swainic
Novice Class
Posts: 57
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posted May 01, 2006 08:24 PM
AMA Superbikes - No Contest for Cheaters
I was at Fontana at the weekend standing right on the exit of one of the infield turns. It was blatently obvious that the only reason the Suzukis were up front was because of their traction control. You could hear the ignition cutting out as they accelerated away in a really unfair fashion. All the rest just seemed to be struggling with grip and a mile behind. Doug Chandler i'm sure is faster than that.
My point here is that there is no way any privateer would have a chance at getting anywhere close to a factory bike with the pathetic AMA controlling the rule book. Last I heard there wasn't a traction control system offered as standard factory equiment on any streetbike yet, but how does Suzuki get away with it?? Maybe the AMA scrutineers need to sit on a corner of any race track and hear these things go by. Or are their eyes and ears turned the other way? This, like the Formula Extreme rubbish is ruining road racing in this country.
With the AMA's recent history of messing things up (Ricky Carmicheal - lets give his points back. Hold on, that's a Suzuki as well) and most of their staff getting fired or making a run for it, the time seems pretty ripe for a break away series with real rules that give everyone a chance.
  
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Ninjaman12R
Needs a job
as a Deal's Gap tour guide.
Posts: 4767
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posted May 02, 2006 04:33 AM
Not to jump in a shark tank er nothin', but I agree that you could hear the bikes cutting out. Even on TV, same deal at Barber too. I dunno, but it just seems to me that if that was the case all the other riders would definitely protest the Suzukis.
Interesting though as it has always been rumored that Mladin uses TC.
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franz131
Expert Class
Posts: 341
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posted May 02, 2006 06:00 AM
Surprise - the factories don't want a privateer to win, ever.
We had a good set of rules in Canada that really allowed privateers to build competitive bikes. We used a dyno and scales (350lbs/115hp for 600, 360/170 for SB). Well doesn't a privater team go and win both #1 plates on a Suzuki in SB and a Honda in 600SS (Diablo racing - the paintball maker).
Their reward?
1. Suzuki signs their SB rider to the factory team and cuts Diablo off from any further support.
2. Honda also refuses to supply them and leaves Steve Crevier without a job after giving them their only championship in the last 3 years.
The result?
Diablo racing closes their operation. This is a very high profile company with an owner that is a motorcycle racing enthusiast. Our motorcycle manufacturers did all they could to prevent him from spending his sizeable advertising budget on racing. Excellent!
If factories are involved, there's never going to be a level playing field or a hope for privateers.
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fish_antlers
Administrator
The Truth is Out There
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posted May 02, 2006 06:12 AM
and that's the way it is!
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What business is it of yours where I'm from, Friendo?
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D
Needs a job
Posts: 3365
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posted May 02, 2006 10:27 AM
I had heard the same ignition kill noises (easy ta tell with surround sound too) and wondered bout that.
Is this trickle down from MotoGp?
Sumthin already programmed into the factory ECU's that only the factory can access?
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swainic
Novice Class
Posts: 57
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posted May 02, 2006 07:38 PM
I doubt it's already in their stock ECU's, and you are right, it's definately Moto GP technology at work. The machine would need to have a rear wheel sensor so that the ECU could detect the first signs of wheelspin. Interestingly the corner I was standing was where Mladin almost high sided and it seemed like on that particular occasion his system glitched and almost tipped him off. He's so used to relying on the system and just wringing the throttle that it suddenly let him down. Maybe that's why he lost the competetive edge over his team mate ( who has suddenly jumped to the top of the charts rather mysteriously over everyone else). Mladin's machine was definately popping and banging more than Spies' bike or Yates's.
Unfortunately for Suzuki they are making it look too obvious that they have an advantage and something will have to change to get them back in line pretty soon.
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bovinespongiformencephalo
Pro
variant Kreutzfeldt-Jakob
Posts: 1060
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posted May 02, 2006 08:33 PM
You girls sound like you need some Vagisil. Seriously. No, seriously.
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franz131
Expert Class
Posts: 341
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posted May 03, 2006 08:16 AM
quote:
Unfortunately for Suzuki they are making it look too obvious that they have an advantage and something will have to change to get them back in line pretty soon.
Remember in '03 when Suzuki had a similar advantage with their twin injector throttle bodies. 'Not only was it an advantage to Suzuki, they refused to supply the software to privateer teams that could afford to buy the parts (Attack). Fortunately the AMA corrected it in '04 by requiring the same # of injectors as the production bike.
Just another example of how bad Suzuki wants to win AMA races, seemingly at any cost.
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zx12adam
Member
Posts: 878
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posted May 03, 2006 09:41 AM
I remember that Franz, acting like Honda over there at Suzuki 
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lurking
Novice Class
Posts: 34
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posted May 16, 2006 06:50 AM
AMA rules state that no device is allowed that's sole purpose is traction control. This means that traction control software built into a device with another prupose (ECU, speed sensor, RPM sensor) is perfectly legal. Although I think AMA could do a better job of keeping the competition closer, Yosh is simply doing a better job of exploiting the existing rules. (for now) You can be sure that all of the other OEM's are fine tuning their own TC systems.
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fish_antlers
Administrator
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posted May 16, 2006 09:24 PM
Sounds like Kawi fans are crying the fuckin boo-hoos cuz their traction control program aint up and running yet.
I'll tell ya one thing... ya better do more than puke in your helmet if yer gonna win a race 
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What business is it of yours where I'm from, Friendo?
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swainic
Novice Class
Posts: 57
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posted May 17, 2006 08:01 AM
Second isn't bad even with the puke especially if the Fish is behind you.
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fish_antlers
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posted May 17, 2006 08:18 AM
 Edited By: fish_antlers on 17 May 2006 09:18
DNF and DNS dont count.
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What business is it of yours where I'm from, Friendo?
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fastestbusaaround
Needs a life
I eat Fish...
Posts: 7889
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posted May 17, 2006 04:52 PM
quote:
Surprise - the factories don't want a privateer to win, ever.
We had a good set of rules in Canada that really allowed privateers to build competitive bikes. We used a dyno and scales (350lbs/115hp for 600, 360/170 for SB). Well doesn't a privater team go and win both #1 plates on a Suzuki in SB and a Honda in 600SS (Diablo racing - the paintball maker).
Their reward?
1. Suzuki signs their SB rider to the factory team and cuts Diablo off from any further support.
2. Honda also refuses to supply them and leaves Steve Crevier without a job after giving them their only championship in the last 3 years.
The result?
Diablo racing closes their operation. This is a very high profile company with an owner that is a motorcycle racing enthusiast. Our motorcycle manufacturers did all they could to prevent him from spending his sizeable advertising budget on racing. Excellent!
If factories are involved, there's never going to be a level playing field or a hope for privateers.
Thought he only closed the storefont because Honda pulled the line...you mean he's out of racing now too?
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FYYFF!!!
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franz131
Expert Class
Posts: 341
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posted May 18, 2006 04:59 AM
Unfortunately, they have completely stopped racing.
http://www.cdnsuperbike.com/news/06/042506.shtml
I guess if no one steps up to buy the assets they might decide to come back in the future.
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fish_antlers
Administrator
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posted May 18, 2006 07:26 AM
ya... but that's in Canada and nobody cares about Canada.
BTW, you have bikes there?
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What business is it of yours where I'm from, Friendo?
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franz131
Expert Class
Posts: 341
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posted May 18, 2006 11:17 AM
quote:
BTW, you have bikes there?
No, just the internet and American TV.
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bovinespongiformencephalo
Pro
variant Kreutzfeldt-Jakob
Posts: 1060
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posted May 18, 2006 12:31 PM
They have internet in Canada? Since when?
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franz131
Expert Class
Posts: 341
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posted May 18, 2006 05:49 PM
Right after the election - it was one of the campaign promises.
Steven Harper - "I promise to bring the internet and American TV to every Canadian household" (repeated in french with a brutal english accent)
He goes to Washington to meet with GWB and voila - we have the internet.
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fastestbusaaround
Needs a life
I eat Fish...
Posts: 7889
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posted May 18, 2006 07:43 PM
quote:
ya... but that's in Canada and nobody cares about Canada.
BTW, you have bikes there?
BC not part of Canada no more Fish?
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FYYFF!!!
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fish_antlers
Administrator
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posted May 19, 2006 06:47 AM
oh.... so NOW you suddenly recognize the Western Provinces as part of the country 
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zx12adam
Member
Posts: 878
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posted May 20, 2006 01:38 PM
More on the trac control...
http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2006/May/060520d.htm
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zxhoya
Zone Head
Posts: 631
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posted May 20, 2006 03:42 PM
http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2006/May/060520d.htm
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zxhoya
Zone Head
Posts: 631
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posted May 20, 2006 03:49 PM
Edited By: zxhoya on 20 May 2006 16:50
Very interesting indeed. How soon before traction control makes it to the street bikes?
If Troy Corser's Suzuki has traction control then you know Matt Mladin & Ben Spies bikes have it.
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''The angle of my dangle is inversely proportional to the heat of my meat'' Will Ferrell
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jimzx9r
Expert Class
Posts: 451
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posted May 21, 2006 03:14 PM
Damn...anyone watch the race today? You could easily hear the traction control when they were ripping around the turns. Definitely weird shit...then "something" happened to Mat Mladin at the very end of the race and his bike was all over the place.
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