Y2KZX12R
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posted May 21, 2006 04:37 AM
ZX10r project...cam, head gasket, NPS radius valvejob...
Change in plans, otto65 sent the 10r head to http://www.npsracing.com
They did a radius valve job, intake porting as per the kawi 10r racing manual from kawasaki, contoured the guides, some chamber work, cut the head to bring the compression back after chamber work and a little exhaust port work.
Were using the thin head gasket.
Deck height is .008"
The bike from the factory was 106/104 but the factory spec is 104/102. It made 159 hp after mapping with those cam settings and a Sato TI pipe, and a BMC air filter, but NO ignition timing advance at all.
We put the kawi racing intake cam in at 107 and the intake valve to piston clearance is .045"
The exhaust cam is at 102. The racing manual reccomends 108/102.
Now all it needs it some ignition timing advance.
Hopefully we can dyno both my 12r and his 10r next weekend and post some results.
   
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D
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posted May 22, 2006 07:28 AM
How much to do all that and would that set-up be reliable street set up?
What was the dyno figure before all the work was done (just asking because the figure seems low so I'd like to know what kinda gain was achieved for the $).
Compression under 13.5?
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GUNNER
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posted May 22, 2006 07:38 AM
 Edited By: GUNNER on 22 May 2006 08:46
I really figured you would have advanced that intake up more than that Jim. Why didn't you if you don't mind me asking. BTW...My piston to valve at 107 was like .047 I think. So it sounds like we're getting the same numbers. That's a good thing. I didn't care for 107 on the intake. The bike was fairly gutted down low at that number. It did however pull like hell up top and beyond 
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Y2KZX12R
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posted May 22, 2006 09:08 AM
D, I think the head work was around $600 and change. The cam is $130??? head gasket $30??? My time priceless.  He's a friend so he gets a freebie. But, I do get to beat the daylights out of it when ever I want. Its got whip marks all over its ass. I hope PETA doesnt see me riding that poor little blue thing.
Gunner, the racing manual says to go with 108 and the guy that did the head told him 107.
Seeing as the clearance moves about .010" every degree we could go as low as about 105 and still keep .025"-.028" p to v clearance. But its up to him where he wants the power.
If it was my bike i'd set the p to v at .028" and call it a day. That would be about 105-105.5 i'm guessing.
Were waiting on some valve shims right now so its not locked in yet cams are still out. But he knows the trade offs here. I've gone over it with him.
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GUNNER
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posted May 22, 2006 02:12 PM
Edited By: GUNNER on 22 May 2006 15:13
They must have decked the head around .010 more than stock. At 105 mine has .040 Pto v. Just as a point of intrest my intake opens at 21 and closes at 51 @ .040 lift to achieve 105. It would be interesting to see where you guys end up. I also have my valve lash at .006 to tight .007 intake and .007 to tight.008 EX. OH! and it don't quieten this noisy bitch down one bit.
Did they put springs in or use stock springs? And what range are the shims falling into? I'm curious if they sunk the valves any during the valve job & if they did if they tipped the valve stems to get the shim range back close to stock. I know I'm being noisy 
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Y2KZX12R
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posted May 22, 2006 02:51 PM
Were using stock springs. The racing manual says there fine for this cam so....? were waiting on 4 shims. Some are tight and some loose... were able to move some around but had to get a few.
I didnt write down the shims on a chart like I usually do before we sent out the head.
So I dont know if they changed any shims to set the valve lash to spec. But the clearances wernt all in spec so I dont think they did any shimming. Cant say for sure thou.
EX 182 182 182 185 185 182 182 183
IN 183 173 180 180 173 180 180 182
EX 5.75 8 8 8 9.75 10 10 7
IN 7.5 7 6 7 8 8 7 6
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Y2KZX12R
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posted May 22, 2006 03:01 PM
I didnt cc the chambers or ports either so i'm flying blind on this one. if this was a winter project and we had more time I would have cc'd everything to see just what NPS actually did.
I know otto65 sent them copyies of the race manual pages pertaining to porting and chamber work so???? But seeing as how i didnt do this head i cant say exactly what NPS actually did as far as material removal mid port. Otto65 said NPS wanted the deck height. so I'm hoping they did the math correct and cut the head accordingly to the chamber work...
I dont like not having total control over an engine build like this but otto65 is willing to trust thier recomendations. They claim they have done "a lot" of zx10r's so....? We'll have to wait and see how mutch butter this little engine can churn.
He's hoping on 170. I didnt have the head on the flow bench myself so its hard for me to make a strong guess but 170 doesnt sound unreasonable at all.
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1969ca
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posted May 23, 2006 01:11 PM
is this good on drag bikes also i mean set it up for top end the parts seem cheap to get the extra hp"s i was also 158 to 159 on the dyno pump gas and im in az if that make a defrance
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Y2KZX12R
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posted May 23, 2006 01:22 PM
Drag racing...... Lets see what it does on the dyno. I'm wondering what the midrange will be like.
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CrotchRocket
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posted May 23, 2006 07:32 PM
Sounds good Jim...What DragStrip are you guys going to test the 10 at???
I bet you get a couple more than 170...
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Y2KZX12R
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posted May 24, 2006 02:00 AM
Rick, I dont know if he is going to drag race it. Its just a street bike, but he might.
I ment to say in the above post that I dont know how well it will be in the midrange for coming out of the hole for drag racing.... sorry.
But if he does, LV in NY is closest to us.
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CrotchRocket
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posted May 24, 2006 03:44 PM
ok, so your setting it up for road riding...
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Y2KZX12R
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posted May 24, 2006 07:11 PM
Yea he just did his suspension all up. Its all really nice roads around here. double yellow twisties all over. You know, youve been up 7 in ct no?
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GUNNER
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posted May 24, 2006 07:26 PM
He aint going to like 107 on that intake though unless he spins the mill hard all the time.
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Y2KZX12R
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posted May 25, 2006 02:28 AM
I'll tell him that you tried it and didnt like it. He does ride it hard all the time thou. But 106 is what i'm steering him to.
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GUNNER
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posted May 25, 2006 06:49 AM
Edited By: GUNNER on 25 May 2006 07:51
I'm either going to get rid of the 10 in favor of a 14 or put a 3MM kit in the 10 and spank the 14's. If I go with the pistons I'll for sure use 107 or possibly 108 like Kawasaki recommends. It will need the power moved up top with the extra steam down low that the bore will add. Getting a 10 to pump near 195Hp and weigh over a 100 less would be just about enough to handle those pesky 14's I would think. But once the after market sends some extra steam the 14's way look out! Decisions, Decisions It would be fun for awhile
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Y2KZX12R
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posted May 25, 2006 07:19 AM
Yea that will make a fun ride.
Otto65 wants to go deep into the engine this winter. Big bore, stroke and cams maybe. We'll see how much power his target is and go from there, but in any case, its going to get interesting.
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Y2KZX12R
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posted May 29, 2006 04:49 PM
Edited By: Y2KZX12R on 29 May 2006 17:53
Otto65 has about 2-300 miles on it now. I didnt ride it yet but he thinks its got more topend now but lost some midrange. I kinda figured it would loose some midrange.
I'm wondering if we modified the valve in the stock pipe to fit the sato, or even just made a new butterfly one and in either case controlled it by the factory motor box. The harley guys put manual butterflys on thier hogs and pick up nice power midrange and lowend.
Then we would need a way to change the operation of the motor vs the tps and rpm from the factory ecu.
Maybe if the ECUs are actually cracked then we can change this. That would be sweet.
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GUNNER
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posted May 29, 2006 05:03 PM
Jim, the factory race ECU for the 10R will allow you to change the valve operation. It's a costly unit though. I would get one if I could find someone that knows anything about the software it uses. As a side note I was speaking with a roadrace guy just yesterday and he says that even the factory Kawasaki team uses a PCIII for fuel changes, BUT! they use the race ECU for igition/ and rev control changes .
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1969ca
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posted May 29, 2006 06:01 PM
ive got a q's when you guys changed to the race cam on the intake did you swap the intake over to the ex side or leave the stock on in or has any one done that im looking to do the cam change and the head gasket valve job clean up of the head im going to be runnig a 40 wet kit on the bike also and still going to ride it on the street my lock up clucth should be in this week
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GUNNER
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posted May 29, 2006 06:14 PM
You leave the stock EX cam and only swap the intake with the kit intake. If I was spraying N20 I think I would leave the compression alone, BUT that's just me.
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Y2KZX12R
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posted May 30, 2006 01:51 AM
Edited By: Y2KZX12R on 30 May 2006 02:53
Thats interesting gunner, i'll tell him but I doubt he'll go for that big $$$ ECU.
Same here... stock exhaust cam. I havent seen anyone use the stock intake cam on the exhaust with this race intake cam. but for nitrous it might work well.
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1969ca
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posted May 30, 2006 09:47 AM
do you guys have any numbers of what you have picked up on hp i spin it up pretty high 9 on the line and shift it at 13500 around there
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Y2KZX12R
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posted May 30, 2006 09:54 AM
Hopefully this weekend the 1375 and the 10r will go on the dyno.
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Y2KZX12R
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Y2KZX12R
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posted June 01, 2006 03:17 AM
Nope, its gonna rain sat again... WTF
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