stevewfl
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posted February 06, 2008 02:43 PM
ZX10 170 bone stock?
Hey where are the folks that subscribed to 170 HP bone stock for the ZX10? I think I'll post a list of names that debated me. Naw, no need. Lets see the competition/shootouts.
But man I sure don't like crow! :P
quote:
Here are the results. Extremely impressive.
Baseline - 157.4 hp, 74.05 tq
Area P Slip-On - 164.05 hp, 75.3 tq
This bike had 250 miles on it. It responded very well to the exhaust change. Plus 6.7 hp and 1.2 tq increase peak. Very strong low and mid-range increases as well. Interesting to note that the new ZX10 pulls hard all the way to the soft limiter (13000 rpm) and just starts to level off. It was almost 12 hp stronger at its peak, over the OEM muffler at the same rpm. This trait is particular to the '08 model and shows how strong the motor is with our exhaust. The Area P Slip-On tested was with our large 2.5" core. The A/F curve was within specs and no change was required. A PC3 or kit ECU may further enhance power.
Interesting note - with the Area P Slip-On installed, the '08 ZX10 makes more horsepower than the baseline stock runs of our '08 ZX14. As normal, all our runs are done using SAE settings. STD will of course be higher.
http://www.areapnolimits.com/products/Slip-On-Exhaust-Kawasaki-ZX-10R-2008.php
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'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
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stevewfl
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posted February 06, 2008 08:19 PM
hmmm no replies...everyone that posted up saying "170" must be going:
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tibofew
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posted February 06, 2008 09:32 PM
I hope to get 190+ out of a "super stock" engine, I'll be happy 
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stevewfl
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posted February 06, 2008 09:48 PM
I'm sure you can if you throw enough money at it, good luck with that!
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tibofew
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posted February 06, 2008 10:20 PM
quote:
I'm sure you can if you throw enough money at it, good luck with that!
Its ok Auto Trader is putting a sponsorship together for me with almost unlimited funds
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YZF
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posted February 06, 2008 10:40 PM
steve> you should know something about dynos.....man....
read this line again and again and again:
"STD will of course be higher."
I can make dyno, that will show 100rwhp for 08ZX10R! But on the same dyno, 081KRR will show 92rwhp!!! You get the point?
Its _the same dyno_ the same day_ with different bikes what matters!
04ZX10Rs were doing 149-164rwhp on different dynos, 08ZX10R: 155 - 170+ rwhp
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pmkin10r
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posted February 07, 2008 12:42 AM
Based on those results, the Honda won't crack 150hp.
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yelozx10r
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Green '07 zx6r
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posted February 07, 2008 01:47 AM
Look, I'm with YZF on this one. The point is not 170 rwhp... but, on the same dyno its still pulling more than the CBR.
Better brakes too.
Let's however wait and see how the bike is as a package. From from what AreaP is confirming, its clear that the ZX10 is hampered or held back by the exhaust in weight and performance. For a slip on, thats a great imrprovement.
How much is 17 pounds in kg's... hmmm, 7.7kg's. Come on, thats not even the weight of half a tank of fuel or the difference in the 2 rider's weight!!! That's not that impressive or even that much of an advantage.
I've seen the CBR on the track and I've yet to see the ZX10... but so far I wasn't impressed with the CBR.
BTW is it my imagination or is the CBR very tall. It sure looks tall
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YZF
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posted February 07, 2008 05:25 AM
+1
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stevewfl
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posted February 07, 2008 06:24 AM
quote:
Look, I'm with YZF on this one. The point is not 170 rwhp... but, on the same dyno its still pulling more than the CBR.
Better brakes too.
Let's however wait and see how the bike is as a package. From from what AreaP is confirming, its clear that the ZX10 is hampered or held back by the exhaust in weight and performance. For a slip on, thats a great imrprovement.
How much is 17 pounds in kg's... hmmm, 7.7kg's. Come on, thats not even the weight of half a tank of fuel or the difference in the 2 rider's weight!!! That's not that impressive or even that much of an advantage.
I've seen the CBR on the track and I've yet to see the ZX10... but so far I wasn't impressed with the CBR.
BTW is it my imagination or is the CBR very tall. It sure looks tall
Lets wait for a "reliable source" to report, if thats OK.
In the meantime, all the smack talk hype from "internet" sources and misinformation is obviously being slashed
____________
2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
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YZF
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posted February 07, 2008 08:04 AM
How many more facts you need steve? WHAT IS reliable source? 
How long we should wait until that, special, reliable source?
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stevewfl
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posted February 07, 2008 08:58 AM
cycle world or another reliable main stream media test.
maybe fish will do a bikeland test.
YZF, thats why I was hoping YOU would buy one, we'd get the straight scoop! :P
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'08 R1 YAMAHA
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CBR600RR track bike
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YZF
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posted February 07, 2008 10:48 AM
 Edited By: YZF on 7 Feb 2008 10:49
Cycle World? Whats that? Another mag, which this time is your favorite?
Sorry but i live in the middle of nowhere (almost), so we practicaly don't have dynos here (almost)...so until i have my bike in garage, you'll know the truth from CW long time before
But don't worry, the truth is the same everywhere 
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dubious
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posted February 07, 2008 11:00 AM
compare apples to apples, and crows to crows... LOL
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stevewfl
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posted February 07, 2008 11:14 AM
the truth is kerry's dyno. it put the shu-up on all the unrealistic 170 crap, and the true shootouts will show whether Kawi behaves on the track or not which is really all I care about is true street/track superbike performance
and I just used cycle world as an example - you're right YZF.
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'08 R1 YAMAHA
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CBR600RR track bike
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zxhoya
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posted February 07, 2008 02:22 PM
What is the average difference, in #'s, in an SAE reading and an STD reading on a dynometer? KB's SAE dyno produced ''157.4 hp, 74.05 tq'', what would that same bike read on a STD Dyno? KB?
And what kind of reading was the MCN dyno, STD or SAE?
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k bryant
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posted February 07, 2008 05:06 PM
quote:
What is the average difference, in #'s, in an SAE reading and an STD reading on a dynometer? KB's SAE dyno produced ''157.4 hp, 74.05 tq'', what would that same bike read on a STD Dyno? KB?
And what kind of reading was the MCN dyno, STD or SAE?
In my humble opinion, SAE is the only number that matters when doing R&D. Now that is only my opinion and should not discredit those who post STD numbers. As long as you are educated about the differences, then perhaps it's no big deal. My only issue is when "XYZ" company boasts about their huge gains compared to "XYZ" company and completely disregard basic set-up data. Of course we know different bikes, different days, different dynos, different operators, bla, bla. We can accept those debates. But the SAE/STD difference is a significant piece of information that should always be disclosed. So if we make comparisions, let's try to make them as realistic as possible for the consumer and not mislead them.
That being said, when we are hired to do Dyno Shoot-out Shows on the road, we do STD settings at the behest of the promoters and/or participants who simply want to see the biggest numbers for maximum enjoyment. When I do these shows, I always explain it to the audiences that "we are not here for R&D, we're here to show them the big numbers !" So....
STD readings for your viewing pleasure -
Stock baseline - 162.1 hp, 76.7 tq
Area P Slip-On - 169.3 hp, 77.7 tq
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zxhoya
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posted February 07, 2008 05:35 PM
Edited By: zxhoya on 7 Feb 2008 17:36
As usual KB, thank you for your response. I Learn so much on this forum.
I am assuming that Dyno's are capable of displaying both SAE and STD?
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stevewfl
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posted February 07, 2008 07:08 PM
Great info thanks. And ZXhoya thats an interesting question, will the dyno software do both plus I'm wondering what the mathematical formula is to convert between the two, there has to be one for the computer to calculate.
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'08 R1 YAMAHA
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k bryant
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posted February 07, 2008 11:41 PM
quote:
As usual KB, thank you for your response. I Learn so much on this forum.
I am assuming that Dyno's are capable of displaying both SAE and STD?
Welcome. We can set up a variety of variables besides SAE and/or STD. Primarily, these are the "accepted" standards in North America. But there are others such as - EEC, DIN, JIS, or UNCORRECTED that will affect the numbers.
"Smoothing" settings from 0 - 5 will also affect the numbers. Primarily, we use 3. But also up to 5 if we want to see less spikes and/or "smoother" numbers. We do the "display" perameters on screen.
But man there are just so many other factors that can affect the numbers. I've stated many times that for me personally, and I've probably got as many dyno hours in the last 30 years as anybody, I simply look for consistency in testing standards. Try to keep as many variables out of the equation as possible. So when I make a change to an engine, fueling, and/or exhaust, I can more readily rely on the new data to show what affect those particular changes did. I really stay focused only on my own testing and results. That's really all I can control.
Steve - The difference between SAE & STD is 3 or 4%. I honestly don't know if it is an absolute number that can be formulated and relied upon. I've never payed too much attention to it, since SAE is the baseline that I primarily use for R&D. I essentially feel it reflects better "real world" conditions. To make a long explanation short, the essential difference is the amount of corrected referances for STD - air/ higher pressure and cooler tempatures. Those "corrected" numbers are main reasons for the 3 - 4% differences. I've never really heard a logical reason (to me) of using STD other than to show the bigger numbers. Not to say that's good or bad. I've seen the question posed previously on other threads and have waited for it to be addressed, but it always goes unanswered. Perhaps the simple answer of "because thats what the competition uses" is the only logical answer. I don't disagree with that. If your main competition is using that setting (STD) , then perhaps it would be the "kiss of death" for them to use the other (SAE). So again, it's not really right or wrong. It would be nice if we all got on the same page for sake of the consumer. But as I said previously, as long as you know what the basic percentage of difference is, you can better formulate your decision to purchase; at least if your decision if purely based on absolute power.
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YZF
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posted February 08, 2008 05:54 AM
stevewfl> well??? are you satisfied now...?? LOL
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stevewfl
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posted February 09, 2008 11:30 AM
YUP thanks k bryant. And thanks again for the unexagerated dyno sheet that made a joke of the 170 !
Now that I have an understanding its even clearer. I've searched on the net and never had an explanation so clear.
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ZX14 gone!
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GUNNER
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posted February 09, 2008 07:18 PM
Steve my Junky old 05 is more than most can handle.. Who's worried besides you about any of this shit
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stevewfl
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posted February 09, 2008 09:03 PM
Me worried? My 600 is more than anyone I know can outride including myself on the track why would i be worried about a litre bike they're all awesome and overpowered
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'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
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zx1kr
Pro
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posted February 15, 2008 04:14 PM
quote:
Me worried? My 600 is more than anyone I know can outride including myself on the track why would i be worried about a litre bike they're all awesome and overpowered
Hey, speak for yourself Steve. I'll take that lil' girls bike you call your CBR & ride the wheels off it on the track & forget riding it on the street. I just wouldn't do it.
You know you baffle me with your remarks some times. Why is it that you have the CBR1000RR's ballsack on your chin so often if you are so indifferent about it & the other 1k bikes?
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