fish_antlers
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posted October 29, 2010 08:26 PM
ZX-10R liability? QUestion...
So we all by detuned ZX-10Rs because that's what Kawi dishes out. Then to get the rest of the speed we buy "race" ECUs and unlock the bike.
What does that do to the rider's liability? Say you are in an accident with one of these bikes and the police or the insurance company find that it is driven by an integral component that's label "for competition use only" or something to that effect.
Is your insurance null and void? Is kawi off the hook for anything that happens to you or your bike because you are using your bike on the street when it is meant for strictly off road only because of the ecu?
thoughts?
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Famous1
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posted October 30, 2010 05:19 AM
thoughts????
i think you need to put that bong down and back away from the table......
just say no my man....just say no.
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fish_antlers
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posted October 30, 2010 07:20 AM
quote:
thoughts????
i think you need to put that bong down and back away from the table......
just say no my man....just say no.
Why? Explain yourself - from your post I'd say it's obvious you're no lawyer!
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Wheelie High
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Neal
Posts: 87
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posted October 30, 2010 09:14 AM
So your point is what?? ... Why not just sell the bike unrestricted with factory parts and ad another cat box and muffler???
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fish_antlers
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posted October 30, 2010 10:39 AM
From a liability perspective probably would position the consumer better. Right now it's stacked in kawi's favor no matter how u slice it
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Famous1
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posted October 31, 2010 07:04 AM
quote:
From a liability perspective probably would position the consumer better. Right now it's stacked in kawi's favor no matter how u slice it
stacked in kawi's favor? how about ford? lots of modified mustangs running around.... is the deck stacked in ford's favor? yes your honor, i blame khi because they sold me a bike that made 180bhp and i wanted 190bhp so i was "forced" to install this race ecu,
Should khi be on the hook for anything that happens with my 14 becuase i had to remove the fly's to get it to move like i wanted it to? Dude, step back, relax....
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fish_antlers
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posted October 31, 2010 08:20 AM
okay.. let me try to explain this to you a different way since clearly you dont deal with liability issues very often.
Let's say you run race only slicks on your bike on the street and you get into an accident where you loose traction, say in the rain or something. Something where the police can prove you lost traction. If the plice and the insurance company investigate and find that your tires are clearly labeled "competition use only" or are not DOT, then your claim could be void - your coverage gone.
Now to the same extent if you buy the bike and uncork it with an ECU clearly labeled for track use only and you get yourself into a power/ speed related accident where the police and the insurance company can clearly prove the speed and the power of your bike where the cause of the mishap, then upon investigation it would be fair to assume that if they determined you had an offroad / not street legal ECU which provided you the speed and power - I would be willing to bet you a beer that your coverage would be toast.
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Wheelie High
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Neal
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posted November 01, 2010 11:16 AM
Who in hell doesn't have race only/offroad track use equipment installed on their bikes that would void a lot of crap and that's waaay before considering a race only ECU! Everyone knows slicks are illegal for highway use and besides they're visible...electronic Ignition boxes, nitrous kits, turbos systems, exhaust systems, air filters, etc etc.. They have all been in use for years so I doubt if it would affect anything any differently than those items have in the past. insurance company's will dispute a claim based on so many different things its crazy! That's why I don't change companies very often at all because if I f**k up then I will atleast have a track record established. That goes for life insurance, health ins., vehicles etc. Hell I had to give blood and a mouth swab for my life insurance! I'm too damn afraid to be late with a payment because they are no joke! You may be late in 2010 and not have an issue til 2013 and they'll say because u were late in 2010 with a payment we cannot cover your claim! But your ass has made 3yrs of on time payments since then! Anyway... My point is they will find a way out of liability so can it and buy your accessories! Besides, if you leave it stock they gave you an option to use traction control, power modes, and abs but because of the extra $1k you opted out of the ABS (all bull shit).
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fish_antlers
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posted November 01, 2010 11:49 AM
If there's no liability issue then why would kawi bother labeling the ecu as being race only? For Fun?
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TedG
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posted November 01, 2010 12:40 PM
quote:
If there's no liability issue then why would kawi bother labeling the ecu as being race only? For Fun?
Three letters....EPA.
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Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
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fish_antlers
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posted November 01, 2010 12:45 PM
quote:
quote:
If there's no liability issue then why would kawi bother labeling the ecu as being race only? For Fun?
Three letters....EPA.
Nope - one word - liability. That's a fact.
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TedG
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posted November 01, 2010 01:08 PM
I beg to differ. It is both. The race ecu's do not live up to the EPA's standards and they have to use the race or off road use only. But there are no hard set specs that tell how the bike will perform, just some numbers they throw out there. No spec on when the ABS is going to kick in, no spec on much of anything.
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Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
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Famous1
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posted November 01, 2010 03:17 PM
quote:
quote:
quote:
If there's no liability issue then why would kawi bother labeling the ecu as being race only? For Fun?
Three letters....EPA.
Nope - one word - liability. That's a fact.
you got something to back this "FACT" up?
since it is a fact... i guess you can site plenty of actual examples of your above scenario,,,
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fish_antlers
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posted November 02, 2010 08:58 AM
you want to start looking through decades of court cases? never seen the police ticket riders with aftermarket pipes? undertails? non- dot turnsignals? come on dude... this is pretty basic shit 
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TedG
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posted November 02, 2010 10:19 AM
Yes but has there ever been a case where the ECU not being stock caused a liability suit?
Second, how can a mfg take responsibility for a customer changing any part that is not part of a normal service?
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Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
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Wheelie High
Novice Class
Neal
Posts: 87
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posted November 02, 2010 11:16 AM
Well how long has it been since we were told that doing our own maintenance/service won't void the warranty?? Or was that limited to oil changes only?? Never gave a s**t about the terms anyway unless something had a malfunction of some sort. Anyway, would liability play a role in you doing something w/o proper skills and go out and bust your arse?! An oil slicked tire, improperly torque'd drain plug or tightened oil filter etc. Wonder how many lawyers does KMC have on their payroll anyway?... Had an issue with Mitsubishi back in 96' for selling me a brand new but wrecked and repaired Galant which I wrecked because of an improperly repaired front wheel! They bought "my" lawyer off and they said if I continued with the lawsuit they would go to court and tell a bold faced lie and then turn around and sue my ass! Now how was that for liability!! In turn they offered me another brand new Galant!... I said f**k ya'll and bought a Honda! Hmmmm, what a coincidence.. Lol
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fish_antlers
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posted November 02, 2010 12:02 PM
What's your point? Your rant has little to do with the issue I've raised.
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Wheelie High
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Neal
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posted November 02, 2010 01:23 PM
My rant basically makes a point that you may "want" an issue where there is none... And in some future fluke of the possibility of an issue, KMC has made sure to leave themselves high and dry of any liability. No way a company that large hasn't already considered all aspects of an issue of liability such as yours. If you provide a service or consumer purchased product you best believe lawyers have reviewed the products and what services they provide the consumer with. Whether its provided with the original purchase or an add on their asses are protected!
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fish_antlers
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posted November 02, 2010 04:09 PM
But thAt's my point and you disagreed with it!!
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Wheelie High
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Neal
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posted November 02, 2010 04:18 PM
Oops,.. My bad! LOL.. didn't mean to. The idiot cells must have wanted to poke fun for a second.
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