fish_antlers
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The Truth is Out There
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posted November 01, 2005 07:37 PM
Simple Solution to Battery Tray Issue with ZX-14
I've been thinking about the battery tray issue with the ZX-14, and I think I have a very simple solution to make it work. If this statement from XL is true:
quote:
Battery to this point comes out the same way as the 12...exception is....ALL the electronics have been moved and only the battery resides there.
The tray is easy in,easy out....and there is no more cover in the way...
Then one can assume that part of the problem has been solved. Relocating the electronics and making the tray easy access is part of the solution.... HOWEVER we can olny assume by this statement that if the tray remains the same as in the 12R, the positive terminal on the battery will be "buried" in the far end of the tray.
As the bike is not yet in production, perhaps KHI may read this and consider this work around...
There should be nothing preventing the battery from being FLIPPED 180' so that the negative terminal is "buried" inside the bike, and the positive terminal is immediately exposed when removing the battery cover...
If this was done now, at the factory level... ZX-14 owners who needed to access the battery to connect accessories (ie: heated vest, radar etc) could simply remove the cover and gain instant access to the battery.
Also for the cases of jump starting the bike, removing the cover would give immediate access to the positive terminal. Since you generally jump start using the foot peg or other chassis point as the ground, this seems to be a perfect work around, actually making the battery tray a convienience, and not a pain in the ass!
That's what I thought up.
If the factory doesnt do this (cant see why not) , then we'll have to extend and reverse the batteries ourselves (as owners).. and thus shall begin the ZX-14 FAQ.. the first "mod" for the bike!
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What business is it of yours where I'm from, Friendo?
   
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TurboBlew
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posted November 01, 2005 08:26 PM
Pussy... whats the big deal?
Running the wire to the opening on the otherside is better anyway.
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fish_antlers
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posted November 01, 2005 08:51 PM
thanks... that'll help us talk to the factory 
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What business is it of yours where I'm from, Friendo?
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ozzy
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need guberment cheese
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posted November 02, 2005 05:17 AM
I just left the "jumper" cable hooked up on the 12R and it functions just as you describe.
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TurboBlew
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posted November 02, 2005 05:33 AM
Ok, explain again what the big deal is?
If you dont like my post then delete ....er I mean Dale it. :
I removed the jumper cable on my Zx12s. Its a stupid idea to think you're gonna jump start a bike that has a battery that dead anyway. With WalMarts being within a 10mile radius of every city in the US.... buying a $60 battery will solve your problem. So it takes 14 mins instead of 4 to get access to the battery. BFD... thats like complaining the bike doesnt come with spongy grips.
So again, what is the issue here?
If you're worried about accessories, perhaps the factory should provide a 12v source or junction block for your accessories. Simple fix.... why sweat the small stuff that only silly Canadians seem to have issues with?????
In all my experience with ZX12s, I think I had 1 with a dead battery that was inconvienience...and only because I failed to check it the night before a long ride. It took all of 1hr with a trip to WalMart to get the battery changed. Are you still pissed cause you got nicked for a battery before you sold your (lemon??) 12?
Motorcycles are for the mechanically inclined... convertible cars are made for the rest of the motoring retarded public.
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gunner
Needs a life
Posts: 5778
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posted November 02, 2005 06:14 AM
TurboBlew...............Your post above really reminds me of???????????????????Me!!!!
Motorcycles are for the mechanically inclined!!! But then angain the rest of the fools that own them are for guys whom are mechanically inclined to prey on both on the road and track because they'll never keep up ever!!!!! Daily adjustments to small details are what keeps my stuff out front of the rest and always will 
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238mph
Pro
Posts: 1145
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posted November 02, 2005 08:14 AM
You're worried about the battery tray....
How about worrying about HOW FOOKIN UGLY IT IS... 
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Pilot Powers took me to the grave, and brought me back...
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fish_antlers
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posted November 02, 2005 08:31 AM
 Edited By: fish_antlers on 2 Nov 2005 09:39
It's niave of you to think that you can get a battery for a 12R with 10 miles of where you live... It may be the case for many, but after travelling across the US, I have seen first hand that unless you are near a major city center, your chances of finding bike parts, or even a walmart, can be slim to none.
As for the mechanically inclined, that's BS.. mechanically inclined or not, there is a point in time where "elegance and forethought" in engineering take over from "a just bolt the fuckin thing in there". A good example would be engine design on many late 70's/ early 80's American cars vs their European counterparts... try changing the waterpump on a Lincoln, and then do the same job on a VW Rabbit or Jetta, or a Honda.. there are countless examples, and you, as someone who bills themselves as "mechanincally inclined" should appreciate an effort being made to refine and finish a product more than anyone else.
If you want to take a look at design elegance, work on any Ducati.
Since you spend most of your time drag racing and dont really even ride your bike on the road, how would you know what it is like to be in the middle of nowhere and need to take the bike apart.
238.... since we cant fix the looks, we can at least make sure it's dialed in in every other element.
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What business is it of yours where I'm from, Friendo?
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TurboBlew
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posted November 02, 2005 12:06 PM
Who spends time drag racing? Me? You're sorely mistaken. We can compare mileage anytime and Im guessing it will be the same if not more in my favor. This year was slow for me but I still have logged over 12k miles.... 1,600 of them coming in 1 weekend alone.
And I have bike(s) as in plural.... drag race, road race, streetbike, etc. Being as no single motorcycle will meet all my needs.
And you're correct.... I typically dont have to take my bike apart roadside... but its nice to know Ill be able to locate, diagnose and possibly correct a problem if one should arise.
As billing myself as "anything" .... I just make my bikes suit my needs. I understand that a typical production bike will not satisfy everyone's needs or desires, theres a happy medium the factories have to follow to get sales. The beauty is buying one at a bargin production price, then spending alittle time making it your own and fixing things the factory missed. Whether its pinstripes or Pirellis. Some bikes are closer than others, in terms of "finish quality".
Im not entirely sure what your meaning of "design elegance" means, but if you mean doing valve adjustments every 6000 miles..... Ill take the crude, battery hidden in frame design and long service interval Japanese bikes anyday....lol.
And FWIW one of my close friends owns a Ducati.... his bike has been left stranded roadside more times than I can count. Ive ridden the bike plenty too and I just dont get the appeal. Could be the Irish in me.
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D
Needs a job
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posted November 02, 2005 12:28 PM
quote:
I've been thinking about the battery tray issue with the ZX-14, and I think I have a very simple solution to make it work.
Hayabusa.
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trenace
Needs a job
Posts: 3056
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posted November 02, 2005 12:37 PM
Edited By: trenace on 2 Nov 2005 13:59
I guess it depends on background.
Coming from aircraft mechanics, one doesn't expect the design to be altered to something that's less functional or high-performance, heavier or consuming more room or whatever so as to save the mechanic a few minutes or allow him a comfortable room to work his hands into instead of something that's one razor-edge-thickness away from being completely impossible... I can appreciate the viewpoint of being mad at a company for, for example, the monocoque frame adding difficulties to service but from the standpoint of ultimate performance, I prefer the machine being more difficult to work on on account of being less compromised towards that goal, just so long as it can actually be done, which it can, and certainly can with the battery in either bike.
At any rate, whether this battery is more difficult to R&R roadside than one would prefer, can be known only after it's out there.
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238mph
Pro
Posts: 1145
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posted November 02, 2005 01:00 PM
There is a term we use in mechanical enginnering called "trapped E" which means
a poor design in which one component traps another... and it didn't have to be that
way... my nickname for it is TSE "total shit engineering"
For example, on the 12's suspension, the bottom shock bolt is trapped in by the
exhaust... so to remove the bolt you have to first deal with the exhaust. Total BS!!!
Everyone knows that if you take that bolt out one time, you NEVER put it back in from
the same side, so the NEXT time is real easy to handle.
Fish is right in that had they put the positive on the right side it would be much easier to get
to and would NOT have affected the overall design, etc...
By the way, some firms have engineers that do nothing but analyze TE... as they calculate
how many hours it takes to replace a given unit... like cars that need an A/C compressor
replaced... often you have to dismantle half the engine to get it out... poor design...
It's one thing that pisses me off more than anything else... like why doesn't the 12 have
an access plate that can come off for simple oil filter replacement. You shouldn't have to
remove fairings etc, just to change a filter....
It's almost as bad as having to drop your drawers to take a crap!!!!
____________
Pilot Powers took me to the grave, and brought me back...
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Famous1
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posted November 02, 2005 02:32 PM
free post.......
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Road Rage
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posted November 02, 2005 03:28 PM
Edited By: Road Rage on 2 Nov 2005 15:31
O.K. now this is getting outta hand. I'm new here but have been reading this stuff for the past 2 weeks and looking at the pics. There were some pics posted the other day that showed this bike in a cut-away view from the autoshow (it was a black one with a girl next to it). so, o.k. in that picture it showed the battery installed in the bike and on the RIGHT SIDE (cut away side) the battery terminal was RED or POSITIVE. Doesn't that mean that this issue is resolved or would they have put a RED rubberized cover on the negative side of the battery.....that wouldn't make sense.
The links here for that thread:
http://www.bikeland.org/board/viewthread.php?FID=27&TID=19884&set_time=
Phil
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238mph
Pro
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posted November 02, 2005 03:43 PM
Looks like Road Rage might be on to something...
Open up a big can of "Shut the Fuck Up.."
While I was looking at that photo, I noticed the camshaft sprockets need to have
THE SHIT DRILLED OUT OF THEM... You would think Kawi would drill out ALL the
items that need to spin up... what a waste of HP
____________
Pilot Powers took me to the grave, and brought me back...
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trenace
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posted November 02, 2005 03:58 PM
Edited By: trenace on 2 Nov 2005 16:04
Speaking of, hopefully Mr He-Knows-He-Who-He-Is can do what would be the big favor of finding out on the related question for the 12R! 
But now that he has a 10 maybe he's forgotten everybody with the 12! 
Even more important IMO to reduce the rotation weight in the valvetrain than the crank because either way you have the inertia, but with the crank at least you get better transient stability of speed of engine parts, to some extent it's "six of one and half a dozen of the other," whereas the heavier the valvetrain's rotating parts, the worse it tracks the crankshaft, there is nothing good about it at all. So if SOMEBODY would find out about bore-drilling the 12's cams to lighten them that would be great!
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gunner
Needs a life
Posts: 5778
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posted November 02, 2005 06:37 PM
Where's the Love????????? I know who he is  He's sorry for the delays in this more than old enough request of him. I'm swamped right now. Trying to get my shop up to full capacity for the christmas rush has taken it's toll on him. I'll try I promise.
Fish I can give you a part number for a great glass Matt battery for your bike that will never leave you stranded if you'll just give it a small amount of attention. Working on any of my bikes just isn't an issue at all. Coming from a racing background I'm use to taking everything apart several time a weekend so taking my toys apart every couple of weekends for a good cleaning and rechecking of components is a very relaxed PM schedule to me. I really haven't noticed the 12 being much of a PITA. Let me know on that battery. My oldest friend runs a battery wharehouse and can Hook you up.
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trenace
Needs a job
Posts: 3056
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posted November 02, 2005 06:42 PM
Oh no, I absolutely appreciate your efforts and know (or partially know) how swamped you've been... I was just giving you a hard time but what was supposed to be in a reasonably good or at least good-humored way! It would be a cool thing to do to lighten the camshafts that way if technically feasible.
Compared to the ceramic rotors and swingarm not arriving as of nearly 6 months after being ordered, it hasn't been nearly that long on this one! And those folks are getting paid, whereas you're helping for free! So truly no complaints, just nagging
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12r1
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posted November 14, 2005 08:52 AM
Edited By: 12r1 on 14 Nov 2005 08:56
I still have my stock '00 battery in there. The last time I was in at it, was to hook up the tender leads. If the 14 has as good a battery, no worries.
Nuttin' wrong with new suggestions. Many will be much further into the 14's, than just poundin' on a stocker for 5 yrs.
jeff
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worm~hole
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Miles to go before I sleep....
Posts: 10623
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posted November 14, 2005 10:03 PM
Edited By: worm~hole on 14 Nov 2005 22:04
...batteries shmatteries....everyone knows that batteries are for dildos....lets just wait and see how the the production bikes spec-out...I like turboblowjob's idea of a ready-access 12V junction box, tho...makes more sense....
____________
“We sleep safe in our beds because rough men
stand ready in the night to visit violence on those
who would do us harm.”
-George Orwell
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