fish_antlers
Administrator
The Truth is Out There
Posts: 21894
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posted April 22, 2006 08:26 AM
Break in your bikes.
Don't screw them up. Follow the instructions.
Don't bother with the "motoman" blahblah or any other snake oil.
Listen to the little men in white labcoats and do as they say!
Don't believe me?
There are a wealth of builders and tuners on this site who will tell you the same thing.
-good luck!
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What business is it of yours where I'm from, Friendo?
   
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12r1
Expert Class
Posts: 390
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posted April 22, 2006 08:41 AM
I did my 12 right, and it was always a dependable, strong running machine. Seemed a bit hokey at times, but I think it was well worth it.
jeff
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worm~hole
Needs a life
Miles to go before I sleep....
Posts: 10623
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posted April 22, 2006 09:06 AM
...I set the throttle grip of my 12R to stun from day one and haven't looked back 
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“We sleep safe in our beds because rough men
stand ready in the night to visit violence on those
who would do us harm.”
-George Orwell
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Drowland
Zone Head
Posts: 733
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posted April 22, 2006 09:09 AM
What Bikes? Don't give us no more photoshop pictures or pictures of bikes at dealers.. We know the truth!!!!! LOL
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D
Needs a job
Posts: 3365
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posted April 22, 2006 09:11 AM
quote:
...I set the throttle grip of my 12R to stun from day one and haven't looked back
The ol coil stick to the gonads trick, eh? 
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CrotchRocket
Moderator
Bracket Racing with Betsy
Posts: 8038
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posted April 22, 2006 09:35 AM
Here we go!!!
I always follow the rules!!!...Until the people who set the rules, break the rules!!!...Then I break the rules, but I always get my balls busted when I do???...Why is that??? 
OK, back to motorcycle break ins...Just follow the recomended break in procedure and you'll be allright...
Thats my 
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Jason Miller StreetBike Seminars
*****DragRacers do it better, because they dont cut Corners*****
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fastestbusaaround
Needs a life
I eat Fish...
Posts: 7889
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posted April 22, 2006 10:34 AM
quote:
Don't screw them up. Follow the instructions.
Don't bother with the "motoman" blahblah or any other snake oil.
Listen to the little men in white labcoats and do as they say!
Don't believe me?
There are a wealth of builders and tuners on this site who will tell you the same thing.
-good luck!
Brock has a different view of break-in which was recently explained to me in great detail...nothing like the manual suggests either and BTW, these bikes are already broken in (engine) before they leave Kwak; they are all dynoed at full pin for a few minutes before they leave the factory floor - I have personally witnessed this more than once at the HD factory in York, PA.
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FYYFF!!!
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D
Needs a job
Posts: 3365
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posted April 22, 2006 10:40 AM
I'm thinkin a bazillion year old rtwin motor is mebbe just a lil different than a high compression/DOHC/inline 4.
If nuthin else, our shit tends to keep the oil on the inside.
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tool man
Needs a job
Posts: 4493
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posted April 22, 2006 10:50 AM
If you want a dog , walk it!! 
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The banks are failing..
The banks are failing...
Invest in Ammo
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fastestbusaaround
Needs a life
I eat Fish...
Posts: 7889
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posted April 22, 2006 11:00 AM
quote:
I'm thinkin a bazillion year old rtwin motor is mebbe just a lil different than a high compression/DOHC/inline 4.
If nuthin else, our shit tends to keep the oil on the inside.
Same procedure in the japanese factories D
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FYYFF!!!
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D
Needs a job
Posts: 3365
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posted April 22, 2006 11:02 AM
Well I aint gonna be the one to start the next round O how to break a bike in threads, I just know that I've had good results doin it the recommended way and seen some pretty strong results from others that did the same.
To each his own, yanno?
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VPN
Zone Head
Posts: 718
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posted April 22, 2006 11:44 AM
Do it the way it's explained in the manual
and you'll keep the warranty
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FasterThanStink
Pro
Posts: 1218
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posted April 22, 2006 12:03 PM
Follow the manual and when the break in is over cane the nuts off of it.
____________
Speed has never killed anyone,
suddenly becoming stationary...
That's what gets you.
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D
Needs a job
Posts: 3365
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posted April 22, 2006 12:15 PM
So what is the manufacturer recommended break in procedure anyway?
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ZREXER
Expert Class
Posts: 492
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posted April 22, 2006 12:18 PM
If anyone needs any help in breaking in their bikes, give me a call........................I'll be real gentle..............really.......................Why don't you believe me?
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D
Needs a job
Posts: 3365
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posted April 22, 2006 12:24 PM
Yer lips moved :P
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2toGo
Expert Class
Posts: 165
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posted April 22, 2006 01:31 PM
Ride it like you stole it !! Break It in like you plan on riding it . Mercy is for the weak !!
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speedgene
Zone Head
Posts: 996
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posted April 22, 2006 01:51 PM
quote:
Well I aint gonna be the one to start the next round O how to break a bike in threads, I just know that I've had good results doin it the recommended way and seen some pretty strong results from others that did the same.
To each his own, yanno?
Fish, on what public street do I add a few miles on a race bike? 104db's (at the time), number plates, slicks, total loss ign. system, no working brake light, no DMV registration/tags/insurance for street use. Where do I break-in a brand new engine? This bike was literally taken out of the crate, engine pulled, torn down, and built to racing specs as per rule book. It is now returned with bored cylinders, new rings obviously, and get this... zero miles on the crank and head remember.
Where else but a closed course is where the engine will receive it's "break-in" miles. Now comes race day with a new engine to baby? Do I... get in the way of everyone in practice when I go out with this engine... worry about rpm levels, or do I haul ass and get myself up to racing speed? Tell me, which choice did I have in this scenario?
Did the engine blow up? Did the piston(s) score? Was there any kind of engine knock? Did the engine puff oil upon start up, constant idle, or blow oil smoke trails at high rpm? Could I smell backwash oil peppering under my helmet to sniff for? Did the cam towers score? Did the shim buckets tear up the cam lobes? Did tearing into the oil filter pleats reveal any damage after it's very first practice? The answer to every question in this paragraph is an emphatic, NO. Was the bike reliable (oil tight) after hard break-in? YES.
I am relating personal experience. I've inspected the parts. No parts (not even a ring change) were either damaged, or needed changing due to the harsh environment in such a short time.
Bottom line... keep an open mind on the subject.
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E-tard
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Stalwart
Needs a job
Posts: 3360
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posted April 22, 2006 02:25 PM
I'm NOT giving advise on breaking in a modern Japanese motorcycle engine, just relating what I experienced back in the stone age. In 1985 I bought a new V-Max and from mile one it would rev freely to redline without strain or strange harmonics that weren't there when broken in. I did try to keep it below the recommended rpm during the first specified number of miles but I didn't always, and it saw redline a few times in the first 50 or so miles.
In 1986, wanting something slightly faster, I bought a ZX1000R (Ninja 1000). When I was leaving the dealership, a long time salesperson recommended that I pay attention to the feel of the bike, vibration and willingness to rev. I found this hard to believe but I did notice that during the 100 miles or so it did vibrate a bit more and there was a SLIGHT unwillingness to rev much beyond 4000 rpm. As the miles on the bike accumulated the engine seemed willing to rev higher and higher and vibration diminished. It wasn't until about 1200 miles that the bike would rev like the V-Max did from day one. When I looked back on it it seemed that the factory recommendations were fairly close to what I experienced.
The transmission on the 1000 wasn't broken in until at LEAST 6000 miles and was stiff and clunky until that time but that is another matter . . .
Stuart
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Stuart
________________________________
Ridin' the Trump train.
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nightmare
Pro
ACP Racing
Posts: 1797
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posted April 22, 2006 03:22 PM
I wonder how long does it take before the 14 is Broke in? It took 400 miles or so to get the K6 going and it was a long time coming
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blitzkrieg
Needs a job
Road kill = Free lunch.
Posts: 2044
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posted April 22, 2006 03:57 PM
I've always believed that complete heat cycling of the motor is the most important factor followed by getting the break-in oil out of there in a timely fashion.
Three complete cold-hot-cold cycles at the start are what all my bikes get.
Load the motor up running through the gears and don't keep it at static speeds. It's a balancing act between breaking the bearings in properly, seating the rings and allowing the other dissimilar machined surfaces like the camshaft caps to break in to their harder counterparts.
Interestingly Yamaha does not document break-in with a "max rpm" on my new R1. The break-in procedures say "Avoid prolonged operation above 6900 rpm miles 0-600" and the same but 8300 rpm for miles 600-1000.
I think thats much more realistic than saying never exceed XXXX rpm which in the past was often really low (4K rpm on the A1 the first 500 miles if I remember correctly).
Here is my personal opinion:
Manufacturer break-in recommendations are a compromise. You've got engineers, sales and promotional people and yes, lawyers all throwing in their two cents.
If you calculate out the average total revolutions your motor has done after 100 miles, there is a pretty good argument for saying at 100 miles it's as broke in as its going to get. Calculate that out with even the roughest and most conservative rpm numbers and thats in the ballpark of 1/2 million revolutions of the crank.
The engines we have today have such tight clearances, nikosil type cylinder technology, etc.. that things have changed. Hell, even many high-end motors are now coming from the factory (911, Viper, Corvette, M-series BMW) with synthetic oil which we all have had drilled into our heads for years is not good for break-in. Must not be a whole lot of breaking in needed then, huh?
I tend to draw the line in the middle of insanity (break it in like you stole it) and overkill (many mfg's durations).
Just my .02
____________
"BTW....You need to get a girlfriend who's last name isn't .jpg"
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fish_antlers
Administrator
The Truth is Out There
Posts: 21894
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posted April 22, 2006 04:10 PM
 Edited By: fish_antlers on 22 Apr 2006 17:11
speedgene... there is an enormous difference between a racebike that never see that street and has its engine torn apart frequently and a daily rider/stock bike.
If you plan on racing your bike you know yer on yer own.
Apples and oranges.
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What business is it of yours where I'm from, Friendo?
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FasterThanStink
Pro
Posts: 1218
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posted April 22, 2006 04:37 PM
Edited By: FasterThanStink on 22 Apr 2006 20:20
blitzkreig... Right on.
The heat cycles are important. The engine expands and contracts and every thing "settles in". The stresses inherent in the block are re-aligned and relieved. Drag racers call this a "seasoned" block and they always make more power than a new block. On the second re-build of a motor the block has no internal stresses so everything stays where its at as far as tolerances go.
CNC machining and tight tolerances have drastically reduced the break in. It is much less of an issue than it used to be.
Changing the break in oil on time very is important.
Way to go fish... you opened up the break in debate. You did this on purpose didn't you? Thought that if we were busy debating the break in procedures that we wouldn't be complaining about our bikes not being here.
Where's my bike Kawasaki! 
It didn't work. 
____________
Speed has never killed anyone,
suddenly becoming stationary...
That's what gets you.
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CrotchRocket
Moderator
Bracket Racing with Betsy
Posts: 8038
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posted April 22, 2006 04:50 PM
Nice Blitz...Slowly your becoming yourself again Nice to have you back!!!
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Jason Miller StreetBike Seminars
*****DragRacers do it better, because they dont cut Corners*****
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CrotchRocket
Moderator
Bracket Racing with Betsy
Posts: 8038
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posted April 22, 2006 04:53 PM
speedgene, you break it in on a dyno and the track riding around slowly...
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Jason Miller StreetBike Seminars
*****DragRacers do it better, because they dont cut Corners*****
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