w/ a vaccum guage will tell you if she sucks
____________
"never drive faster than you can see, besides it's all in the reflexes"
|
INTIMIDA2OR
Needs a life
RED rider!
Posts: 13081
|
posted November 05, 2009 01:15 PM
Can you try a different ecu?
____________
'06 Passion Red ZX-14
*Lee*
|
johnbull
Expert Class
Posts: 314
|
posted November 06, 2009 12:32 AM
Tried the timing yesterday with a strobe light on all four cylinders and its fine.
____________
John Bul Racing. Malta.
|
INTIMIDA2OR
Needs a life
RED rider!
Posts: 13081
|
posted November 06, 2009 12:44 AM
The problem has to be something simple. Try spraying starting fluid in that throttle body while the engine is running and see if it fires.
____________
'06 Passion Red ZX-14
*Lee*
|
BobC
Pro
Posts: 1736
|
posted November 06, 2009 01:29 AM
quote:
The problem has to be something simple. Try spraying starting fluid in that throttle body while the engine is running and see if it fires.
Good suggestion, I was reading about the "Propane Test" where some gas from a propane torch is sprayed around the intake, if the cylinder fires up it indicates an air leak.
____________
Candy Thunder Blue 2006 ZZR1400
Stock wheelbase
Max: 205.4 mph in 1.25 miles
2012 ZZR1400 in Golden Blazed Green
Brock CT Full System. etc
Max: 203.1 in 1 mile (so far)
|
|
|
HOME
NEW TOPIC