eklipse636
Needs a life
ZX-14
Posts: 6046
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posted September 14, 2009 07:33 AM
chad it will be put in there next time. i dunno ive always ran 93 on the street... i cant tell ya why.
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Best: 60ft 1.351 1/8 5.68 mph 123.98 1/4
8.89 mph 151.32
  
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted September 14, 2009 09:02 AM
 Edited By: Shane661 on 14 Sep 2009 17:07
The lower octane, to my knowledge, burns faster. So, more complete combustion will occur with a lower octane fuel. You want to burn all of the fuel you possibly can, within the safe limits of the engine.
It is similar to advancing the timing while using a higher octane fuel. That would start the combustion process sooner in order to make the most power possible on the fuel. You need to start the process sooner with the higher octane fuel, because it burns more slowly.
When you see people add some high octane "race gas" on a stock motor bike...often it is going to slow them down.
On a stock motor, 87 will work well. However, 160 hp is pretty low,and I think there is something else going on...be it bike, or dyno.
Shane
PS. I'm not a fuel expert, and there are plenty of other factors to look at when choosing a fuel, besides octane.
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JR
Expert Class
drag racing
Posts: 178
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posted September 14, 2009 09:10 AM
HMM...... THATS CRAZY ME AND MY FREINDS HAVE THE SAME PROBLEM WITH THE DYNO. THEY SAY EVERY DYNO READS DIFFERENT SOME HAVE MORE AIR MOVMENT THAN OTHERS. MY FREIND DYNO HIS BIKE AT A SHOP AND ONLY PUT OUT 163 AND TOR WAS 99. IDK BIKE RUNS GOOD ALL THEY DID WAS PLAY WITH THE FUEL A LITTLE FOR THE PRO SHORT STACKS. I GUESS THE STACKS MADE THE BIKE LEAN OUT IT WAS AROUND 14 THEY PUT IT AROUND 13.2. COULDNT WE DO THAT ARE SELVES . THEY CHARGED US 200 FOR WHAT.
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08 zx 14 lowered, straped in the
front, strecth 65, air shifter, pigs
windshiel, carbon fiber frame
sliders, full 2brother exhaust.
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masszx14
Pro
A mind beside itself!
Posts: 1806
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posted September 14, 2009 11:11 AM
quote:
HMM...... THATS CRAZY ME AND MY FREINDS HAVE THE SAME PROBLEM WITH THE DYNO. THEY SAY EVERY DYNO READS DIFFERENT SOME HAVE MORE AIR MOVMENT THAN OTHERS. MY FREIND DYNO HIS BIKE AT A SHOP AND ONLY PUT OUT 163 AND TOR WAS 99. IDK BIKE RUNS GOOD ALL THEY DID WAS PLAY WITH THE FUEL A LITTLE FOR THE PRO SHORT STACKS. I GUESS THE STACKS MADE THE BIKE LEAN OUT IT WAS AROUND 14 THEY PUT IT AROUND 13.2. COULDNT WE DO THAT ARE SELVES . THEY CHARGED US 200 FOR WHAT.
You shameless caps lock offender! 
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universal@mind
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dcjens
Pro
Wet side of Washington
Posts: 1059
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posted September 14, 2009 03:51 PM
ive dynoed 153 and 189 same dyno same operators, same weather. I'd do something different with your time like rev the shaat out of your own bike through the mountains and try to hang on!!
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Black 06
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted September 14, 2009 04:18 PM
Regarding your a/f, it should make good dyno #'s with 13:1. I don't think you will gain a ton of peak power with a power commander....
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted September 14, 2009 04:20 PM
Edited By: Shane661 on 15 Sep 2009 00:21
Mine on pump gas, for comparison (a/f was broken...so free pulls  ):
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smokinZX14
Needs a life
Posts: 10197
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posted September 14, 2009 04:37 PM
Edited By: smokinZX14 on 15 Sep 2009 00:38
Mine made 177 on 87 pump gas ( SAE ) ... That was with a pipe and tune ... That was also a BMC race filter .... One pull at 160 hp doesn't tell the hole story and i would lose no sleep over it .. Most dyno shops will run 3 or 5 runs before they make a print out ... You got to get the oil hot , chain hot and the motor must be heat soaked .... Tire must be up to 38+ PSI .. Like said before every dyno will read just a bit different ... With a few clicks of the mouse I can make my bike read in the mid 180s .. A dyno is nothing but a tool much like a screw driver ( some people can't use a screw driver either ) ... I have rode zx14s that make more power and less power than mine on a dyno but they ran the same damn numbers at the track ... What does that tell you ? Don't sweat the dyno numbers !!!!
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Smokin Performance Cycles..
Tampa Bay , FL .. Brocks Performance Dealer ..
Gen 2 ZX14R Best ET 8.43 , Best MPH 164.95
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted September 14, 2009 04:50 PM
Edited By: Shane661 on 15 Sep 2009 00:51
Also, your 16/48 gearing and heavy tire are probably not helping those #'s...
I'd look more at your mph in good air than anything else...the "shape" of your power curve looks very similar to mine, even the little "bump" in the upper midrange.
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Wheelie
Needs a life
Old Man
Posts: 6902
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posted September 14, 2009 04:56 PM
quote:
Also, your 16/48 gearing and heavy tire are probably not helping those #'s...
I'd look more at your mph in good air than anything else...the "shape" of your power curve looks very similar to mine, even the little "bump" in the upper midrange.
how do you lose hp with a 16-48? lol
wee
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Wheelie
Needs a life
Old Man
Posts: 6902
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posted September 14, 2009 05:00 PM
maybe I should say, what gearing will give me the most hp?
wee
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted September 14, 2009 05:04 PM
Edited By: Shane661 on 15 Sep 2009 01:05
quote:
maybe I should say, what gearing will give me the most hp?
wee
A lower numerical final gearing can give a higher dyno reading....
The same bike can read different hp #'s based on which gear the bike is in. I have seen this with my own bike on the dyno.
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted September 14, 2009 05:07 PM
Edited By: Shane661 on 15 Sep 2009 01:43
quote:
how do you lose hp with a 16-48? lol
wee
Some dyno basics:
http://www.hotbikeweb.com/tech/0808_hbkp_dyno_tuning_for_engine/index.html
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INTIMIDA2OR
Needs a life
RED rider!
Posts: 13081
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posted September 14, 2009 06:00 PM
quote:
no one is checking out the boring 160hp thread.. hell, i wouldnt either if i were someone else.
Well on that note ... My Red 14 put down only 157hp on the dyno of our very own Kerry Bryant. IMHO I think the operator was scared and didn't twist the throttle far enough 
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'06 Passion Red ZX-14
*Lee*
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eklipse636
Needs a life
ZX-14
Posts: 6046
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posted September 14, 2009 06:20 PM
quote:
quote:
no one is checking out the boring 160hp thread.. hell, i wouldnt either if i were someone else.
Well on that note ... My Red 14 put down only 157hp on the dyno of our very own Kerry Bryant. IMHO I think the operator was scared and didn't twist the throttle far enough
Thinking of that, it was Mr. Mike Jones that is a suzuki fan!! Any of you than race around here know him. Red busa, red and white leathers... Great guy!
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Best: 60ft 1.351 1/8 5.68 mph 123.98 1/4
8.89 mph 151.32
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masszx14
Pro
A mind beside itself!
Posts: 1806
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posted September 14, 2009 07:27 PM
I'm not going to disagree with Shane as far as the gering changes
and how that affects dyno #s.
16/48 is the stock gearing on the R6 and those little 600 cc need all
the peak hp since they are pure lightweight track weapons.
I'm just saying that they wouldn't have been geared so low from the
factory if that was robbing the already small displacement hp.
It is the gospel for cars though- shorter gears net lower hp numbers and
that is well covered on many car forums.
I'm talking myself in circles here, eh.
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universal@mind
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INTIMIDA2OR
Needs a life
RED rider!
Posts: 13081
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posted September 14, 2009 08:54 PM
quote:
quote:
quote:
no one is checking out the boring 160hp thread.. hell, i wouldnt either if i were someone else.
Well on that note ... My Red 14 put down only 157hp on the dyno of our very own Kerry Bryant. IMHO I think the operator was scared and didn't twist the throttle far enough
Thinking of that, it was Mr. Mike Jones that is a suzuki fan!! Any of you than race around here know him. Red busa, red and white leathers... Great guy!
Where does he race at?
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'06 Passion Red ZX-14
*Lee*
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted September 15, 2009 05:04 AM
quote:
I'm not going to disagree with Shane as far as the gering changes
and how that affects dyno #s.
16/48 is the stock gearing on the R6 and those little 600 cc need all
the peak hp since they are pure lightweight track weapons.
I'm just saying that they wouldn't have been geared so low from the
factory if that was robbing the already small displacement hp.
It is the gospel for cars though- shorter gears net lower hp numbers and
that is well covered on many car forums.
I'm talking myself in circles here, eh.
Stan, the actual power output of the engine is not changing. It's measured output is changing due to the way the dyno measures the power, and the way the engine is loaded.
As I say, I have numerous pulls on my bike in different gears on the same day, and the measured output is different from gear to gear.
You can't really compare a 16,000 rpm 600 to a 1352cc machine. Also, you can't directly compare two bikes with different internal transmission ratios, but equal sprocket sizes. You also have to factor in the torque multiplication, which is really the key.
Shane
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BIGZXDADDY
Expert Class
Posts: 270
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posted September 15, 2009 02:29 PM
the lower gearing on the r6 does not increase peak hp it increases torque at the wheel to get it moving from a stand still. the sky- high rev limit allows respectable peak hp. gear changes manipulate torque to the rear wheel , one of the factors in the hp equation is torque so how anyone could think that a gearing change won't affect rwhp is beyond me. air/fuel ratios like most things are a compromise.in general the leaner the burn the more btu's are released from the fuel but too lean and your engine melts.the target ratio for carbs and programmed fi is usually around 13:1 while closed loop systems target is 14.7:1. that ratio is not simply for emissions reasons because it causes as many problems as it solves. the ratio would be much leaner if engine materials could handle the heat and if the production of nox were avoidable. as far as getting a true hp# from a bike dyno, good luck. these dynos are much more suited for measuring hp changes than a written in stone number. dyno #'s also don't count in the real world because the bike never went anywhere it just spun a drum around and around. accelerating a mass from dead stop over a measured distance in a measured time= measured performance. my .02 cents
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"never drive faster than you can see, besides it's all in the reflexes"
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Sticks_n_Stones
Needs a job
Posts: 3930
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posted September 16, 2009 12:19 PM
quote:
I'm not going to disagree with Shane as far as the gering changes
and how that affects dyno #s.
It is the gospel for cars though- shorter gears net lower hp numbers and
that is well covered on many car forums..
quote:
how do you lose hp with a 16-48? lol
wee
quote:
maybe I should say, what gearing will give me the most hp?
wee
Bikes have sprockets and chains: smaller sprockets are lighter to turn but have higher frictional values due to how far each link has to rotate while under a ever increasing individual load as the teeth dissapear on the smallest sprocket. Gets so bad around the 14 tooth mark that you will see chains breaking on a regular basis-- which is why guys dont run that low, especially on high HP bikes! The "Ideal" setup IMO would be something over 30 teeth for both front and rear sprockets. Good luck racing with that though!
Cars differential gears are different but same concept: the higher the torque multiplying factor (gearing number) the smaller the pinion gear has to be to get that ratio (and bigger the ring gear). Thats a big reason why the classic Ford 9" (9" ring gear) is so popular with hot rodders: it is big enough to handle any realistic ring gear number, with a beefy pinion bearing area to handle the smaller toothed pinion gears.
____________
'06 zx14
Muzzy M10/M14
PCIII w/ Muzzy map
Flies out K&N in!
bits n pieces...
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Superman T
Pro
Posts: 1831
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posted September 16, 2009 12:56 PM
Sticks_n_Stones- I did a 360 reading your post.... Huh?
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biggmoinc
Zone Head
Posts: 747
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posted September 16, 2009 04:17 PM
i aint happy wit my numbers either exclipse, I know i got a friday bike, lol. Matter of fact i think my builder actually fininshed mine up on a sunday, As long as i can ride it to the track, race it, n ride it back home wit no problems i'll continue to get faster by practice, lol. All else fails, spray the bit#$! nah just playin! I know i shouldve bought a 14, matter of fact, who wants buy a superfast 12 that looks good! Oh never mind, u probably already read my other posts, good try ne way huh?
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07 ZX14 bmc filter, muzzy m14, 16/44,66",auto shift, 6'3, 204lbs/1.54/3.99/6.03@120/7.8/9.32@147
biggmo@aol.com
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eklipse636
Needs a life
ZX-14
Posts: 6046
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posted September 16, 2009 04:58 PM
I'm scared to spray it with it being like yours, a weekend built bike... A 20shot might blow it to pieces!
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Best: 60ft 1.351 1/8 5.68 mph 123.98 1/4
8.89 mph 151.32
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