dubious
Needs a life
Needs more time to ride!
Posts: 8442
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posted October 10, 2010 09:29 AM
so much for all the hype. No finger follower valvetrain like the BMW and KTM bikes...
a distinct disadvantage in outright overall power capability.
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natural selection.....
destiny will overcome intervention.
Some are not worthy of the effort.
  
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MJ
Zone Head
Posts: 560
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posted October 10, 2010 05:22 PM
Sounds like kawi just shit out a big green american turd.
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SteveWFL
Moderator
Posts: 27920
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posted October 11, 2010 11:02 AM
quote:
so much for all the hype. No finger follower valvetrain like the BMW and KTM bikes...
a distinct disadvantage in outright overall power capability.
well it must have something good, its priced up there with the beemer anyway
____________
2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted October 11, 2010 11:56 AM
 Edited By: Shane661 on 11 Oct 2010 20:01
quote:
so much for all the hype. No finger follower valvetrain like the BMW and KTM bikes...
a distinct disadvantage in outright overall power capability.
Those big buckets in the head allow for some huge cams anyway...and obviously the valvetrain can spin to very high rpm as-is.
This engine still appears to be a quantum step forward....
Nothing can match the BMW in the hype department...and that bike only made 8 more hp than a 2008 10R on the local dyno. But to hear everyone else tell it, they are making near 200 hp on pump gas...stock. 
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SteveWFL
Moderator
Posts: 27920
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posted October 11, 2010 12:11 PM
quote:
quote:
so much for all the hype. No finger follower valvetrain like the BMW and KTM bikes...
a distinct disadvantage in outright overall power capability.
Those big buckets in the head allow for some huge cams anyway...and obviously the valvetrain can spin to very high rpm as-is.
This engine still appears to be a quantum step forward....
Nothing can match the BMW in the hype department...and that bike only made 8 more hp than a 2008 10R on the local dyno. But to hear everyone else tell it, they are making near 200 hp on pump gas...stock.
total HP is all that matters? the rest of the bike blows out the 2008 10R too. blows out the Aprilia track weapon as well, which was most surprising about the '10 BMW because it was priced less than the aprilia with the comparable technology on suspension and ECU
____________
2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted October 11, 2010 12:12 PM
Edited By: Shane661 on 11 Oct 2010 20:12
quote:
total HP is all that matters? the rest of the bike blows out the 2008 10R too. blows out the Aprilia track weapon as well, which was most surprising about the '10 BMW because it was priced less than the aprilia with the comparable technology on suspension and ECU
I didn't say that, Steve. I was simply pointing out the hype about the power of the BMW...vs. the reality. 
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TedG
Moderator
Posts: 8222
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posted October 11, 2010 12:43 PM
The real problem for Kawasaki is that BMW has set the bar. They have to come very close in the magazines to get any real sales. Now think about this. The ZX12 info came out with everyone ranting how it would go 200+, and when it didn't it killed sales even though it would (real world) beat up on the Busa. But the magazines just kicked the shit out of the 12 when it didn't live up to their expectations. Now 11 years later they are not going to make the same mistake. Understate the hp and let the magazines get a big surprise.
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Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
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dubious
Needs a life
Needs more time to ride!
Posts: 8442
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posted October 12, 2010 06:34 AM
Ted, if its that close to the BMW, even if understated, its not a real win, its a tie, and will still be a dissapointment for most.
____________
natural selection.....
destiny will overcome intervention.
Some are not worthy of the effort.
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted October 12, 2010 11:20 AM
Edited By: Shane661 on 12 Oct 2010 19:20
quote:
Maybe this will help?
http://www.asphaltandrubber.com/news/official-2011-kawasaki-zx-10r-gets-lower-redline
That link has the actual change to the redline....750 rpm.
quote:
The result is that the 2011 Kawasaki ZX-10R passes the Euro III standards, but fails the EPA standards in its unadulterated form. To come into compliance with the EPA’s Noise Control Act, Kawasaki has lowered the rev-limit on the 2011 Kawasaki ZX-10R by 750 rpm in order to meet the new criteria. The byproduct of lowering the rev-limiter will reduce the new ZX-10R’s maximum power output, but Kawasaki isn’t saying by how much.
Kawasaki says its the redline for American 2011 Kawasaki ZX-10R’s will be 13,750 rpm
13750 is apparently the redline for US models...that's a lot better than was initially thought. 
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EastBayducmanic
Novice Class
Posts: 78
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posted October 24, 2010 11:03 AM
The 2011 ZX-10 = the 2001 ZX12R Overhyped pieces of Verticalscope shit. Think of the open ended liability the first time some kid looses it in the rain with the low power setting of traction control on. Come to labusas.org to get the real lowdown. The truth is not for sale. You can buy and sell lies but the truth comes out on it's own. Nice work on the 450 Kawasaki. Now there is a bike I would buy if I didn't already have a built KTM 525EXC. The best part?? It's made by Arians in Austria, not Japanese in Japan, and said Arians don't need to lie about their bikes virtues and try to control the media while making themselves look like a bunch of jackasses. Do you really think the 2011 ZX-10 is so advanced it merits you international espionage game while waiting for the worlds best private race teams and most advanced dyno's to show you what a piece of over controlled shit it really is. As if the average street rider, (Your target customer) needs nine levels of traction control.Wait until little Johnny's product liability attorneys get a hold of this case. They will own your ass. You guys (Kawasaki), come off like some kind of industrial mafia when in actuality you are nothing more than a very small fourth of fifth rate player in the world of Motorcycle Manufacturing.
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JUST LIKE duc's EX GF SAID, "HES IS NOT EVEN A MILLIONARE", but he only slaps his kittens on the ass and he just has stuff Fast enough to to do something stupid with.
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TedG
Moderator
Posts: 8222
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posted October 24, 2010 12:48 PM
quote:
Ted, if its that close to the BMW, even if understated, its not a real win, its a tie, and will still be a dissapointment for most.
If it meets or beats it then it can be a win. Then they can tout the traction control etc.
The stupid part of all this it all that they had to do is put an artificial red line sticker on the thing and call it a day, saying they aren't responsible for people revving it past the posted red line. And if that wasn't good enough, just put a restrictive air cleaner in the thing and all is good.
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Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
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Famous1
Expert Class
Posts: 402
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posted October 24, 2010 12:50 PM
quote:
The 2011 ZX-10 = the 2001 ZX12R Overhyped pieces of Verticalscope shit. Think of the open ended liability the first time some kid looses it in the rain with the low power setting of traction control on. Come to labusas.org to get the real lowdown. The truth is not for sale. You can buy and sell lies but the truth comes out on it's own. Nice work on the 450 Kawasaki. Now there is a bike I would buy if I didn't already have a built KTM 525EXC. The best part?? It's made by Arians in Austria, not Japanese in Japan, and said Arians don't need to lie about their bikes virtues and try to control the media while making themselves look like a bunch of jackasses. Do you really think the 2011 ZX-10 is so advanced it merits you international espionage game while waiting for the worlds best private race teams and most advanced dyno's to show you what a piece of over controlled shit it really is. As if the average street rider, (Your target customer) needs nine levels of traction control.Wait until little Johnny's product liability attorneys get a hold of this case. They will own your ass. You guys (Kawasaki), come off like some kind of industrial mafia when in actuality you are nothing more than a very small fourth of fifth rate player in the world of Motorcycle Manufacturing.
you off your meds again?......
you buying one? zx-10...... we see you poking around .... you must be interested.
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Wheelie High
Novice Class
Neal
Posts: 87
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posted October 27, 2010 03:10 AM
quote:
Ted, if its that close to the BMW, even if understated, its not a real win, its a tie, and will still be a dissapointment for most.
That's so true! It'll all boil down to who has the best ecu and suspension with lighter weight. So I am just too happy with my 2009! It works for me on the street, track and drag strip! Buying another GSXR1000 in 2012 to go along with my 09' ZX10R and ZX14..... Good look 2011 10R buyers!
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Straight line or bend it... I'm there!!
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fish_antlers
Administrator
The Truth is Out There
Posts: 21894
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posted October 27, 2010 05:41 AM
Pricepoint has to be a factor as well
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What business is it of yours where I'm from, Friendo?
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SteveWFL
Moderator
Posts: 27920
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posted October 27, 2010 06:08 AM
quote:
quote:
Ted, if its that close to the BMW, even if understated, its not a real win, its a tie, and will still be a dissapointment for most.
That's so true! It'll all boil down to who has the best ecu and suspension with lighter weight. So I am just too happy with my 2009! It works for me on the street, track and drag strip! Buying another GSXR1000 in 2012 to go along with my 09' ZX10R and ZX14..... Good look 2011 10R buyers!
is it time to start the 2012 speculations already
____________
2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
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Wheelie High
Novice Class
Neal
Posts: 87
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posted October 27, 2010 07:33 AM
quote:
quote:
quote:
Ted, if its that close to the BMW, even if understated, its not a real win, its a tie, and will still be a dissapointment for most.
That's so true! It'll all boil down to who has the best ecu and suspension with lighter weight. So I am just too happy with my 2009! It works for me on the street, track and drag strip! Buying another GSXR1000 in 2012 to go along with my 09' ZX10R and ZX14..... Good look 2011 10R buyers!
is it time to start the 2012 speculations already
. Hell, why not?? Conclusions seem to have been drawn on the 2011 ZX10R and everybody knew about KMC intentions on revamping it around a year ago.... And I'm pretty sure Suzuki can feel that knee in their backs while they're getting smacked up side the heads.. So let's do it and breathe air into something we have no idea of that may or may not happen and give KMC a break...(I guess). Anyway, I'm saddened and disappointed (but not surpirsed) over the whole issue and kinda feel like a kid just after getting that ass whipped! Ya just wanna got to sleep and forget the whole damn thing!!
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Straight line or bend it... I'm there!!
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MJ
Zone Head
Posts: 560
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posted October 27, 2010 12:58 PM
An ecu and pipe on your new 10 and you'll be doing the ass whipping. Plus with the restrictions in the US and the economy, there's going to be some cheap 2011 10's out there I think. I already saw a dealer on e-bay selling the base model 2011' 10 (non-abs) pre-order for 1000 bucks off retail. And its just going to get cheaper
Or you can wait a year or 2 and pick one up used real cheap 
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SteveWFL
Moderator
Posts: 27920
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posted October 27, 2010 01:32 PM
MJ, I agree they will be sold on the "very cheap".
____________
2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
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Wheelie High
Novice Class
Neal
Posts: 87
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posted October 27, 2010 01:47 PM
Oh you haven't heard?!... While they were out testing the race bike KMC had already said that they were going to offer $1000 off the price and that would allow buyers the option of the full package! ABS, traction control, power modes etc etc... but it'll be a little neutered. So its not that he's offer up a deal!... He's getting it straight from KMC. What they call an extra incentive to make that purchase.
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Straight line or bend it... I'm there!!
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MJ
Zone Head
Posts: 560
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posted October 27, 2010 03:29 PM
Edited By: MJ on 27 Oct 2010 23:29
The ad I saw was the base model only....not the abs model. And like Steve said (they'll be sold on the "very cheap"), they'll need to be more than a grand off of retail to move them off the sales floor in any substantial numbers. Thats just a starting point It would be smart of kawi to offer a rebate, but I highly doubt they will.
But then again we know you're just messin' with us 
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Wheelie High
Novice Class
Neal
Posts: 87
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posted October 28, 2010 10:48 AM
As long as they don't sit around like the 3rd gens I'll be happy. Even though I had 3 dealers going back and forth try'n to make a sale. I bought my 09' back in April for $8400 out the door. Then I sold my 05' (street bike but fully track ready!) for $6500. I'm not sure if I'd want a freak'n fly by wire anyway!... Making me miss the 05' just thinking about fly by wire because it made me ride it and it still seemed like it always had more in it. I never even got the chance to try and make it blow because it had enough to satisfy my "on the verge of bust'n my ass riding style".
____________
Straight line or bend it... I'm there!!
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SteveWFL
Moderator
Posts: 27920
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posted October 28, 2010 05:28 PM
Edited By: SteveWFL on 29 Oct 2010 01:28
quote:
As long as they don't sit around like the 3rd gens I'll be happy. Even though I had 3 dealers going back and forth try'n to make a sale. I bought my 09' back in April for $8400 out the door. Then I sold my 05' (street bike but fully track ready!) for $6500. I'm not sure if I'd want a freak'n fly by wire anyway!... Making me miss the 05' just thinking about fly by wire because it made me ride it and it still seemed like it always had more in it. I never even got the chance to try and make it blow because it had enough to satisfy my "on the verge of bust'n my ass riding style".
for 2011 its prettier than the last gen, but they robbed it of pow-ah which is significant to todays comparison shopper.
____________
2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
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MJ
Zone Head
Posts: 560
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posted October 28, 2010 08:39 PM
quote:
quote:
As long as they don't sit around like the 3rd gens I'll be happy. Even though I had 3 dealers going back and forth try'n to make a sale. I bought my 09' back in April for $8400 out the door. Then I sold my 05' (street bike but fully track ready!) for $6500. I'm not sure if I'd want a freak'n fly by wire anyway!... Making me miss the 05' just thinking about fly by wire because it made me ride it and it still seemed like it always had more in it. I never even got the chance to try and make it blow because it had enough to satisfy my "on the verge of bust'n my ass riding style".
for 2011 its prettier than the last gen, but they robbed it of pow-ah which is significant to todays comparison shopper.
And I think the days of 8400 out the door are long gone. Its an expensive world anymore, bike prices have went through the roof. A cheap 3rd gen is looking like a pretty good deal right about now Hell you could have a couple of 2-3 year old clean liters of your choice for the price of a new 10 or bmw. One for the track and one for the street 
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