fish_antlers
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posted December 13, 2005 04:34 PM
 Edited By: fish_antlers on 13 Dec 2005 16:49
Doug Meyer Disects the ZX-14 Engine, Photos included (large).....
After lengthy conversations with Doug Meyer, we came up with some observations about the ZX-14's powerplant...
What follows is a brief commentary by Doug Meyer regarding different aspects of the engine, accompanied by photos.....
There was a fair amount of talk when the ZX-14 appeared, regarding the possibility that it had morphed into some kind of sport tourer. After having a good look at the cutaway at the Seattle Show, I'll have to say, "I think not". This is clearly an engine that is designed for maximum power, an "almost" race engine right from the box. Look for some really big numbers when these get sorted out.
Example:
Look at the valve angle. It has been narrowed making the resulting port angle steeper. Better flow.
Example:
Look at the piston. Its' an extreme slipper design with a minimal crown thickness. Lower friction, less heat buildup and lighter weight.
Example:
Look at the crossflow windows in the cylinders. These are large and smoothed for maximum airflow to the adjacent cylinder to minimize pumping losses. Less power lost internally- more to the wheel.
Example:
Look at the clutch. It is an inch larger in diameter than the 12. More grip area , less affected by heat.
Example:
Look at the cylinder. One piece, cast with the case. Stronger, more rigid. Thick enough for an overbore.
Example:
Two mufflers. If they didn't want max power they'd have gone the cheaper, more popular single muffler route....
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beansbaxter
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posted December 13, 2005 05:04 PM
So how much of a power difference are we talking about with two mufflers versus one muffler?
I know back pressure is our friend, but is there any performance reason why any aftermarket exhaust company will come out with a replacement single muffler system?
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CrotchRocket
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posted December 13, 2005 05:31 PM
Edited By: CrotchRocket on 13 Dec 2005 17:33
Thanks for the racers view explained in laymens terms for all to understand 
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MadMike
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posted December 13, 2005 05:46 PM
I am going to look for a crashed one next year, maybe that powerplant will fit into something else?? I can not wait to see what the motors are going to pump out for HP....
Thanks guys....
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road rage
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posted December 13, 2005 05:58 PM
Here's the problem that I have with the exhaust issue (single vs. dual). The dual mufflers should make more power on the top end only (top speed) because they'll flow better, but for most of us who ride on the street (under 120 mph most of the time) I think this top end advantage is less important to us. For the strip it depends read on. For me I'd rather dump the dual exhaust for an aftermarket (less weight) single muffler system and get the bigger power advantage that comes along with ditching the extra 25+ Lbs. Really it's a trade off; either you'd rather have the better top end (not that big a deal to me, I think it's minimal at best) or have the better response when rolling on the throttle when getting to the top end due to less weight from dual cans. This of course all depends on how heavy the stock cans are to begin with. It's been noted that weight wise there's almost nothing to be gained from replacing the stock exhaust of most 600cc & 1000cc sportbikes (current model GSXR-1000 for example) and the horsepower increases would be / is minimal, so you'r getting mostly just the sound for your $800.00. If the ZX-14 mufflers are like the GSXR-1000, perhaps it's better to leave them be (no real gains in power or weight by switching to something else). If they're the heavy mufflers we've come to know / expect from manufactures who use dual cans, then switching will have big gains in power and big loses in weight (win / win situation). I suspect though from observers who've seen the bike in person and noted how light it felt, that perhaps these stock dual cans AREN'T to heavy (though they look it). Switching them would maybe just be for sound IMHO, but isn't that why we replace them anyway?
Phil
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Gary B
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posted December 13, 2005 06:22 PM
Aftermarket single exhaust will ALWAYS be lighter and make more power THROUGHOUT the entire rev range compared to a stock system. The two pipes on it from the factory just make it flow better(like a Busa), but show me a Busa that doesn't run BETTER with an aftermarket pipe on it! Muzzy will make a killer pipe at a good cost for this pipe.
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gunner
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posted December 13, 2005 06:49 PM
OK so the engine development dept had their shit together. The styling dept had their heads clean up their ASS!!!!!!!!!!!!!! What? are we going to brain wash ourself into thinking it's a great lookin bike just like the Busa Boys have???? ARE WE????????? Why not just go up and convince yourself that you're married to a super model as well 
Polish it all you may,and it's just a shiney piece of shit in the looks dept 
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road rage
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posted December 13, 2005 07:46 PM
Well first off I never mentioned anything about the Hayabusa, it's got dual exhaust like the
ZX-14 so they'd naturally compare in saving weight or gaining power when switching exhaust but comparing them I wasn't. I spoke of the 600cc and 1000cc sportbikes (they hardly gain anything in weight savings 2 or 3 lbs or horsepower gains 3 > 5 hp. The Hayabusa and ZX-14 don't operate the same way as the other bikes mentioned, since they already have dual exhaust, naturally if you drop a can and go with single, you'll pretty much drop some weight as well (I think I mentioned something like 25+ lbs). Still if the cans on this machine aren't the heavier stuff like you've come to know it won't make as big of difference will it, maybe 10 lbs. That's what I was trying to point out here, it all depends on how heavy the stock exhaust is from the start, then you'd have a better idea what gains you could achieve. If you can drop 30 lbs, that's great but 10 lbs isn't as big a deal. Hell I guess while your at it, you could just go on a diet if it really gets that close. Considering 7 lbs lost is suppose to equal 1hp gained, if you lost 21 lbs of weight you'd gain 3 hp.
I went from dual to single exhaust before, the biggest gains were from losing the extra weight, not the hp increase.
Phil
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worm~hole
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posted December 13, 2005 07:51 PM
...I only real have a problem with the busy and fatass looking tail section...I hope the aftermarket does something nice for it...
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gunner
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posted December 13, 2005 09:07 PM
Man my point is only to say it's as ugly as a Busa!!!!! A 600 Hp turbo Busa is beautiful in respect to it's engine package. It's untouchable!!!!!!! But!!!!! It's still damn ugly to look at!!!!
The 14 looks to be headed down the same path!!!! Now we have all sit around since 1999 slamming the Busa's looks yet now we have the same problem on our hands and it's all covered up by a projected GREAT motor!!!!!!!! Suddenly we're blinded??? NOT me it's damn ugly and that kind of UGLY runs clean to the BONE!!!!!!!
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shortcircuit
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posted December 14, 2005 12:56 AM
Kawasaki UK have it marketed as a Sports Tourer - ZZR1400
http://www.kawasaki.co.uk/category.asp?Id=FEBEA5008
Same bike different perception
People are gonna do some fast touring on this!!!
I read that the cans are aluminium so weight saving going to 4-1 will probably be minimal
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Previous: '84 Z1100R (Lime Green), '88 GPZ1000RX
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jimzx9r
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posted December 14, 2005 01:25 AM
Probably 10lbs, maybe more. Every little bit helps though.
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TurboBlew
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posted December 14, 2005 03:20 AM
I think noise is the #1 factor with the dual exhaust.
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supra5677
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posted December 14, 2005 09:31 AM
larger stroke equals more torque:
with only a 1mm overbore thats not much more in the piston volume. However it does have 0.5 more points in compression maybe worth 3 horsepower. Let see 4.6mm stroke, 1mm bore, 0.5 more compression
From the zx12r's 162 I could see it going to 172.. If the cylinder head is significantly better maybe 177. The camshaft is a factor also..
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supra5677
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posted December 14, 2005 09:44 AM
Akrapovic on a zx12r makes at leat 12 horsepower.. On a 14 it will make at least 8 at the rear wheel
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supra5677
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posted December 14, 2005 09:51 AM
Hey Doug:"
Were you able to get the specs on the motor.. Even the intake valve diameter will tell us a lot about the motor..
supra
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brain
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posted December 14, 2005 11:54 AM
Obviously looks are not what sales.The busa has the mystic of being the fastest bike ever made and a catchy name and as ugly as it is, it outsold our beloved 12r, 13 to 1.I dont think they are concerned with looks as they are flat out performance from the 1/4 mile to top end.They figure if it worked once it will work again.
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TurboBlew
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posted December 14, 2005 12:08 PM
The ZX12 was never a factor in the Busa marketing plan. It took awhile for the Busa to catch on. 2000 was its "banner" year so to speak.
In 1999 it was near impossible to find parts for the bike other than cheap slip on mufflers or other inundane crap not worth a dime.
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dougmeyer
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posted December 14, 2005 12:46 PM
Here's the simplistic, but essentially accurate point with the exhaust. OEM's are governed by two very important limits; sound and emissions. The emissions regs are addressed with FI and cats. When trying to comply with the (exhaust) noise regs there is only one choice, a muffler(s). The noise limit is absolute. The larger the engine and the greater the air flow in (power), the greater the exhaust outflow. In order to quiet this flow without unduly restricting the exhaust gas flow you can make the muffler larger or longer, or restrict the increase exit orfice size. There are practical size limits to the physical size of the muffler(s) and a lower limit of the power penalty the engineers (and marketing guys) are willing accept. So the first thing you can do to increase the muffler capacity is double it by adding another one. Then you can increase the size of the outflow orfice until you reach the max allowable noise.
Your choice, you want one muffler or more power? The added power more than offsets the added weight. Of course this is all moot when you remove the whole system and add a proper exhaust system. But even then, the same parameters figure into the design.
Doug
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supra5677
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posted December 14, 2005 12:58 PM
Okay Doug:
What are your rwhp estimates on the 14?
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Zammy
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posted December 14, 2005 02:11 PM
Those intake ports are mighty SMOOOOTH.
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dougmeyer
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posted December 14, 2005 04:45 PM
180 give or take.......
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D
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posted December 14, 2005 05:55 PM
And blue will still be the fastes color.
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deathpulse
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posted December 14, 2005 07:45 PM
Doug, that seems low (180) to me. I have a 2000 zx-12 with a Muzzy full exhaust, PC-IIIr, K&N filters and no Kleen air and it kicks out 175 RWHP - only 5 more for the '14?  .
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trenace
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posted December 14, 2005 07:52 PM
Why compare with "Muzzy full exhaust, PC-IIIr, K&N filters and no Kleen air" to without?
Put a pipe, the PCIII, and air filters on the ZX-14 and that might be worth another 15 or so hp, give or take, for it.
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