themadkaw
Expert Class
Posts: 211
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posted August 12, 2008 10:41 AM
i think a weight break would help them alot!! because i think the new rules allow for a larger 4 valve motor.
although not as large as that coffee can slingin' twin though!!
  
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ryan schnitz
Novice Class
Posts: 63
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posted August 12, 2008 11:15 AM
 Edited By: ryan schnitz on 12 Aug 2008 12:18
2 valve and 4 valve are the same displacement. (Rulebook)
George is no god....
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themadkaw
Expert Class
Posts: 211
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posted August 12, 2008 12:38 PM
correct. but before the 4 valve was not even allowed the same displacement as the 2 valve.
thats what i meant by allowing larger 4 valve motors
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TRNorBRN6001
Needs a job
Posts: 2021
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posted August 12, 2008 12:46 PM
Thanks for posting Mr. Schnitz. Hope things go well for both the racing and Muzzy
family stuff.
____________
TFA 200MPH CLUB MEMBER!
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NOX
Needs a job
PMRA / TMRC Super Street 4022
Posts: 3745
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posted August 13, 2008 04:20 AM
quote:
2 valve and 4 valve are the same displacement. (Rulebook)
George is no god....
My bad, I had forgot about the rules change.........
How many riders has he put on the podium????? No he is no god, but he is one of the top 5 crew chiefs out there, and probably top three.
____________
42 Wins
21 Runner-ups
2010 TMRC Super Street Points Champion
2010 PMRA Super Street #3 Points
2009 PMRA Super Street Points Runner-Up
6 Time Centerville Dragway Points Champion
Sponsored by:
Scorpion Helmets
Galfer Braking
AMSOIL
Steve's Speed Shop
Kawasaki Sports Center
Mickey Thompson Tires
Catalyst Racing Composites
Conway Cycle
Syed Leathers
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Cajunboyz
Zone Head
Posts: 702
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posted August 13, 2008 04:40 AM
Rob CAN DO IT, just need the BIG $$$$$ thrown at his team as Harley did to Vance & Hines.
____________
"Cajun Boyz with Bad Ass Toys"
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Y2KZX12R
Needs a job
CompetitionCNC.com
Posts: 3762
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posted August 16, 2008 06:38 AM
One thing to remember is that the productioncylinder heads for the, zx14, busa, zx12r etc. are designed to make torque from low and mid range rpms for the street.
The design goals are totally different from a cylinder head just designed for max hp output at full throttle. When you take out the need for good throttle response and midrange torque the ports can be very different.
The production castings have limitations to the porting that can be done due to the spring pocket locations and also water jacket design.
I've been battling this with the big stage 3 Busa head we offer. There just isnt enough room for a port that will produce 330hp without some SERIOUS rework.
Our stage 3 busa head as produced 248hp and were still looking for more.
____________
Y2KZX12R
CompetitionCNC.com
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GUNNER
Needs a life
Posts: 5778
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posted August 16, 2008 10:41 AM
quote:
2 valve and 4 valve are the same displacement. (Rulebook)
George is no god....
The last time you won over there wasn't it on a Harley that GEORGE ( the man that isn't a god) Bryce supplied you and Rob the motor for? Hmmmmmm ??? Yea I believe so.... And answer me this....
How hard did Ol Rob have to swallow when he made that call to George to BUY his power??? Wouldn't that be like the biggest slap in the face that a World Class Engine designer / Builder have to face?? Having to say........... " I can't do it WILL YOU SELL ME POWER so I can taste victory again "" Yes I do believe that would sting......
I haven't seen George buying power from anyone in the 20 plus years I have known him.. I suppose that puts him just a notch or TEN above ol Rob now don't it....
Trying and failing has no shame attached........... Buying power when you are a Engine Guru ( self Proclaimed or not) is nothing but sham.....
____________
There's no such thing as a motor with no more power to give only people with no more intelligence to get it
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countersteer
Needs a job
Didn't read the owners manual
Posts: 2207
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posted August 16, 2008 10:59 PM
____________
Scott
Long Island, New York
2006 ZX-14, 2003 ZX-12R
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dubious
Needs a life
Needs more time to ride!
Posts: 8442
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posted August 16, 2008 11:16 PM
Edited By: dubious on 17 Aug 2008 00:40
oh boy...
In response to Gunnar:
I have never been afraid to admit when I can learn from someone...
that is the epitome, or ultimate form of ignorance, for if we think we know it all, we stop learning...
If we buy technology from someone who is unable to market it effectively, and they are compensated fairly, then it is a MUTUAL business arrangement.
Education usually costs us one way or another. Time or money.
Marketing a product has at least as much to do with business as the development of it.
what I am saying is that if he had help developing a product and it was public knowledge, and he did not proclaim it all of his own, there is no shame in that.
Service needs to follow development very closely.
In other words, you need a good product, you need to market it, and you need to provide great service to your customer.
That is alot of responsibility for any person to chase.
I have other opinions and a perspectives but withdraw at this point.
Anyone doing anything positive for the sport is good in my eyes!
Good luck Ryan, and thanks for the awesome business service your familly provides.
You have excellent staff, and it is always a pleasure.
____________
natural selection.....
destiny will overcome intervention.
Some are not worthy of the effort.
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1badzx12r
Needs a life
Posts: 8321
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posted August 17, 2008 05:16 AM
quote:
oh boy...
In response to Gunnar:
I have never been afraid to admit when I can learn from someone...
that is the epitome, or ultimate form of ignorance, for if we think we know it all, we stop learning...
If we buy technology from someone who is unable to market it effectively, and they are compensated fairly, then it is a MUTUAL business arrangement.
Education usually costs us one way or another. Time or money.
Marketing a product has at least as much to do with business as the development of it.
what I am saying is that if he had help developing a product and it was public knowledge, and he did not proclaim it all of his own, there is no shame in that.
Service needs to follow development very closely.
In other words, you need a good product, you need to market it, and you need to provide great service to your customer.
That is alot of responsibility for any person to chase.
I have other opinions and a perspectives but withdraw at this point.
Anyone doing anything positive for the sport is good in my eyes!
Good luck Ryan, and thanks for the awesome business service your familly provides.
You have excellent staff, and it is always a pleasure.
you been hanging around deputy greg dog to long.... and it shows
____________
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S06nIz4scvI
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GUNNER
Needs a life
Posts: 5778
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posted August 17, 2008 06:55 AM
Edited By: GUNNER on 17 Aug 2008 08:08
quote:
oh boy...
In response to Gunnar:
I have never been afraid to admit when I can learn from someone...
that is the epitome, or ultimate form of ignorance, for if we think we know it all, we stop learning...
If we buy technology from someone who is unable to market it effectively, and they are compensated fairly, then it is a MUTUAL business arrangement.
Education usually costs us one way or another. Time or money.
Marketing a product has at least as much to do with business as the development of it.
what I am saying is that if he had help developing a product and it was public knowledge, and he did not proclaim it all of his own, there is no shame in that.
Service needs to follow development very closely.
In other words, you need a good product, you need to market it, and you need to provide great service to your customer.
That is alot of responsibility for any person to chase.
I have other opinions and a perspectives but withdraw at this point.
Anyone doing anything positive for the sport is good in my eyes!
Good luck Ryan, and thanks for the awesome business service your familly provides.
You have excellent staff, and it is always a pleasure.
Lyle..
I fail to understand WTF you are talking about.... Have you moved to the Middle East because all that BABBLE must mean you now reside inside the tower of Babylon...
Again....... A lot of race teams buy their power, and in fact most do.. BUT NOT a team that proclaims to be a engine building company... That's about like Coke buying Soda pop from Pepsi and putting it in their bottle because their own product taste like SHIT!!!!!!!!
AND on the marketing side of things George has that covered as well because every Harley with the exception of the TWO Vance and Hines bikes are complete packages that are sold by George. NOTICE they all are the same bike with different paint.. I would have to say George has that covered at this point in time.. George didn't do it all by his self either and made that clear from the start. S&S was partnered with him on the motor project. He helped with the R&D and total winning package. It was George and George that made that happen.
Let me help you get my point because the one you made don't have a point..
NO ONE was saying that Ryan's family didn't provide good service in the parts business.... This is about Rob Muzzy's company that proclaims to be an ENGINE building and design company having to PURCHASE their own racing motors from none other than GEORGE BRYCE... And Ryan having the balls to say George ain't got it going on.....WHEN the last time he or Rob tasted victory in the NHRA ranks they had George's power under their ass.. Oh they never wanted anyone to think anything other than they designed all that and went out and were instant V-Twin hero's... We can dig up the old post where they had many chances to set the record strait and didn't.. Muzzy's came off a ZX12R project that never netted them ANYTHING other than as you put it A BUNCH OF PARTS THAT MADE STREET BIKES A LITTLE FASTER... Rob made money (good for him) but the 12R Pro Stock project SUCKED MONKEY NUTS !! His mighty 10R turbo project race bike to the best of my knowledge never whipped ass either..
Marketing is Robs strong suit these days... On that I give him an A PLUS.... He develops products off a racing budget and markets them to the masses. Pretty smart when you think about it.. Rob gets rich and his racing program looks like Helen Keller is running it.... All except they do take a pretty picture all suited up standing beside what should be a winning rocket....
SO WHAT DOES ALL THIS MEAN?
It means that Rob can win races if he has the power to do so. He can manage a race team and make some tuning calls good enough to win his share. The man has a history that can't be denied. It means Rob knows business very well and I see many more Lambo's in Ol Robs future. It means there is plenty of wax for that stash he sports..... But to anyone holding their breath hoping he gets that 14 in the winners circle in the NHRA it means they will pass out and fall to the ground--------------------> Unless George Bryce , Byron Hines or Coby Adams decides to develop a motor program and once more Rob BUYS SOME POWER.....
As for Ryan....................You are a great rider going to waste on that project..
GUNNAR he called me........ Hmmmmm???? I kinda like that .... Could you place a Mr. in front of that and let's see how that tastes... ................ Yes yes IT SINGS !!!
____________
There's no such thing as a motor with no more power to give only people with no more intelligence to get it
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dubious
Needs a life
Needs more time to ride!
Posts: 8442
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posted August 17, 2008 02:05 PM
This post was much more informative, and alot less of a bitch slap to anyone.
Thanks for educating me!
____________
natural selection.....
destiny will overcome intervention.
Some are not worthy of the effort.
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kaw now
Expert Class
Posts: 446
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posted August 17, 2008 03:47 PM
OK gunner thanks for the soap as the wheel turns in pro stock. Now did you know Pratt&Whitney built GE 404 F18 engines under contract from the gov't what does that make them? Money. I think the bike can be a marketing tool as he sees fit, so what.
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dubious
Needs a life
Needs more time to ride!
Posts: 8442
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posted August 17, 2008 05:35 PM
____________
natural selection.....
destiny will overcome intervention.
Some are not worthy of the effort.
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GUNNER
Needs a life
Posts: 5778
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posted August 17, 2008 06:33 PM
quote:
OK gunner thanks for the soap as the wheel turns in pro stock. Now did you know Pratt&Whitney built GE 404 F18 engines under contract from the gov't what does that make them? Money. I think the bike can be a marketing tool as he sees fit, so what.
You are welcome... Anytime you want to be educated just make a stupid comment and I'll try and help you... Remember REMEMBER REMEMBER-------- > GUNNER is FUNNER
____________
There's no such thing as a motor with no more power to give only people with no more intelligence to get it
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countersteer
Needs a job
Didn't read the owners manual
Posts: 2207
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posted August 17, 2008 06:40 PM
quote:
...Rob gets rich and his racing program looks like Helen Keller is running it...
...I see many more Lambo's in Ol Robs future. It means there is plenty of wax for that stash he sports...
LOL quotes of the year go to -> GUNNER!
____________
Scott
Long Island, New York
2006 ZX-14, 2003 ZX-12R
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dubious
Needs a life
Needs more time to ride!
Posts: 8442
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posted August 17, 2008 07:30 PM
Edited By: dubious on 17 Aug 2008 20:31
ARE ASSHOLES BORN?
OR MADE?
____________
natural selection.....
destiny will overcome intervention.
Some are not worthy of the effort.
|
GUNNER
Needs a life
Posts: 5778
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posted August 17, 2008 08:05 PM
quote:
ARE ASSHOLES BORN?
OR MADE?
Well if Muzzy's made them than they wouldn't be very fast ones..... 
____________
There's no such thing as a motor with no more power to give only people with no more intelligence to get it
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NOX
Needs a job
PMRA / TMRC Super Street 4022
Posts: 3745
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posted August 17, 2008 08:26 PM
I think the main point that was being made is........
You do not bring a knife to a gun fight.
I do believe the dead horse has been beaten enough. I do wish the zx14 would do well, as I like Kaw's, but I believe the last time that Kaw won, was when Geno Scali did it several years back.
____________
42 Wins
21 Runner-ups
2010 TMRC Super Street Points Champion
2010 PMRA Super Street #3 Points
2009 PMRA Super Street Points Runner-Up
6 Time Centerville Dragway Points Champion
Sponsored by:
Scorpion Helmets
Galfer Braking
AMSOIL
Steve's Speed Shop
Kawasaki Sports Center
Mickey Thompson Tires
Catalyst Racing Composites
Conway Cycle
Syed Leathers
|
dubious
Needs a life
Needs more time to ride!
Posts: 8442
|
posted August 17, 2008 08:35 PM
quote:
quote:
ARE ASSHOLES BORN?
OR MADE?
Well if Muzzy's made them than they wouldn't be very fast ones.....
But they might be Green!
____________
natural selection.....
destiny will overcome intervention.
Some are not worthy of the effort.
|
ryan schnitz
Novice Class
Posts: 63
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posted August 18, 2008 07:39 AM
quote:
quote:
2 valve and 4 valve are the same displacement. (Rulebook)
George is no god....
The last time you won over there wasn't it on a Harley that GEORGE ( the man that isn't a god) Bryce supplied you and Rob the motor for? Hmmmmmm ??? Yea I believe so.... And answer me this....
How hard did Ol Rob have to swallow when he made that call to George to BUY his power??? Wouldn't that be like the biggest slap in the face that a World Class Engine designer / Builder have to face?? Having to say........... " I can't do it WILL YOU SELL ME POWER so I can taste victory again "" Yes I do believe that would sting......
I haven't seen George buying power from anyone in the 20 plus years I have known him.. I suppose that puts him just a notch or TEN above ol Rob now don't it....
Trying and failing has no shame attached........... Buying power when you are a Engine Guru ( self Proclaimed or not) is nothing but sham.....
Rob Muzzy built chassis, S&S supplied engine... same engine George buys from S&S.... What do you have to say to that? I know goerge had input into the engine design... using GS Suzuki based tech (roller bearings) and transmission/clutch. But, S&S built that engine and did all of the development.
Trying and failing has no shame, but it does bring asses out of the woodwork who think they could do better... or know someone who could...
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zrxdean
Needs a job
Posts: 2225
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posted August 18, 2008 07:51 AM
Good luck Ryan, you and ROb will get your day I'm sure. -Dean
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MadnessRacing
Pro
Vmax and Busa Beater
Posts: 1140
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posted August 18, 2008 09:39 AM
Ryan I have a lot of faith that you guys are gonna make it sooner or later!!
____________
Shorty's Performance
Team Madness Racing
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ninjaboy311
Zone Head
Posts: 940
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posted August 18, 2008 11:08 AM
Keep doing your thing Ryan. I for one realize that it takes time to design, build, and test an all new bike and engine package from scratch, especially when you are limited to what you can do. If it were so easy, everyone would be building a Pro Stock bike. I guess it just goes to show you why they (NHRA) have barely been filling the 16-bike field lately.
Since some of y'all know so much, then obviously you must know what Rob must do to find more horsepower. Feel free to give him a call, I'm sure he's open for suggestions since y'all seem to know more than he does.
____________
Naarden Speedlinks Sponsored Rider
Schnitz Racing Sponsored Rider
8.74 @ 152 on stock motor and MR9 (Muzzy Powered), 205 lbs suited
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