smokinzx14
Needs a life
Posts: 10197
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posted February 18, 2008 01:09 PM
Ok guys we have a problem ...Jesse put the bike back on the dyno with the new boost gauge ....Boost hit 12 pounds real fast so they shut the motor down at 8500 and the motor made WAY over 300 hp .... So Jesse pulled out the 8.5 pound spring and install a 5 pound spring and made another pull ... This time it made just over 10 pounds of boost with a 5 pound spring ... I had Jesse check to boost line for leaks and it has NO leaks ...The Boost Doesn't NOT to Creep to 10 pounds it goes to 10 pounds real fast and holds at 10 pounds ... Jesse is going to install a 3.5 pound spring and try again ... My guess it will hit about 8 pounds of boost with the the 3.5 spring .. What i don't understand is why the boost seems to be double the PSI of the spring we are using...
One thing i saw while doing the install was the nipple on the turbo housing is very small while the nipple at the waste gate it very large .. I have the hose fitting both ends without any leaking ..I think it may be causing the boost to double over the spring PSI because the boost signal may be weakend from the mismatched nipples ... That is the only thing i can come up with that may cause this problem ...Anyone got any other Ideas ?? Keep in mind we have NO boost creep, double checked and NO leaks , No split lines , No crimped lines ..
Smokin..
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Smokin Performance Cycles..
Tampa Bay , FL .. Brocks Performance Dealer ..
Gen 2 ZX14R Best ET 8.43 , Best MPH 164.95
  
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brent davis
Zone Head
Posts: 504
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posted February 18, 2008 01:31 PM
Good grief man over 300 HP at just 8500 RPM's! Man is that thing going to be a bear once you get the 6-8 psi of boost in it that you guys want. THANKS for that info Smokin' and I know you'll keep us posted.
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Black '06 ZX-14
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billeason
Zone Head
Posts: 711
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posted February 18, 2008 01:52 PM
Thats a good eye lee, That little bit can make a differance. Also sometimes the spring rating don't mean crap. I have not seen one that far off though. What was the hp with the 5lb spring, was it in line with the boost level. I am not familiar with this kit but as you know its a common set up. Are the springs C.L. own design,Just putting some things out there. I have had the waste gate valve bind a little when new,if you get to that point pull the spring and cycle the valve by hand if you can with that type,At this point i'm probably telling you something you know but it should have a smooth motion but no catches or binds at all. I bet that hp pull woke the dyno tuners up, Good luck, bill...
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bill eason
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smokinzx14
Needs a life
Posts: 10197
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posted February 18, 2008 02:01 PM
quote:
Thats a good eye lee, That little bit can make a differance. Also sometimes the spring rating don't mean crap. I have not seen one that far off though. What was the hp with the 5lb spring, was it in line with the boost level. I am not familiar with this kit but as you know its a common set up. Are the springs C.L. own design,Just putting some things out there. I have had the waste gate valve bind a little when new,if you get to that point pull the spring and cycle the valve by hand if you can with that type,At this point i'm probably telling you something you know but it should have a smooth motion but no catches or binds at all. I bet that hp pull woke the dyno tuners up, Good luck, bill...
Bill i had Jesse bench test the waste gate with shop air and the 8.5 spring started poping off right at 8.5 PSI ...That is why i was thinking the boost signal was not getting to the waste gate from the turbo.. It may be getting there but it may be a weak signal....
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Smokin Performance Cycles..
Tampa Bay , FL .. Brocks Performance Dealer ..
Gen 2 ZX14R Best ET 8.43 , Best MPH 164.95
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smokinzx14
Needs a life
Posts: 10197
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posted February 18, 2008 02:06 PM
You can see the size difference of the two nipples in question ..
First picture is the waste gate nipple ..
The second is the nipple in the turbo housing ..
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Smokin Performance Cycles..
Tampa Bay , FL .. Brocks Performance Dealer ..
Gen 2 ZX14R Best ET 8.43 , Best MPH 164.95
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smokinzx14
Needs a life
Posts: 10197
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posted February 18, 2008 02:13 PM
Close up of the small nipple ..
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Smokin Performance Cycles..
Tampa Bay , FL .. Brocks Performance Dealer ..
Gen 2 ZX14R Best ET 8.43 , Best MPH 164.95
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smokinzx14
Needs a life
Posts: 10197
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posted February 18, 2008 02:14 PM
Close up of the small nipple ..
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Smokin Performance Cycles..
Tampa Bay , FL .. Brocks Performance Dealer ..
Gen 2 ZX14R Best ET 8.43 , Best MPH 164.95
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smokinzx14
Needs a life
Posts: 10197
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posted February 18, 2008 02:17 PM
waste gate nipple
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Smokin Performance Cycles..
Tampa Bay , FL .. Brocks Performance Dealer ..
Gen 2 ZX14R Best ET 8.43 , Best MPH 164.95
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SteddyTeddy
Pro
Posts: 1664
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posted February 18, 2008 02:28 PM
 Edited By: SteddyTeddy on 18 Feb 2008 14:29
Perfect example that guages are your friend. Better to have too many than not enough. The nipple on that waste gate was twice a big as the turbo side.
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billeason
Zone Head
Posts: 711
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posted February 18, 2008 02:32 PM
I see what you mean, also you have elimanated the wastegate with the air test and the spring is doing its thing. It almost has to be the signal. I know this sounds like a dump question but the hose check out alright, I have had the hose look fine until you bow it a little and the inside has collasped leaving the outside looking perfectly normal. KInda like a brake line on a car when it gets old. I still think you are on the wright track with the signal. I just thought of something else,Are the ports in the nipples/ ports in the turbine/WG drilled all the way from the manafactory. bill...
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bill eason
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BlackMagic14
Needs a job
Posts: 2058
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posted February 18, 2008 04:26 PM
Damn dont you hate when you make TOOO much power. J/K hope you get it worked out
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bigdtd
Needs a job
Interceptors
Posts: 4209
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posted February 18, 2008 06:20 PM
300hp!!! yikes..... hold on!!!
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2006 Black ZX-14,6 inches over,16/42, flies out,BMC Street Filter,Brock's Street Meg,Brock's Radial Mount Strap,PClll with Race map,Dynojet LCD w/Techmount, ZX-14 fender eliminator,Pilot Power2CTs,Speedohealer,Pazzo Levers,Cox Radiator Guard, Garmin Nuvi 265WT
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dubious
Needs a life
Needs more time to ride!
Posts: 8442
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posted February 18, 2008 08:31 PM
LOL 300HP!
yehaw!
LOL
The small nipple got ya.... go for the big nipples bro! LOL
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natural selection.....
destiny will overcome intervention.
Some are not worthy of the effort.
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stevewfl
Moderator
Posts: 27920
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posted February 18, 2008 10:46 PM
This thread is fantastic!
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2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
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redsnake2
Novice Class
Posts: 73
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posted February 19, 2008 05:11 AM
Hey Smokin. how much was the Kit? I figure if i have a twin turbo car i might as well have a turbo Bike...LOL 300hp on a bike I would never use it but it would be very very cool to have waiting for the twist of the wrist...
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The Blue MUle
Expert Class
Posts: 122
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posted February 19, 2008 06:23 AM
Seems to me that the fitting on the turbo side needs to be enlarged(if possible). The pressure that is finding its way to the wastegate would decrease as it goes from high pressure inside the line to lower pressure , as it exits into a larger diameter orifice, atleast that's the way it works with water
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SeShEeglQ6E
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87gtNOS
Zone Head
Posts: 620
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posted February 19, 2008 08:45 AM
Small = higher pressure, lower volume
Bigger = low pressure, higher volume
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01 ZX12R
07 ZX14 - YEAH BABY!
03 ZX9R-traded in for the 14!!! June 07!
05 636-traded in for the 9 Sept 05
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nightmare
Pro
ACP Racing
Posts: 1797
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posted February 19, 2008 04:44 PM
300hp sounds like one hell of a rodeo! I want to ride!!!! Can't wait to see what's poppin next!
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2006 ZX14 Ninja "SWINE FLU"
60ft 1.23
8th Mile 5.16
ACP Racing
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smokinzx14
Needs a life
Posts: 10197
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posted February 20, 2008 08:46 PM
Edited By: smokinzx14 on 20 Feb 2008 20:49
Big update !!!!!!!!!
Jesse got the boost problem fixed and back on the dyno ...With the tire smoking on an 8 pound spring it made 260 hp ....That is just where we wanted it for our first track testing ... The problem was the port for the waste gate wasn't the right size , Dave fixed it last night by making the port larger ..
Track numbers !!!!!!
Having everything working ( about time ) we headed to Sunshine Speedway for some 1/8 mile testing .. I talked Jesse into me making the first pass ( i didn't want to get Jesse killed on the first pass) I left the line real real soft ( 1.59 60 foot time ) and rolled the throttle on real slow ( i didn't want to get killed either ) The boost came on pretty fast and i hit the rev limiter hard !!! I got it into second gear and pinned the throttle ....It was all over real fast but i thought it was a very very slow pass ...I was thinking it would be a 6.20 @ about 118 ..It felt as i was going pretty slow when i hit the traps ... When i got back to the pits everyone said i was killing ( spinning) the tire the full 1/8 mile pass..... I pulled the ticket from my pocket and it read 5.80 @ 133 ....Damn it didn't feel like 133 MPH pass ~~~!!!
I told Jesse what i felt and told him just to take it real easy on the first pass and Jesse did just what i told him to do ...He had a 1.59 60 footer and i watched as he spun the tire all the way down the track ...Unlike me Jesse stayed off the rev limiter ....My last words before his pass was to stay off the limiter, the bike revs so fast i want you to short shift it ...
His pass was 5.75 @ 135 MPH ~~~!!! Well we know now the bike makes the power and it didn't even try to wheely, so for the next pass i told Jesse to get on it and cut a 1.40 60 footer and lets see what the puppy can do !!! Then the shit hit the fan ....We had 3 friggen cars oil down the track ...At 9:30 the track was back up and running and we were just loading up to make a pass and it started RAINING !!!!!! The race was called for the night ..
Now to a a little more crap as i was loading my bike on the trailer ( raining ) I slipped on my ramp and dumped my zx14 .......SUCKS .....Nothing busted but i did get a few paint chips on my mint 06 zx14 ......  We are heading to BMP 1/4 mile track for Runday sunday so we will have some 1/4 mile numbers for you guys Sunday night ...I feel strongly that we will see some lower 8s Sunday .... 
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Smokin Performance Cycles..
Tampa Bay , FL .. Brocks Performance Dealer ..
Gen 2 ZX14R Best ET 8.43 , Best MPH 164.95
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SteddyTeddy
Pro
Posts: 1664
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posted February 20, 2008 08:55 PM
5.75's and it's only going to get faster as he gets used to it!
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cajunboyz
Zone Head
Posts: 702
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posted February 20, 2008 08:59 PM
Great job, Looks like its going to be a beast, Thanks for keeping us posted
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"Cajun Boyz with Bad Ass Toys"
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BlackMagic14
Needs a job
Posts: 2058
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posted February 20, 2008 09:04 PM
A 5.75 is about what in the quarter?? That sounds awesome. my question is this how do you get a rutbo to hook up, that seems to me like it would be the biggest problem if I got one. Of course I am a little under three hundred and should be back down to 270 soon since I am recovering from my surgery. but If i get one am I gonna have trouble hooking up as well?
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smokinzx14
Needs a life
Posts: 10197
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posted February 20, 2008 09:17 PM
Edited By: smokinzx14 on 20 Feb 2008 21:41
I know you all want to know how i feel about this turbo kit so here it is... The kit is well made and fits very good ... Power is Very very Smooth , it doesn't hit hard at any one spot in the power band like some turbos i have rode ....Jesse took it out on the street and said he rolled the power on in 4th gear and as the power ( boost ) built up it started to wheely ...He said it wasn't an over scary wheely , meaning it was coming up slowly and smooth ..
This turbo unlike others is very controllable, very smooth power band ...This is was what we were looking for because in drag racing smooth is allways faster ... I can say the stage one kit will make a great turbo bike for a guy that does a lot of street riding ...I think at 8 pounds of boost on pump gas you will have a friggin blast !!!!
We are using it just for drag racing and we are going to push this turbo to it's limits....So far it has worked just like Dave at cycle-logicmotorsports said that it would ..Dave said it will make over 425 HP when on kill......I have no reason not to believe him ....
OK guys what i don't like about the kit is the Evac pump ..We have had no problem with the pump that comes with the kit and we may never have a problem with it ....I'm not saying the pump is bad but i would like to see a bigger and better pump for street riding ...cycle-logicmotorsports has a few of the kits on the road and has not problems at all ...I just don't want to get caught 150 miles from home and have that little oil pump take a dump .. This would be an easy upgrade and could be upgraded at a very low cost ... That would make this turbo builit proof in my mind ..Dave has maps for a few different boost levels and his maps seem to be spot on ... But like any turbo kit i would still dyno it and check the map just to make sure .. Guys there is no free ride with a turbo kit , you need to double check everything ...
I'm not saying this turbo kit is the best because i have no other kit to compair it to ...Remember we are still testing part for drag racing so i can NOT say for sure that it's the best for drag racing ...In time we will be able to answer that question ...
Smokin....
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Smokin Performance Cycles..
Tampa Bay , FL .. Brocks Performance Dealer ..
Gen 2 ZX14R Best ET 8.43 , Best MPH 164.95
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smokinzx14
Needs a life
Posts: 10197
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posted February 20, 2008 09:25 PM
quote:
A 5.75 is about what in the quarter?? That sounds awesome. my question is this how do you get a rutbo to hook up, that seems to me like it would be the biggest problem if I got one. Of course I am a little under three hundred and should be back down to 270 soon since I am recovering from my surgery. but If i get one am I gonna have trouble hooking up as well?
5.75 with NO 60 foot , just wait till i hit 1.30s on this puppy it will be more like 5.40s .. Well at your weight you should hook better than us little 150 pounders !! Look for this thing in the next few weeks to be in the low to mid 8s in the 1/4 mile ..Not bad for a stock parts zx14 motor ...
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Smokin Performance Cycles..
Tampa Bay , FL .. Brocks Performance Dealer ..
Gen 2 ZX14R Best ET 8.43 , Best MPH 164.95
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dubious
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Needs more time to ride!
Posts: 8442
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posted February 21, 2008 04:51 AM
Edited By: dubious on 21 Feb 2008 04:56
Thanks for keeping us posted Smokin!
Is 300 HP on PUMP FUEL acheivable with proper pistons?
What are u using to pull timing out?
I often am 400 miles away from home, or truck and trailer.
If a high quality evac pump is used , do you feel I should be concerned?
Should I focus solely on a system with turbo placed higher, deleting the evac pump?
I am ready to pull the trigger on a Tuyrbo this week, still undecided on which system.
300 streetable HP on pump fuel with external wastegate using FMU is my target.
I would prefer to stay away from complexity of piggyback fuel system if possible, but may wish to use progressive boost control, thus the desire for flexibility of future changes with external wastegate, and piggy back fuel injectors down the road possibly.
Do you think 300 HP is reasonable with FMU and stock injectors?
Thanks,
Lyle
____________
natural selection.....
destiny will overcome intervention.
Some are not worthy of the effort.
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