kawasakijockey
Pro
Posts: 1876
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posted November 16, 2008 11:11 PM
There are a couple of ways to find out. Grind a corner on the sprocket nut or get a Speedohealer from Schnitz. I find it strange that you have mph'd 155 without a healer and mine would never pull over 146. You know, the roadrace tires you use usually have a taller profile than the Shinko that I use. I know this is true for my Bridgestones on my roadrace bike. Measure your tire height and I will measure mine for comparison. This will definately make a difference in speed.
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Get on the shortbus boys 'cause its time to get schooled.
2007 ZX-14
1.38 60ft
9.03 @ 149mph
8.95 @153 small shot n2o
8.68 @160mph 5lbs boost
  
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ninjaboy311
Zone Head
Posts: 940
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posted November 16, 2008 11:56 PM
That may have something to do with it, I do run the 180-55, which is taller. How do you want me to measure it? All the way around the rim?
____________
Naarden Speedlinks Sponsored Rider
Schnitz Racing Sponsored Rider
8.74 @ 152 on stock motor and MR9 (Muzzy Powered), 205 lbs suited
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kawasakijockey
Pro
Posts: 1876
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posted November 17, 2008 12:17 AM
Just from the ground to the peak height of the tire.
____________
Get on the shortbus boys 'cause its time to get schooled.
2007 ZX-14
1.38 60ft
9.03 @ 149mph
8.95 @153 small shot n2o
8.68 @160mph 5lbs boost
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ninjaboy311
Zone Head
Posts: 940
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posted November 17, 2008 12:31 AM
Ok. I'll get it later today. I'm at work right now.
____________
Naarden Speedlinks Sponsored Rider
Schnitz Racing Sponsored Rider
8.74 @ 152 on stock motor and MR9 (Muzzy Powered), 205 lbs suited
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KZScott
Needs a life
high on speed
Posts: 7235
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posted November 17, 2008 04:01 AM
hey Gerard, the limiter on the 12 is fuel kill, and it goes bang pop ect ect when you hit it on the track(i forgot to turn the air bottle on....opps lol) not saying the 14 is the same, but why would they change it? hmmm
Shane measured the Michelin vs the Shinko not too long ago, he found the difference to be about 1 tooth down on the rear switching from the Shinko to the Michelin.
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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06redzx14
Pro
Posts: 1022
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posted November 17, 2008 05:48 AM
Here ya go guys. Shane had already measured them check page 10 of his build thread. It looks like the 180/55 would be the equivalent to running 16/43
Some more detailed measurements comparing the Shinko setup with the Power Race on the 12R wheel. Circumference measured with a tape, height calculated and verified with tape:
Approximate Circumference:
Shinko - 77"
Michelin - 79.25"
Approximate Height:
Shinko - 24.51"
Michelin - 25.23"
Approximate weight:
Shinko on stock wheel: 34.5 lbs.
Michelin on 12R wheel: 29.5 lbs.
Again, all of these measurements are approximations. I am using simple measuring devices and some math.
Based on what I have measured, the Power Race will raise the rear of the bike over 1/3 of an inch. It will also be the equivalent of removing a tooth from the rear sprocket, due to it's increased circumference. And finally, it will place the tire over 1/3 of an inch closer to the undertail. This could become an issue with hard launches.
I am on the fence as to whether I want to mess with it just yet. I'm not sure it is worth the trouble without making some other adjusments to the bike, such as ride height and undertail clearance.
Shane
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06 alien head, no flies, PC+hub, 16/45 44 43, air shifter, dry shot
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kawasakijockey
Pro
Posts: 1876
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posted November 17, 2008 08:08 AM
Just measured mine on the bike with the bike balanced straight up setting the back tire on the ground. With a carpenters level from the high point of the tire to ground it measures 24inches even. The tire is not brand new and is still rounded with lots of tread but I had to add the worn tread depth back to the tire by measuring the outside tread depth that doesnt get worn. The tires total mounted diameter is 24.187inches with tread restored.
On my Honda roadracer, .75 inches in tire height difference called for a 2 tooth rear sprocket change. I changed the front -1. This is apples and oranges in comparison to the zx14 but it makes for logical reasoning just the same. One tooth on the rear will make a good difference when close to 150 mph. We will see what Ninjaboy comes back with and try to figure what ratio is what.
____________
Get on the shortbus boys 'cause its time to get schooled.
2007 ZX-14
1.38 60ft
9.03 @ 149mph
8.95 @153 small shot n2o
8.68 @160mph 5lbs boost
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kawasaki_rick
Zone Head
Posts: 512
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posted November 17, 2008 08:46 AM
Ive run 163 mph with no speedohealer, 16\43 geared. So i dont see how this will affect you guys running in the 150s. Just my 2 cents. thats with a short 190\50 shinko.
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kawasakijockey
Pro
Posts: 1876
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posted November 17, 2008 08:58 AM
Maybe the speed limiters vary bike to bike that much. Maybe that 1 tooth is leaving a little something on the table for Ninjaboy to try.
____________
Get on the shortbus boys 'cause its time to get schooled.
2007 ZX-14
1.38 60ft
9.03 @ 149mph
8.95 @153 small shot n2o
8.68 @160mph 5lbs boost
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kawasakijockey
Pro
Posts: 1876
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posted November 17, 2008 09:14 AM
BTW using online calculators, my bike would have had to pick up 14.5hp to gain 5 mph. 60 degree air compared to 70 degree was not gonna give me that.
____________
Get on the shortbus boys 'cause its time to get schooled.
2007 ZX-14
1.38 60ft
9.03 @ 149mph
8.95 @153 small shot n2o
8.68 @160mph 5lbs boost
|
ninjaboy311
Zone Head
Posts: 940
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posted November 17, 2008 12:19 PM
Ok, I don't a carpenters level, so I'm not all the way accurate, but measuring the tire with the bike standing straight up, it was right about 24.5", and I have pretty good (almost all) tread on the middle of the tire, just installed it 1 race ago.
____________
Naarden Speedlinks Sponsored Rider
Schnitz Racing Sponsored Rider
8.74 @ 152 on stock motor and MR9 (Muzzy Powered), 205 lbs suited
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NINJA12
Needs a job
Posts: 3310
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posted November 17, 2008 03:30 PM
quote:
hey Gerard, the limiter on the 12 is fuel kill, and it goes bang pop ect ect when you hit it on the track(i forgot to turn the air bottle on....opps lol) not saying the 14 is the same, but why would they change it? hmmm
.
Rev limiter vs speed limiter.
Are they the same?
Could be the same but the rev is pretty harsh and speedo is smooth.
I have a 2000 zx12 no speed limiter just RPM and you knew when you hit it.
Idunno.
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serius blk
Zone Head
Posts: 543
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posted November 17, 2008 03:46 PM
i was playing around with the gear commander website. It has tire circ in it now plus the gear and rpm speed. The 180/55 is 76.91 and the 190/50 is 77.9. A diffenet tire which is taller is the 190/55 which is 79.26. Also according to the math on the site with 16/43 you would hit the gov at around 10900 or so if it comes on at exactly 186mph. With the 16/44 gearing and a 180/55 tire you should hit the governor at all in 5th. According to the site it would hit in 6th around 11000. The question is when does the rev limiter come on. what rpm.
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serius blk
Zone Head
Posts: 543
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posted November 17, 2008 03:48 PM
i just thought about it. my fault the computer will read it faster and would come on early without the speedohealer. I was giving info if the speedohealer was intact
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JohnnyRocketZX14
Expert Class
Posts: 207
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posted November 18, 2008 12:22 PM
well i have hit the speed limiter several times and in my experience it feels like the engine just died ( big time) so i see no way it could be possible someone is hitting it and is not sure. its not like a rev limiter its a shutoff
____________
07 ZX14
Brocks Sidewinder, Stretched, lowered, strapped,Drag seat, PCIII W/Hub, No flies, BMC, Speedo Healer, Muzzy NOS/Shifter,
1.41 60, 5.77 1/8th 8.89 1/4
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KZScott
Needs a life
high on speed
Posts: 7235
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posted November 18, 2008 12:43 PM
quote:
quote:
hey Gerard, the limiter on the 12 is fuel kill, and it goes bang pop ect ect when you hit it on the track(i forgot to turn the air bottle on....opps lol) not saying the 14 is the same, but why would they change it? hmmm
.
Rev limiter vs speed limiter.
Are they the same?
Could be the same but the rev is pretty harsh and speedo is smooth.
I have a 2000 zx12 no speed limiter just RPM and you knew when you hit it.
Idunno.
my 01 is limited to 186mph (with stock gearing and tire sizes*) by a lower rev limit in 6th gear. I think its around 10500 rpm where every other gear is 11600. your 00 has the normal revlimiter in 6th of 11600, and mine does now that i put in a muzzy bonny box. is the 14 speed limiter based on the speedo or the tach and gear position like the 12? that could be the kicker. from the sounds of things its the speedo because some guys say a speedo healer will let them go faster. the lower you gear your bike the faster it registers compared to actual speed. since Pat has the taller tire which gives him effectivly a tooth higher gearing, his speedo wouldnt show quite as high as a guy running the same sprockets but running a shinko, and going the same actual speed. my bike will register over 200 mph with drag gearing(actual speed low 160s), they must be showing speeds of about 186 on the speedo when they trap around 155. I bet the 14 has a more advanced speed limiter, gradual not harsh like the 12. it would be far easier on parts, and big K knows that
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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JohnnyRocketZX14
Expert Class
Posts: 207
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posted November 18, 2008 01:09 PM
mine didnt bang or pop it simply shut down, it never died but its like it went to a idle rpm. There is no mistaking it, it felt like the bike just ran out of gas but as soon as the speed droped below the limit it turned back on.
For those of you who have a healer (and dont have a place to test at top speed) you can adjust it in the other direction so the speedometer reads 200mph at slow speeds and confirm this. i have done it , which is why im saying i dont see it possible that a healer can increase your 1/4mi speed unless you are hitting the limiter and you would know without question that you are
Just my 2 cents lol
____________
07 ZX14
Brocks Sidewinder, Stretched, lowered, strapped,Drag seat, PCIII W/Hub, No flies, BMC, Speedo Healer, Muzzy NOS/Shifter,
1.41 60, 5.77 1/8th 8.89 1/4
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serius blk
Zone Head
Posts: 543
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posted November 18, 2008 02:42 PM
i have my healer set way off. I use my tach to gauge my speed. My tach goes between 115 and 12k then the rev limiter kicks in.
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pazx14rider
Zone Head
Posts: 953
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posted November 18, 2008 03:13 PM
ok may be a dumb question but i gotta ask! How much do you gain by changing the gearing? im going 147mph through the traps at the top of 3rd gear, and good pull through all gears. I am planning on changing gearing this spring when i extend the swingarm. im 160lbs suited ,does that make any difference on what gearing to go with? Im also going to run a 30 or 40 shot but not every pass. should that weigh in on my gearing decisions at all?
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serius blk
Zone Head
Posts: 543
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posted November 18, 2008 04:04 PM
at 160 you just need to extend it and maybe go one down in the front. It alot of guess that run good times at your weight. Me being 240 i need the gearing to carry my weight. Ask smokin hes around that weight and runs good times. You can go to the gear commander site to see how the gearing affects the speed.
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kawasakijockey
Pro
Posts: 1876
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posted November 18, 2008 05:57 PM
If I am wrong , I just want to know where my 5mph and 2 tenths came from. Trust me when I say I am not arguing, this happened when the healer was installed. FIIK why..
____________
Get on the shortbus boys 'cause its time to get schooled.
2007 ZX-14
1.38 60ft
9.03 @ 149mph
8.95 @153 small shot n2o
8.68 @160mph 5lbs boost
|
KZScott
Needs a life
high on speed
Posts: 7235
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posted November 18, 2008 09:09 PM
quote:
ok may be a dumb question but i gotta ask! How much do you gain by changing the gearing? im going 147mph through the traps at the top of 3rd gear, and good pull through all gears. I am planning on changing gearing this spring when i extend the swingarm. im 160lbs suited ,does that make any difference on what gearing to go with? Im also going to run a 30 or 40 shot but not every pass. should that weigh in on my gearing decisions at all?
I set my 12 up to run top of 5th thru thru traps on motor so I would have that extra gear for when I use nitrous. but your 14 has way more low end power so you may find gearing like that too agressive unless you go to about a 68 in WB. Im not really sure. the lower you gear it the easier it is on your clutch, but you may have trouble foot shifting the 1-2 shift if you gear it way down, I know I did. air shifter solved that though. with lower gearing you accelerate better, which is the name of the game, unless its so low that it causes wheelie issues. how long are you going?
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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pazx14rider
Zone Head
Posts: 953
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posted November 19, 2008 06:58 AM
I am going to run an air shifter so thats not to be an issue. just going to run extension blocks 6 inches i believe? your thoughts with my weight?
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pissear
Expert Class
Professional Cockis Slap Peer
Posts: 309
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posted November 19, 2008 09:41 AM
Limiter is hooked up to the fuel pump/spark plugs/crank sensor. Crank hits set rpm the coils cut out the fuel pump shuts down, you feel that instant surge back again once you are out of the limiter band. Follow the wires in the shop manuals is this is generic limiter 186 is book speak.
Speaking of lean.. She stops feeding fuel on lift. Water cooling and all that has eliminated the cooling effect like a carb would still suck fuel to cool on lift is same principal but now since the lean is stable, (coolant) you can cut the fuel is now standard procedure a long time ago is follow the cars is it trickles down to bikes is the bikes are the trickle ups. Meaning it is cheaper to build bike engines rather than car engines for final production and shit. Works both ways the trickle tickle of the unplugged. MTV my ride....
Speed healer and tree only mean one thing = Book basics and I quote, "(the signal is missing/unstable range/wiring short/or open)." Say, I just disconnected the sensor is did this act as a speed he-he-tre-me-sea-me-hack-a freebee = HAR-Dee-Hardee Har!
Wezza on the sameahpageah being all book savvy slow ass, 'tune to win?' You see the absolute way the wires send the correct ohm' package to the eCU? You are all banging heads for nothing is the book explained it cold as a nail on the head.
____________
way too much light in the place is shoot the lights out and make it really dark inn year ear is F YO and the bike you clanked in on.
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