posted August 12, 2006 06:01 PM
How to get rid of popping and backfiring on decel I think I have a solution for those of you who have the problem of popping/backfiring on decel with an aftermarket exhaust and PC3 (this worked for me with the Brock Gen 3 full system on my 14)
1st, I'm assuming that you already have the kleen air system blocked off..if not, do that 1st.
2nd, I also assume that you have a good map, matched to your exhaust setup, not some seat of the pants homebrew map.
Even with Brock's map and the Kleen air blockoff, I had the problem...bad...it popped and backfired quite loudly all the time (on decel). Today, I lowered my idle speed back to what it was when they 1st delivered the bike to me (850 RPM). The problem is 98% gone...I will set the TPS with the PC3 software and that should eliminate most of the soot and the most of the rest of the popping/backfiring. It's running so quite & smooth on decel now, that you wouldn't know an aftermarket exhaust was installed.
Engine chugs at idle a bit (like the Busa) with the low idle now, but demonstrates absolutely no ill effects and it doesn't come close to a stall, ever.
PS. my idle speed was about 1250 before I had the idea to try bringing it down...
posted August 12, 2006 07:31 PM
Funny you should post this today. I have a fully Muzzy system with a PCIII and a Muzzy map. Blocked off the reed valves just this morning and went for a ride this afternoon. Same popping on deceleration. I too adjusted my idle up to 1300 rpm (approx.) Will adjust it down to factory spec (around1K) or perhaps lower and see what happens.
Curious to know what idle rpms have to do with the problem.......
posted August 12, 2006 08:03 PM
Thanks for ther tip Fastestbusa,
I took my idle down to about 1000 from 1150. I'll try it down a little lower also.
I did find that all of my header bolts were a little on the loose side. I don't know if that helped or not.
How do you adjust the TPS sensor with the PC III? I didn't recall seeing that on the map install software.
Also, while installing a Powerlet adapter tonight I noticed an info sticker under the left side George Forman Grill that stated the timing was supposed to be at 10 degrees BTDC. I wonder how that is adjusted. Is there a wire that has to be removed before any changes can be made?
I was on powercommander.com checking out the ignition module to see if anything was uodated lately for the ZX-14. The dyno chart they show to demonstrate the Rev Xtend is for an R1. I read a while back where the bike makes about 20 extra foot pounds of torque and 20 HP more in the midrange in 5th gear than it does in 3rd gear.
I wonder if the timing module would help bring the lower gears up to the same power levels as 5th and 6th?
quote:Also, while installing a Powerlet adapter tonight I noticed an info sticker under the left side George Forman Grill that stated the timing was supposed to be at 10 degrees BTDC. I wonder how that is adjusted.
posted August 12, 2006 10:26 PM
i chopped the left pipe off and capped it. then removed the baffles,cat, and this other screen looking thing from the right can. my bike is still stock. I have popping on decel (not concerned). however, i have a backfire at 3,500 rpm on decel. my question is, can the backfire be cured by reducing idle speed???
posted August 13, 2006 01:22 AM
Slotted cam sprokets???? That would adjust the CAM timing. The sticker under the George Foreman grill is talking about the ignition timing.
posted August 13, 2006 03:29 AM
Edited By: fastestbusaaround on 13 Aug 2006 04:30
quote:Thanks for ther tip Fastestbusa,
I took my idle down to about 1000 from 1150. I'll try it down a little lower also.
I did find that all of my header bolts were a little on the loose side. I don't know if that helped or not.
How do you adjust the TPS sensor with the PC III? I didn't recall seeing that on the map install software.
Also, while installing a Powerlet adapter tonight I noticed an info sticker under the left side George Forman Grill that stated the timing was supposed to be at 10 degrees BTDC. I wonder how that is adjusted. Is there a wire that has to be removed before any changes can be made?
I was on powercommander.com checking out the ignition module to see if anything was uodated lately for the ZX-14. The dyno chart they show to demonstrate the Rev Xtend is for an R1. I read a while back where the bike makes about 20 extra foot pounds of torque and 20 HP more in the midrange in 5th gear than it does in 3rd gear.
I wonder if the timing module would help bring the lower gears up to the same power levels as 5th and 6th?
posted August 13, 2006 06:56 AM
FBA, when you reset the TPS please let us know what you did. When I rejetted the carbs on my Yamaha FZ1 I had to make major changes to the TPS in order to get the full benefit of rejetting. I haven't done a thing to the TPS on the 14 since I installed the Gen 3 and Brock's map. There might be some good results achieved by playing with the TPS.
I'm confused as to how setting the idle speed has an impact on the backfiring. Can anyone elaborate and provide a reason? My backfire occurs during a decel when the rpm is still way above idle speed. I'm not saying this doesn't help, just wondering why. My idle speed has been set from day 1 at 1000 rpm.
Htosado, the KLEEN air system injects air into the exhaust during a decel to help burn any unburned fuel, thus reducing emissions. If you download my instructions for installing Brock's GEN3 exhaust it includes instructions on blocking the system. If you don't have the little cap that Brock (and perhaps Muzzy) provide, then go to a hardware store and buy a rubber stopper. Just set it up so it won't fall out of the airbox. To download my instructions you will need to use the copyand paste method as a clickable link won't work for some reason. Copy the following link and paste into your browser's address bar:
Needs a life
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posted August 13, 2006 11:19 AM
Guys, you are not resetting the TPS. You are resetting the value the PC3USB sees. That in no way changes the TPS value being read by the ECU. Just a bit of clarification.
____________
82 Gpz750, 84 Ninja 900, 2000 ZX12R (Muzzy Big Bore Kit), *another* 2000 ZX12R (Muzzy custom stroke crank 1341cc motor), 2004 ZZR1200, 2005 ZX10R, 2007 ZX14, 2008 Concours 14, 2014 Versys 650, 2014 Yamaha WR450F, 2015 Ninja H2
posted August 16, 2006 07:29 PM
Guys,
I have a concern:
Low idle speeds can lead to unacceptably low oil pressure!
This is especially true in top end of the engine....head, cam covers, camshafts, followers etc.
The oil pressure light is typically connected to the high pressure areas of the engine : main oil galley, crankshaft, connecting rods etc. This means it could be possible to starve some (low pressure) areas of the engine without tripping the oil pressure light!
The older GSX-R's were bad for this......I'm sure the 14 is a MUCH better design, but I personally would not take the chance without doing some research.
Since I have not compared top end oil pressure with standard vs. lower idle-
I CAN NOT recommend this technique to cure the decel pop. (Sorry Steve)
Deceleration pop is an annoyance... Oil-Starvation can be an ENGINE KILLING!
I am on a long-overdue and well deserved vacation until August 28th.
I will do my best to cure the deceleration pop when I return...
FYI, I have had no real luck this point- but I have also been concentrating more on new product development.
posted August 16, 2006 07:53 PM
There seems to be a fairly common misconception out there (on some of the boards) that adjusting your TPS is like adjusting a clutch cable and you just twist it until the bike runs great.
Nothing is farther from the truth. The TPS rarely "goes out of sync" and odds are if you don't know what you are doing you WILL make things worse.
Keep this in mind if you are thinking about "tweaking" the TPS. Getting the TPS properly synch'ed is not a vise-grip and duct tape procedure.
If you don't really understand it, leave it alone.
I can detail more if anybody wants details but I am sure there are people here who know exactly what I am getting at.
quote:Guys,
I have a concern:
Low idle speeds can lead to unacceptably low oil pressure!
I have zero decel pop, but a quick question regarding the idling comment:
Since putting the Gen3 on my bike appears to be idling around 850-875. I looked at the preloaded map that came in the PC3 (gen3, flies in) just to verify its mapped. If I remember correctly, I'm idling at exactly 853 according to the laptop.
Do I have a reason to be concerned at this RPM? I really like the bike idling at this engine speed.
posted August 19, 2006 01:12 PM
Well, I'll give it a shot. Had mine idling at 1K even. I'll bump her down and see if that gets rid of the rest of the popping. Interesting...
posted August 21, 2006 10:12 AM
I think the manual says 1,050 to 1,150, I'll check it when I get home.
____________
2006 ZX14, Brock CT-Meg, PC, ignition module, E85, 214 lbs suited, 8.96@152.32 1.46 60'
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posted August 12, 2006 06:01 PM
posted August 12, 2006 07:31 PM
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